Hoist/? Claimform Santander credit card how to respond after receiving claimants documents at 12th hour!

[Cricketwidow509]

I will try to fill you in as briefly as possible!

In September I received documents from Northampton of a claim issued by Hoist Portfolio.

the particulars of claim were very vague ie no date of debt, no date of assignment etc.

I acknowledged immediately and stated intention to defend.

I sent off CCA and CPR requests in accordance with the rules.

These were disregarded and I received no response.

It was allocated to small claims and transferred to my local court.

The hearing date was set and a deadline of 25th Feb was set for returning witness statements.

At this point I had received precisely zero info from the claimant as requested,

I constructed my witness statement along the lines of

'I have no info re the debt so can't defend something I have no knowledge of',

the claimant was attempting to frustrate my efforts to defend in not disclosing any information

and disregarding my CCA request and CPR request.

I served a copy in the claimant and made sure it was with the court in time, brownie points to me

 

I've now received (after the deadline) the claimants statement, and I'm wondering what to do.

In their bundle they have the original agreement (in a different name to that on the court docs) but barely legible,

a statement of account, and issue of default.

My query comes in because on the statement of account, there are payments between July 2009 and Feb 2011

which came from a current account but we're not expressly authorised by myself.

The debt is for a credit card and I had a current account with the same bank.

So these payments were taken from my current account

(I guess under the original contract I signed for the card this was authorised)

but I didn't expressly make those payments myself.

In fact I seem to remember trying to stop the payments,

and they kept taking them without my agreement.

Do these count as acknowledgement of debt?

If these payments are disallowed,

the debt should be statue barred (date of default was 25th June 2009

and I would argue that subsequent payments were not made with my authority).

Or does it not matter, as I signed a contract therefore indicating my authority to take these payments?

If it's not statue barred what should I do,

as I'm now thinking they have me over a barrel even though their documents were late to arrive.

 

Apologies if this doesn't make sense to you all, it does in my little head!

Many thanks in advance for any advice you can offer!

Edited February 27, 2016 by honeybee13
Font size.

[dx100uk]

makes perfect sence

 

the payment MUST be made by YOU and authorised by YOU.

if they wre done under the offset rules

then as long as you can prove that,

the debt is statute barred.

 

didnt you simply file the SB defence?

or was it something other

so inviting some conjecture rather than putting them to strict proof the debt is not statue barred..?

 

can you post up your defence and ws/DQ?

[citizenB]

How were these payments obtained if not authorised by you.

 

Was it a bank account in your name or joint names

Was it a Direct Debit that the bank failed to cancel on instruction

 

When is the hearing ? Are there more than 7 days whereby you can submit a further witness statement responding to the late disclosure.

 

I will try and find someone who can help

[Cricketwidow509]

I had no information as to the date of the debt, so I didn't know if it was statue barred. Their particulars of claim literally stated nothing re dates etc. I'll hop over onto the laptop and try to post the WS

[Cricketwidow509]

How were these payments obtained if not authorised by you.

 

Was it a bank account in your name or joint names

Was it a Direct Debit that the bank failed to cancel on instruction

 

When is the hearing ? Are there more than 7 days whereby you can submit a further witness statement responding to the late disclosure.

 

I will try and find someone who can help

 

I am assuming it was from my 'linked' current account, it was 2009 so details are sketchy,

but I do remember phoning and trying to get them to stop taking payments, and they still took them.

 

 

The hearing is 7th March.

I've also had another look over the original credi agreement they've sent

and it's not dated, nor has it got their signature on, could that be relevant?

[citizenB]

You say the date of Default was June 2009 but that there were payments made (not authorised by you) from July 2009 until February 2011.

 

If the account was defaulted in June 2009 was this simply the date of hte Default Notice or is this the date they started marking your credit files as defaulted ?

 

Perhaps a quick peek at your credit file will give you the date of default - that will help us establish if the debt might have been statute barred if those further payments had not been made.

[citizenB]

I am assuming it was from my 'linked' current account, it was 2009 so details are sketchy, but I do remember phoning and trying to get them to stop taking payments, and they still took them. The hearing is 7th March.I've also had another look over the original credi agreement they've sent and it's not dated, nor has it got their signature on, could that be relevant?

 

Aha, so money was taken from another account via offset rules ?

