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Parking ticketing Limited - now sent to PCS parking collection Services

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On 18/04/2016 I received a PCN from Parking ticketing limited whilst parked in a private car park. The notice was issued on the grounds that I did not have a valid permit to park in the car park. I appealed the PCN on the grounds that:

 

1) I had a visitor permit issued to me at the barrier (entrance to the car-park), by their person operating the barrier.

2) I also cited that the PCN contained incorrect details of the vehicle ie the stated colour of vehicle was WRONG which rendered the PCN invalid.

3) The amount of the fine £60 was excessive.

 

They rejected my appeal saying that a landmark case on 4th Sept 2015 was handed down in favour of parking operators,

 

I missed date for a POPLA appeal (due to serious family illness issues) and then received a letter demanding £100

- I wrote to them again citing that I had a visitor permit and invalid information on the PCN.

 

I then received a letter from PCS (Parking Collection Services on behalf of Parking ticketing Limited) demanding £120

- they stated on the back of their letter that I could appeal the (now £120) charge if I did not believe I should have received it and that they could cancel the ticket if they upheld my appeal.

 

I explained the situation over again to them explaining that Parking ticketing Ltd had refused to engage with me again and had not answered any of my grounds for appeal.

 

PCS rejected my appeal to them, and furthermore said that I could not appeal against the £120 fine levied by them as I had missed my original date of appeal to POPLA when I wrote to Parking ticketing Ltd back in April

 

- they did not issue a reference number for me to appeal to POPLA against their £120 fine even though it stated on the back of their fine that if they rejected my appeal they would issue me with a POPLA reference.

 

my question and need for advice now is

have I got to pay this £120 to Parking Collection Services?

 

They have now given me until 28/07/2016 to pay £120 to them,

 

I did not think this thing would go the distance,

how can I fight these people now?

please someone give me some advice

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Ignore the case they cite. It has no bearing or relevanc eon your situation. Sadly many PPC's dont care at all, and just put this as a default part of their reply hoping you wont challenge it.

 

It is also NOT a fine and never will be. I dont know why you are so worried. Theres nothing they can do to you


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

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Hi and welcome to CAG.

 

First of all, ignore any talk of the Beavis judgement. This applied to one particular car park and would not likely affect other car parks.

 

You say you had a permit. Can you prove it?

 

PCS are a trading name of Debt Recovery Plus (DR+) so you can safely ignore them.

 

PTL can take action if they choose but in the last 7 months, they have taken a total of 7 cases to court. Whether these cases are won or lost, we have no idea.

 

The only time to be concerned is if a Letter Before Claim/Action or a court claim arrives.

 

If you can, get some pictures of the signage at the car park then post them here in pdf format.


If you are asked to deal with any matter via private message, PLEASE report it.

Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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Well, as you can now see wanting to have closure of these matters

do exactly the opposite so if you get another "ticket" in this manner

 

you would be wise to do nothing until you have taken advice first as most parking companies cannot get the procedures right and thus negate any claim.

 

As you appealed this as the driver they can now ignore your appeals knowing that the law does not protect you.

 

Having said that, it them all boils down to contract law and despite what they say if you had a permit then any claim around the use of this is spurious as the operator had the opportunity to tell you what other conditions applied to parking when they hand this to you. they cant just make things up afterwards.

 

You can ignore them for the moment as they arent going to admit they are a bunch of rogues and chancers but they are wrong in what they say about the landmark case as already stated and also about the appeals process as they havent followed the rules in this regard so they wont want to have that questioned too deeply..

 

The debt collection people are in fact the same mob using a different crayon so you can ignore them as they dont have any legal interest in this matter.

 

Keep yopur paperwork safe and let us know if you get any more begging letters from anyone and we will advise of what to do then (if anything)

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just remember its not a fine

its a speculative invoice

and

any DCA that pokes their head out can be totally ignored

they are not BAILIFFS

and have no such legal powers


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Thank you all for taking the time to reply to my post

- a lot of your replies seem to have the same consensus of opinion.

 

I will go to the car park again and take pictures of the signage and post it as a pdf (as suggested).

 

I also agree with "ericsbrother" saying that they had the opportunity when they gave me the visitors permit to tell me about other parking conditions applied in the car park

- not just suddenly come up with something else as and when it suited them,

I also mentioned this in my letter to them - they totally ignored me .

 

I still have the visitors permit and am fast creating a folder of all the correspondence relating to this,

my bad or their's as I tend to be a bit compulsive when it comes to keeping records.

I will be posting a photo of the signage as soon as I can return to the car park.

Edited by Chiketa

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I'm glad you kept the permit. No matter what they try next, they cannot state you parked without a permit.

