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    • Calm Down please.... there is only one way to deal with this and that is - PROPERLY. Being surrounded by 'lawyers' who deal with 'disputes', just like going to the likes of CAB, in this instance has, most probably, to date,  sadly not helping you here. Such people always project an Aura of confidence, when the truth is they don't actually have the vast successful experience of the members here in dealing with the likes BMW. there are over 350 threads here . as far i gather this is the situation, In April, a car was purchased by your son from BMW. Finance taken out to purchase it has since been paid in full, as well as full payment for an annual Insurance policy. within 6 weeks, it was discovered and confirmed in writing, via a report from a local garage, that the car indeed had numerous performance modifications undertaken. Namely being remapped and with modifications to the exhaust system. having contacted his ins co, they require a further £5k to uprate his policy, without it renders the existing insurance policy invalid, thus the car is not being driven.  again within this 6 weeks, you wrote to BMW rejecting the car (we need to see this letter please. scan it up to PDF, please read our UPLOAD guide). at first BMW were onboard, even sending their own inspector, confirming the mods etc. but in the last 9 days since said inspection, comms have now gone dead. .................. you have 2 options - 1 - allow BMW to sort the car FOC and without hassle to him, but probably within their own snails pace timeframe. 2- EVENTUALLY bring legal action - this would most probably be under contract law, not a claim under the consumer rights act . (as financially you would lose out big time) to do 2. which is not easy and rather complex to calculate the financial sum involved...... we need all the info @BankFodder has requested. of many, but one good reason for this is say for this new mot, show the old one was suspect, good bargaining chip against 2500mls usage deductions... your call but you need to do this properly or not at all...............    
    • Hi, I've been reading through many of the stories in the sub-forum and I understand the process to be to send a Letter of Claim to the EVRi - in the post and to their customer support email and to sign up for MCOL.  I have looked at the various Letters of Claim and the MCOL claim forms - particulars of claim and I have gone through all of the screens on MCOL website to put in the final details so it is ready to go after the 14 days from when I send the Letter of Claim (of course assuming that EVRi dismisses my Letter of Claim to pay me in full!).  I also see the advise is to decline any mediation particularly because I have specified the parcel contents and value to EVRi when shipping it. I have put both the Letter of Claim and the forms from the MCOL particulars of claim into a single PDF for review.  The stories in the sub-forum often indicate people shipping with EVRi but some purchase through or have involved such companies as Parcel2Go and so I wasn't sure about the statement I made in the Letter of Claim if it was totally accurate to say "I am applying my third party rights under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999"? I just wanted to confirm the correct wording.  In my case the parcel shipment was paid for on the EVRi website and sent at the Tesco EVRi Parcelshop.  On the MCOL claim form I have referenced Section 57 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 in response to EVRi customer service hiding behind their lack of ability to insure delivery of laptops and their bogus non-compensated and prohibited items as a means to avoid any responsibility for them losing such items. Thank you for taking a look to see if there are any inaccuracies or amendments to the Letter of Claim - when it is looking good I will send via email and post it to EVRi.  Having drafted the particulars of the claim on MCOL, I shall be ready to submit the claim on the MCOL site when the 14 day period has elapsed and proceed from there.   Thanks for everyone's help! Letter of claim and MCOL Particulars of Claim.pdf
    • Wow quite surprised by your response in all honesty as I can’t see where you have requested details of the car. The car is insured and that was budgeted for and paid in full, the increase of £5k is because of the modifications, which no we didn’t budget for as we didn’t plan to buy a modified car, so no that doesn’t form any part of wanting to return the car, perhaps you don’t understand the impact modifications have on insurance premiums? Thanks for your help so far but feel going the legal route probably suits us better.
    • new thread created for the court claims. please complete this twice and i'll make another thread from the 2nd PDL Claimform we need to keep them sep.  
    • Most banks do not have any customer service staff available to support those opening a new current or savings account, according to research for Investec Bank.View the full article
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 

      Many thanks 
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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.


      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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I had been with Natwest for 22 years and had a black account with the Gold Advantage Charge card.

I was advised to become a company as I would be delivering a service through several agencies.


Unfortunately, due to exceptional circumstances and include a bad personal relationship left me in debt

and I am about £8 -9k in mortgage arrears on a house I rent out and a personal overdraft that was £12k.

In 6 months that OD was cleared and both business and personal accounts were in the black.


The difficulty in meeting the mortgage department for an arrangement to be put in place

was mainly because this period was over the summer, they would meet with me after 5pm

and if I called at 4.45 they would not deal with me.



I sent in 2 income/expenditure spreadsheets but they clearly didnt see them

but I managed to set up a DD for the mortgage online and I met the deadline.


That evening all three of my accounts were closed.

I called the callcentre and they said they didnt have me on record.

I tried to log a complaint and they were too busy on the Friday

but promised they would be in touch the next day.

They never did.


