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    • nothing you can do can product against the very rare judge lottery syndrome.
    • not sure why you added the blue line I've highlighted? that's no in the we gave you.   as for your question... PRAC's roboclaim computer knows when the account was taken out, after all it raised the claim and checked everything carefully first before issuing the request via northants bulk courts equally inept roboclaim computer... 
    • I've been researching in preparation of compiling my particularised defence/WS.    I'm none too happy that some judges still seem to be siding with DCAs and seemingly brushing aside anything that we have assumed to be "necessary" for DCAs to have a winning case.    Reading a recent "summary" from another poster (another thread with case similar to mine - very old, illegible application form, no default notice, reliance on their own software to prove it was ever sent) and the judgment made in favour of the DCA and even suggesting that there was no "agreement with the DCA, they simply owned the debt, not the agreement"  Makes me very nervous.    Especially if cases like this will be judged on "probability" - the probability that if I signed the original application form, then I must have taken out the credit card and racked up the alleged debt as shown in statements enclosed in their WS (and dated some ten years later).   Is it ok to post some "evidence" I've found from elsewhere?    This is in line with my fears that regardless of how hard one tries to rebut the "lack of evidence" produced by DCAs for chasing these very old "alleged" debts, it does appear to come down to the luck of what judge you get on the day and how much they can be swayed by the DCA solicitor.    A quick Google search produced the following - from one case - this related to a credit agreement - which resulted in someone being made bankrupt - that person appealed the bankruptcy order on the grounds of defective credit agreement and default notice and this was the appeal judge's decision:   The necessary formalities for the entry into the regulated consumer credit agreement (which related to the debt in issue) were not complied with; The default notice served in respect of that credit agreement was defective.   The First Ground The Appellant argued that she did not receive the terms and conditions when she entered into the credit agreement and, accordingly, section 61 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (“CCA”) had not been complied with and the agreement could not be enforced. The agreement had been entered in 1995 and, whilst it had provided a microfiche copy of the front page of the application, the Respondent had been unable to provide a copy of the terms.   Despite the terms not being produced, the District Judge had found that, in the circumstances, it was very likely that such terms existed and would have been provided to the Appellant when she entered into the Agreement. Mr Justice Mann held that this was a finding that the District Judge was entitled to make.   Further, Mr Justice Mann found that it was implicit from the District Judge’s findings that she considered that the terms and conditions not only existed but had been subscribed to by the Appellant’s signature and, consequently, the requirements of section 61 CCA were fulfilled. Mr Justice Mann held that this was also a justifiable finding which should not be interfered with on appeal.   The Second Ground The Appellant also argued that the default notice upon which the Respondent relied did not comply with the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notice) Regulations 1989 because it stated the full balance of the account rather than the total of the missed payments. The Respondent argued that, as a result of the missed payments, it was contractually entitled to the entire balance subject to the service of the appropriate notice, a requirement which was fulfilled by the default notice itself and, consequently, the sum required to remedy the breach was the entire amount.   Mr Justice Mann agreed with the Respondent and the District Judge, holding that: “If by the time the default notice is served circumstances have arisen which entitle the lender to recover not merely sums which might be regarded as arrears, by which I assume is meant accumulated minimum payments, but also the whole of the sum, then they are entitled to claim that sum, and the sum to require to remedy the breach for non-payment of that sum is the payment of the whole sum due. The bank is not confined, at that stage, to claiming merely the amount of arrears if it has an accrued contractual right to have the whole of the sum.”   Do judgments like these not mean that a lot of what you guys do on here (and for which I and many others are VERY grateful) somewhat redundant. What is happening to judges just accepting "well, the terms must have been there if you signed it" -    Feeling quite nervous now.
    • we know it wasn't done to avoid enforcement we understand completely. but that doesn't take from away the fact that it happened   you can't appeal the pcn's on the basis that 'it was not his vehicle to levy upon'. the law clearly states otherwise.          
    • here is a question for you, is yu house divided up into a retail/business area  and domestic area for business rates purposes? If not why on earth are you paying business water rates? ceertainly not for tax purposes as you can claim any legit expense without having to reclassify your home as a business premises. i would be stopping this nonsense and goping back to whatever water supplier is the domestic one for your area. there is stuff all they can do to get the £40 from you whan you do that.
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0161

Excercise 4 Less/ Harlands/ CRS **RESOLVED - Harlands told to back off**

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Hi

 

I’ve read a few posts on here but would really appreciate some advice please?