 

If by chance there were two areas in the car park with different signage, for example, you were given a permit to park in a certain area and you parked in the other area, the signs will put that to rest.

If only more people kept things like permits, paid for parking stickers and the like, companies like this would soon go bust.


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Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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I have been back to the car-park and talked to some of the companies and people operating the car park - I have also taken some pictures of the parking bay and the signage.

 

PTL - started operating in this car park from what I can gather, between 6 - 12mnths ago. Alliance parking also operate the car park (my visitors parking permit was issued by alliance parking). From what I can gather PTL comes in through the back gate (automatic barrier) and tickets cars parked in the visitors bay saying that they do not have a valid permit if.......they deem them to be parked without a valid PTL. According to them my car was 15 seconds over the limit. I have uploaded the pictures (correctly I hope), of the marked bays that I am allowed to park in using my visitors parking permit and the pictures of the signage from PTL ltd.

 

Wow - learning a lot about coverting files from jpg to pdf - the Jpg of the visitors permit is not converting today but I will continue to try and upload that later, as I just wanted to post these pictures of the car park. All other bays in this car park are numbered and assigned to the various companies, I have spoken to the company I visit and they are saying that even some of the directors have received PCNs - seems to be a general atmosphere of fear amongst them!!!!

IMAG0397.pdf

IMAG0401.pdf

IMAG0400.pdf

IMAG0395.pdf

IMAG0398.pdf

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Now I am confused!

This is ONE car park?

This car park is run by two separate companies?

You say they got you for parking without a permit?

You then say you were 15 seconds over the limit!

 

If PTL firstly said you had no valid permit and are now saying you were 15 seconds over the limit, then they are out of luck. There must be a clear reason for the ticket.

 

15 seconds over the time limit is no grounds to issue as the BPA are stating that people are given a ten minute grace period


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the max stay signs arent part of the contractual conditions as they are not on the sign at the entrance to the car park.

 

This means that they cant claim that you have breached the contract by parking for more than 2 hours.

 

You need to make sure that your colleaguse arent encouraging these bandits by paying them money they arent entitled to.

 

I would also bet that there is no contract between the claiming company and the landowner but rather they ahve signed up with an agent or management co, which makes their contract worthless

 

. Also, as you have a permit scheme there is a consideration between yourself and the landowner which is superior to there scribbles.

this also allows you to individually negotiate your terms so the parking co will never know what these terms are unless it asks the landowner.

You arent obliged to tell them, let them lose a fortune finding out for themselves.

 

The real problem of all of these private parking arrangements is that once a compnay has been proved to be dishonest they are still allowed to carry on as they please where it should be that if they falsely issue a ticket they have to show that any other they have issued prior to and after that event is valid or they face prosecution for fraud.

 

This will never happen though because no-one wants toend the money making schemes of people like PE who are owned by the Govt's biggest outsourcing company, who also deal with the payroll of many councils so that stops them getting involved.

 

Like the banks, they are too big to fail ( well, at least if they are aloowed to a great numver of senior members of the establishment wilol suffer humiliation so pressure will be brought to bear on anyone trying to take them on.

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This parking situation is confusing to say the least.

I could not get my head around it,

 

the visitors parking permit (which I was given on entry to the car park states that I should only park in the bays marked "Max 2 HRS"),

 

Oh I forgot to mention we also have to sign a book which says who we are visiting on the site BEFORE we are given the visitors permit.

 

What I could not understand is why PTL then said that I did not have a valid permit for parking there.

 

This is cut from their letter to me when they rejected my appeal:

 

"We have considered your reason for appeal but unfortunately the operative has to see clearly a valid permit in the windscreen when inspecting

 

. This may include a location number, vehicle registration number, expiry date, security features.

 

By seeing the permit in the windscreen the warden can confirm that the vehicle is entitled parking at the location.

 

We appreciate that you are a holder of a Visitors permit with an expiry time to which you had over spent by 1o mins looking at the warden’s photographs.

We also like to advise that 10 minutes’ grace period given is actually for Pay & Display Sites"

 

They then went on to say about the Landmark judgement of 4th November 2015. still trying to upload the visitors permit...

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lets take the last bit first.

 

The landmark judgement said that a parking co doesnt have to justify its charges

as its true expenditure when certain other conditions are met

and they included VERY clear signage of what is allowed and what isnt

also the parking co paid the landowner a considerable amount to be there.

 

this wont apply to your case

but they hope that you cannot tell Stork from butter

let alone a contractual condition from a breach of contract.

 

They are a bunch of wazzocks

so you can ignore them

or write back and tell them that there has been no breach of contract so they can get stuffed..