As a prelude they stopped my access to online banking even though there was no way of spending money or transferring out into other accounts so it made knowing where I was financially and who had paid me and hadnt.



The worst thing is that I couldnt operate, I need supplies, sundries and I was without any money to buy food or even some milk.

I told Natwest this but they told me all my funds were transferred into the mortgage.



It took a further 3 months to work out what had happened and the cause was not offered to me by the bank whose level of investigation was looking at the screen in front of them whilst on the phone.


They hadnt cancelled the previous direct debit so every month the original arrangement would draw funds then the older previously arranged dd would be rejected. This was recorded as a default.



I tried to make it clear to them there was an arrangement in place,

it utilised a payment system set up and approved by the bank

and it was their job to find out where the money was disappearing to every month for three months instead they left it to me.


I complained about being oushed further into hardship by continued charges

I had no way of keeping track of as the online facility had been taken away four months before they closed me down,

failed to log 6 out of 8 attempts to complain and didnt care that I had not a penny for two weeks.


They tried to issue a repossesion order and I wrote in to the lawyer to say that was illegal

as the account was under dispute.



In the meantime, I asked for SAR to get all the account information and after three months all I have is mortgage account copies.


The lawyers are now calling me and I am sure its about instructing me to pay the arrears within the week

or they would issue a repossession order on the house.



They cancelled the direct debit that existed so I was conscious to keep puttting funds in every month

but trying to function without a bank account lost me more money and irretrievably lost more clients.


I am expecting a lump sum of money that will clear the arrears but the knock on effect

meant that I was late paying my suppliers and one has taken a county court judgement out against me

and bankruptcy is where I am at if I dont have some means of a reprieve.

Yes, they said that if i didnt have an arrangement in place my account woud be closed

and they talked about recovery.


Sounded to me it was going to get better!

The arrears werent as much as my overdraft which i cleared in less than 6 months

and they had said the the charge card was a different legal entity

and when I called the credit card company customer services before they closed my accounts



they said that there wasnt any money owed and that it would be fully operational

once the mortgage arrangement was in place.


That wasn't true and I also lost my 36,000 reward points as I had no online access

and frankly more serious things to worry about.



i cant really afford a litigation lawyer at the moment and have little faith in the FSA from what I am reading.


The banks replies to my complaints are to issues that weren't raised

and they have not taken notice of my plea to allow me access to funds I had to eat and drink.



I was not notified clearly that every account would be closed down

and as far as I am concerned there was an arrangement in place

that obviously isnt integrated into the RBS network as they couldn't see that the money

had been taken from the holding account and HSBC provided a fast pay reference number.


You cannot open another bank account if you have mortgage arrears is what every other bank told me

but once I called the Business Debtline they advised me to walk into a bank and ask to open an account.


Why didnt the other banks suggest this to me?

A week after submitting an application form for a Cashminder account with the coop

was i able to restart rebuiding what Natwest pulled down.

Edited by maroondevo52
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  • 2 months later...

NW admit in a response to my complaint logged 11 April 2016

that they failed to comply with my Data Protection Act 1998 Subject access requisition dated 26 January 2016.



I had no reply and sent another reminder 11 April 2016 via Ascent Legal again and hard copy to NW,

and eventually this was acknowledged by the Complaints department on the 18 April 2016

merely to state they were to investigate with an outcome to the investigation

admitting to the failure to comply arriving 25 May 2016.


Ascent Legal, knew the background behind this SAR was because as far as I was concerned

the account was in dispute over charges and the banks ignorance to the 'online arrears repayment facility'

and claimed I defaulted on my mortgage repayments



only to realise that TWO DIRECT DEBIT MANDATES were attempted from the new arrangement date of 11 October 2015.

They forgot to cancel the previous DD.



Yet they still have advised NW to proceed to repossess the property

which was the judgement made in my absence on 14 May 2016.



How is this legal firm applying the PRINCIPLES as set out by their code of conduct?


I have sent another SAR on 6 June 2016 and am sure that this time they will provide me

with the information that I have requested, within the required period

because the judgement has been made but I will request a suspension of any warrant to evict me.



I have filed an official complaint with the Office of the Information Commissioner,

as well as the Financial Services Authority.



I am suppose to complain to Ascent Legal before reporting the matter to the Law Society

for the apparent inactivity or disregard of the aforementioned obligations

and also to proceed with their action against me for the repossession of my property on 14 May 2016.



If they haven't replied to the complaints so far in explaining how they can proceed

when the account is in dispute what is behind their confidence that they are not breaking protocol?

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Hi tedd4


I have moved your thread out of NatWest and to a more appropriate forum in view of the repossession element of your thread.





We could do with some help from you.



Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

If you want advice on your Topic please PM me a link to your thread

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old and new threads merged for history




please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 4 months later...

I raised a new information rights concern regarding the Natwest who didn't initially acknowledge the SAR request,

then after six months sent me a form to officially request the information about disputed defaults

but still went ahead and obtained a court order to repossess the property.