 

Around this time last year there was a fire in my apartment block and the whole thing burnt down.

 

Without going into too much detail, I lost everything, only recently getting some normality back.

 

At the time of it happening I dealt with all kinds of bills and redirecting mail etc.

The most insignificant thing was the Xercise4Less Gym membership.

 

I went into the gym, spoke to a girl on reception and explained that I had relocated miles away so need to cancel.

 

She told me not to worry and that my membership was cancelled, everything was sorted.

I never signed anything, was asked to pay anything or filled in a form she just took my details and it was as simple as that.

 

Obviously I the next place I went to was the bank to cancel the DD (amongst other things) and never heard anything

 

 

about 6 months ago when I started to get bombarded with calls from Harland’s/ CRS with requests for £80 fees

 

Eventually spoke to a manager at the E4L Leeds office and they said they would reduce it to £60 something.

Told them it was a joke and they’ve obviously been sending correspondence to a building site

and I have been incurring fees since.

 

I would have paid the £10 membership at the time if I was made aware– I even offered to pay the £10 there and then.

 

They couldn’t care less really and told me that I’d had an email with full terms and conditions so they weren’t willing to accept any responsibility. The argument continued until I eventually hung up on them.

 

Left it at that,

I haven’t heard anything until now when I received a text message from Spratt Endicott

which seems to be their new solicitor?

 

What would be the best course of action here?

 

All they have is my phone number and previous address but they haven't made any real effort to contact me

except for leaving automated voicemail and text messages.

 

Judging by the comments on here I feel it would be best to ignore the texts/ calls but don't want to land myself in hot water

 

Surely this just isn’t plausible?

 

Thanks

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all are powerless

you've offered the £9.99?

as many threads here advise?

if its been refused

tough luck on them


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

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Hi 0161 and welcome to CAG

 

I'd normally advise that you ignore the text from Spratt Endicott but you need to let them know your current address.

 

This may sound odd to you but it could save you the hassle of getting a CCJ against you that you know nothing about. If Spratts realise you're not responding to letters sent to the old address, they could use that address to issue a claim for gym fees, admin fees, court costs and interest. First you'd know about it could be when an unpaid CCJ shows up on your credit files, or you get demands at your current address after a DCA tracks you.

 

You could challenge the CCJ and maybe appeal but it's a lot of hassle that you can easily avoid. Giving them your new address means you can keep track of what Harlands, CRS, Zinc, Spratts are up to.

 

Once they have your new address, they can make all the demands they like and you can continue to ignore them if appropriate.

 

For this reason, I suggest a letter to Spratt Endicott as follows:-

 

Spratt Endicott

The Green

S Bar St

Banbury

OX16 9AB

 

Dear sir or madam,

 

I refer to a message received from you asking me to call you. This is about a gym membership with Xercise4Less at [town/city] gym.

 

Please note my new address is - [current address]

 

Please also note that I had to move home after my old home burned down last year. I explained this to Xercise4Less at the time and they accepted my cancellation without question.

 

I will not pay Harlands/CRS anything, nor will I pay you.

 

If you make any further demands, you will be reported to the SRA and other bodies as necessary.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

Send this by letter and get a free Certificate of Posting at the PO when you send it, so you have proof of postage.

 

:-)


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Thanks, very much appreciated, I'll send the letter and keep you posted.

 

what would you expect will be their next move?

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Hi 0161,

 

Not worth guessing. :wink:

 

Just let us know what their next contact is so we can suggest the appropriate response.

 

:-)


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Will do! Thanks Again

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Hello, its been a while!

 

I sent the letter and heard nothing since from Spratt Endicott however I have received a text this week whilst on holiday from Harlands...

 

Dear member, Harlands have now passed your account to a third party debt collector. To arrange a settlement figure please call us on 0113..

 

Not sure what to do next? Send Harlands a copy of the same letter?