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They must have a desk solely dealing with 'whatever rules they can make up for the day'

 

I would rather than say no breach, just a simple statement that you will no longer enter any further correspondence with them but any legal action they may take will be fully defended and a counterclaim made for costs due to vexatious litigation.


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Hello, just a quick update on my situation with Parking Ticketing Ltd.

 

 

I am now ignoring them for the time been and waiting for their next move.

 

 

I was supposed to pay Parking Collection on the 28th July 2016,

it is now 10 days later and I have not had any reaction to my non-payment yet....

 

 

.....I have not been back to the carpark since last week,

 

 

but will be returning soon,

 

 

as I do use one of the companies in that complex.

Edited by Chiketa

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Hello Again,

 

 

This weekend I received a letter from another collection Agency (please see attached scan).

 

 

They seemed to have taken over from PCS and are giving me until Bank Holiday Monday to pay the new amount of £149.00

or they will advise Parking Ticketing Ltd to take me to court.

 

It seems that every time a new agency takes over they slap another £20 onto the amount.

Now it is 'Debt Recovery' will this affect my credit rating?

 

Any advice on how I should proceed,

do I open a dialogue with these people?

 

 

if so any pointers on how I should approach it?

 

 

Has anybody had a similar thing happen to them

and is it common for them to hand things on from one Agency to another?

16.jpg

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Hello there.

 

DR+ usually appear towards the end of a parking issue, I doubt very much if you have anything to worry about. They can advise all they like, it doesn't mean Parking Ticketing are going to take this to court.

 

Definitely don't open a dialogue until the experts have commented. :)

 

HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Ah, good old DR+. The parking companies pet poodle.

 

DR can recommend anything they like. They could just as easily, "We recommend the company removes the first born child." That's all it is, a recommendation! Other than that, DR+ can do nothing.

 

You were parked in a bay with a permit with a alleged overstay of 15 second. I cannot see any judge in the land find against you should PTL try it on. Your permit stated to park in the 2 hour bay which you did therefore I cannot see any claim.

 

I would love to see this in front of a judge who would likely rip PTL a new one :madgrin:


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I've taken the attachment down as it shows ref numbers

 

 

dx


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only an unsatisfied CCJ can affect your credit rating. These dca's have no powers to do anything more than send out letters. if they turn up on your doorstep you may use necessary force to eject them from your property so they dont actually do that, they dont get paid per bruise!

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thank you for your replies - and sorry my reply is so late in the evening, I was working very late tonight and just sat down at my home computer.

 

So very helpful indeed and I had a really good belly laugh at some of the posts (although there was serious contents written into them).

 

Well I'm glad I don't have to explain the whole thing to yet another agent of PTL., I suppose that they use every threat they can to frighten people into parting with hard earned money. Thank you for taking down the my letter, I did try to take out the info which I thought was non-relevant but did not think about the ref. numbers.

 

I will endeavour to keep the forum informed of any other developments!!

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Glad cag helped


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

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Hi there, received this letter yesterday from DRP, its entitled "Notice of intended court action" then in the second paragraph it says to prevent this case being recommended to the creditors..... they go on to urge me to make contact with them without delay etc.

 

Do you know if they are members of the BPA as they stamp their letters with the logo. They have now given me until next week!!!

Image.pdf

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Standard DR+ letter. They are members of the BPA.

 

As mentioned previously, the Beavis case will have no bearing on your case as the scenarios are different. They have also added on unlawful fees. DR+ generally do not do court but leave it to the original parking company to do so. DR+ are pretty much like debt collectors for rent.

 

They could give you until next year and it wouldn't make much difference. You had a permit. You parked correctly. They will never be able to prove a loss.


If you are asked to deal with any matter via private message, PLEASE report it.

Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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thye are "recommending". Well, I recommend that you use a fluoride toothpaste. You are not obliged to, I cant do anything about it one way or another and my client is a toothpaste manufacturer so no vested interest then is there?

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well - the Saga continues,

the last payment date for DRP has passed and they are now offering me a REDUCED PAYMENT OFFER to avoid Court action, (please see attached).

 

 

They have outlined to me that this is know as 'pre-action protocol' which they will demonstrate to the judge that they have tried to settle the matter by making this offer.

 

 

In your experience is this what they normally do before court action?

This letter reads like they really intend to take me to court?

They're even offering a short-term payment plan!!!!

 

I recently saw a programme called 'Rip off Britain' where there was a similar case to mine,

where the man had put the ticket in the windscreen and the parking firm viewed it as invalid

- after various exchanges they threatened him with the fact that it could go to court and his future creditworthiness etc. could be affected. He got scared and paid,

 

 

the programme told him it was unlikely he would get his money back even if they tried to help him as the parking company already had his money!!!

DRP-Sept2016.pdf

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