The ICO failed to send an initial response within 30 days.

I raised my concern about the way the Natwest delayed handling my personal information request and hence unlawfully proceeded with the court order when I didnt have a chance of proving my case without the information it held.



Natwest apologised for the delay then kept sending letters and asking questions to narrow down the information that would be sent, part of which was a request for a transcript of the conversations held



yet I received a CD which nowadays hardly any company includes in their computers and it costs to get transcribed.

The Natwest said it will send me the transcript - I am still waiting. However, it was the ICO's response that amazed me,


'I understand from your correspondence that you would like us to block the NatWest from the legal proceedings they are taking against you. Unfortunately this is not something we can do.


Where an individual raises a concern about a Subject Access Request (‘SAR’), we can contact the organisation, querying their response and if any information has been withheld, why this is the case.


As such, we can contact the NatWest, querying their response to your SAR and if they have withheld any information. However this would not stop any legal proceedings and we would be unable to assist in that particular matter.


Should you want us to contact the NatWest about this particular issue, you can inform us of this and we can raise your concerns with them.


I thought there were consequences that were automatically applied to institutions that don't comply with the law?



Certainly, their lawyers ignored it and got the outcome they wanted but it seems there is an exemption.



Of course I will ask them to proceed as stated but am I missing something about what I need to do to get the enforcement of the powers and purpose of the ICO?

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I'm sorry to say – welcome to the real world!


The Information Commissioner's office is basically hopeless. They have lost sight of their role of monitoring and enforcing the human right of privacy per article 8 of the convention. They have fallen back into a kind of 0FT role of making markets work – which basically means making sure that business keeps on happening even if it means compromising the rights of individuals. They are also rather like the financial ombudsman service which seeks to implement fair outcomes – fair to both parties which basically means compromising on people's rights for the sake of business practice.


Regardless of that, I'm afraid that you are completely mistaken to expect that the information Commissioner has any power to block a legal action. You should have raised this during the court process and explained to the judge why this was significant and affected your case. You might also have wanted to sue the bank or at least counterclaim against them for their breach of your statutory rights under the Data Protection Act

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  • 6 months later...

IF I were to pursue suing the bank for breaching the data protection act and taking 10 months to honour my request

how do I go about quantifying the damages / distress I incurred as a result?


The bank namely illegally progressed the legal action action to get a repossession order knowing that the information I would need to represent my case would not be to hand and therefore the magistrate granted the order.


Sorting through the information given has taken a lot of time approx 60 hours and part of this included listening to a CD-Rom that the bank felt would be too costly to transcribe themselves. In other words, that cost was past onto me.


Obviously, the fear of having repossessed meant I had to take urgent action to settle the matter with any threats top NW Bank ceasing and not pursuing other related NW Bank issues e.g. account charges, the closure of my accounts etc.


I have had to remove the tenants from the property which has meant a loss of income and redecorate which was neither budgeted for this year nor was it planned but done so that it will attract funds that it deserves should it go to auction.


I have left out other costs such as the time taken to write the correspondence, the mailing etc but some idea as to what sort of funds I can look to reasonably ask for in damages would be gratefully received?

Edited by tedd4
title now incorrect
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That is tricky. When NatWest provided the SAR info, would the data have helped you avoid any loss or costs ? You would need to prove this breach of your rights did cause you to suffer a loss. Then once you have proved this, you can move onto calculating loss value. This would be direct losses you suffered as a result of NatWest breach, that you would not have suffered had NatWest been compliant with the law. I don't think redecoration would be valid, as that has presumably increased or maintained value of property and it could be argued that NatWests breach had no bearing on whether you redecorated or not.


So write down a list of direct losses purely due to NatWest breach and post this up. Others who are more knowledgeable might then be able to comment.

We could do with some help from you.



 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group


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I have noted that in previous cases of breach of the DAP on average an award of £750 have been made for damages. The distress caused is more difficult to quantify.




the chasing of the information and the drawn out process of the SAR took up significant amount of time.



Further impact of this REPOSSESSION ORDER meant I had to assume an eviction was imminent and therefore I had to remove the tenants in order to prepare the house for sale.



This was not planned

nor was the timing optimal given the same bank closed all the accounts;



I wish therefore to claim for:

- 3 months rental loss (£2600 pcm x3 = £7800)

- to assimilate the information and transcribe the CD-Rom (time for transcription 6 hours @ £120/hr= £700)

- this includes the the cost of additional correspondence and time spent preparing documents and seeking legal advice and time taken to chase the bank for the SAR data (3 hours @£120/hr=£360),.


Would it be regarded as reasonable by the courts?


I should add,

removing the tenants in order to prepare the house for sale the assumption being an eviction order was pending.



I was not in a position to risk them losing their home and becoming homeless.

This was not planned nor was the timing optimal given the same bank closed all the accounts.



This decision was taken unbeknown to me when or if this would occur as I was not informed by the bank that they sought to hold off the eviction until further notice.

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