 

Thanks again

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Ignore

A DCA Is not a bailiff


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

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Hi 0161,

 

If they were serious about taking action for this, they'd have started court proceedings already ..................

 

.............. except they don't do court, do they ??!!

 

Enjoy your hols and forget about Harlands, etc.

 

:-)


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Thanks again Slick/DX I'll keep you posted if there's any more movement.

 

Surely some authority must be checking these forums to see how these companies operate? For everyone that stands their ground there must be plenty of people that get fall for it?

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Surely some authority must be checking these forums to see how these companies operate? For everyone that stands their ground there must be plenty of people that get fall for it?

 

After the OFT won their important case against Ashbourne Management Services Ltd in 2011, I spoke to the OFT on many occasions about various gyms and their admin companies. But, when the number of Harlands/CRS cases was higher than ever, the OFT was shut down and their responsibilities have NOT been taken on properly by Trading Standards and The CMA.

 

One of the best things you can do is complain to X4Less on Twitter or Facebook asking why they continue to engage the services of Harlands who are self-serving and have no qualms about harassing gym members for many months.

 

I will contact The CMA again asking them to look at the number of cases involving Harlands/CRS and also David Lloyd gyms who insist on 3 months notice.

 

:-)


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One of the best things you can do is complain to X4Less on Twitter or Facebook asking why they continue to engage the services of Harlands who are self-serving and have no qualms about harassing gym members for many months.

 

done exactly on twitter (although I haven't used it for over a year) his and not even a reply haha :jaw:

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Well done and keep us posted.

 

:-)


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Hello again

 

Over a year later and I've now received a new letter in my new home, this time from CRS

 

They now state the balance is £207 with an added £36 for tracing me and have demanded payment within 7 days.

 

Your advice would be greatly appreciated

 

Kind Regards

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Hi 0161,

 

If Harlands/CRSs were remotely serious about taking any court action, they'd have started it a year ago.

 

They are just trying their desperate tactics again and should be ignored.

 

The good news is they've already found your new address so you don't have to notify them of it. The bad news (for Harlands/CRS) is that they'll can't charge you a penny for finding it !!

 

Keep us posted ........

 

:-)


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Hi Slick

 

Thanks for the quick reply!

 

The last time they chased me I was dealing with Spratt Endicott. This time it's CRS so wasn't sure if I should write to them inviting court action??

 

I tweeted Xcersize for less again yesterday and they've asked me to email them member.enquiries@xercise4less.co.uk

 

How would you approach this?

 

Cheers :)

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Hi 0161,

 

Yes, email X4Less saying :-

 

I think you should be embarrassed that you engage the services of Harlands/CRS who have such a bad reputation for harassing your members.

 

They add on ridiculous amounts in admin and collection fees and harass members like me for months and years. There are hundreds of similar cases currently active on the internet.

 

Are you happy to continue to allow Harlands/CRS to harass your gym members. If so, I will include you as co-defendant in any court action I take against Harlands/CRS..

 

I suggest you tell Harlands to leave me alone immediately.

 

Send this and let us know how/if they reply. You should also use Facebook and Twitter to embarrass X4Less online but do this politely - more effective !!

 

:-)


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Slick,

 

after reading your response I put together an account of what had happened and signed the email off with exactly the above.

 

After 2 year I can finally put an end to this!!

 

They've recalled the case, advised CRS to stop pursuing me for arrears and accepted the cancellation apologising for the inconvenience

 

Your help and advice is massively appreciated! So glad this is sorted, cannot thank you enough!

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Hi 0161 and I'm delighted the gym has told Harlands/CRS to leave you alone for good now !! :whoo::whoo::whoo:

 

I'll change your thread title to reflect your win. (having probs at the mo but will sort this asap)

 

If you can manage a Site Donation, it'll help us be here to support others being bullied by Harlands/CRS.

 

:-)


We could do with some help from you

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                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

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Not a problem, more than happy to donate to keep this going.

 

Thanks again!

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Thanks 0161 - Much appreciated :thumb:


We could do with some help from you

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EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

                                            Have we helped you ...?  Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Please give something if you can. We all give our time free of charge but the site has bills to pay.

 

Thanks !:-)

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