 

Was the debt with the same bank as you banked with ?

[tezza1234]

Aha, so money was taken from another account via offset rules ?

 

Was the debt with the same bank as you banked with ?

 

 

I believe the OP said in an earlier post they had a bank account and credit card with the same provider and this debt is re. the credit card, so yes, same bank id assume.

[Cricketwidow509]

You say the date of Default was June 2009 but that there were payments made (not authorised by you) from July 2009 until February 2011.

 

If the account was defaulted in June 2009 was this simply the date of hte Default Notice or is this the date they started marking your credit files as defaulted ?

 

Perhaps a quick peek at your credit file will give you the date of default - that will help us establish if the debt might have been statute barred if those further payments had not been made.

 

Just had a look at credit file and it lists the date of default as 29/09/2011,

although the info doesn't eactly tally as the balance is different and it states account type 'bank',

but it's the only thing of the credit report with hoist so it must be the same?

 

 

The last payment they say I made (I dispute I did so ) was 07/02/11

[Cricketwidow509]

I believe the OP said in an earlier post they had a bank account and credit card with the same provider and this debt is re. the credit card, so yes, same bank id assume.

 

Apologies, I'm trying to keep up with the replies! Yes the money was taken from a current account with the same bank, to the best of my knowledge. I certainly didn't make the payments myself.

[dx100uk]

and the bank was?

 

 

can you fill this in please so's we can see the poc that was used

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?419198-You-have-received-a-Claim-What-you-need-to-do.-**UPDATED-December-2014**

[Cricketwidow509]

and the bank was?

 

can you fill this in please so's we can see the poc that was used

 

**

 

Name of the Claimant ? Hoist Portfolio

 

Date of issue – 8th Sept

Submitted defence online 6th October

What is the claim for –

 

 

This claim is for the sum of £2199.31 in respect of monies owing pursuant to the consumer credit act 1974

under account number xxxxxxx.

The debt was legally assigned by Santander Cards Ltd to the claimant and notice has been served.

the Defendant has failed to make contractual payments under the terms of the agreement.

A default notice has been served upon the Defendant pursuant to Section 87 (1) CCA.

 

 

The Claimant claims

1. The sum of £2199.31

2. Interest pursuant to s69 of the county court act 1984 at a rate of 8 percent from the 22/08/15

to the date hereof 14 days is the sum of £6.75

3. Daily interest at a rate of £0.48

4. Costs

 

What is the value of the claim? £2391.06

Is the claim for a current account (Overdraft) or credit/loan account or mobile phone account? Credit card account

 

When did you enter into the original agreement before or after 2007? No

 

Has the claim been issued by the original creditor

or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Hoist

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Not that I recall

Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Not that I recall

Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Default sums” – at least once a year ? Not that I recall

 

Why did you cease payments?

I don't remember making repayments to this account, according to the statement of account they have sent in their witness statement, payments were made after the default notice was issued,

I believe these were taken from my linked current account at the same bank,

and I did not specifically authorise these payments

 

What was the date of your last payment? According to their statement of account, 07/02/2011, according to me June 2009

Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved?

 

Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor

and make any attempt to enter into a debt managementicon plan? No

 

 

Acknowledged 11th Sept

Sent CCA request recorded 14Sept & £1 postal order

 

Sent CPR recorded 14th Sept

[andyep]

Honest to god you people who help guys and girls out on here are real heroes ...... hats off to you Ladies and Gentleman !

[dx100uk]

in the poc does the account number have 16 digits?

i'm wondering if this has already fallen off you credit file if it is a card?

[Cricketwidow509]

in the poc does the account number have 16 digits?

i'm wondering if this has already fallen off you credit file if it is a card?

 

It has 14 digits,

and I suspect you're correct about it falling off the credit file

- there is nothing listed under credit cards,

nor under closed accounts.

[Cricketwidow509]

I may be clutching at straws, but Im trying to find holes in anything they've sent me

- the credit agreement they've sent,

which appears to be a scanned copy of the original,

has a signature from me,

but is not dated beneath the signature,

and has no signature from the creditor.

 

There is a date stamp on the first page but not the second where the signature is.

[dx100uk]

go count those numbers again

a credit card need to have 16digits

 

if its got 14 digits its the bank account

so hoist don't know what the heck they are going on about -

seen them do this before

I bet if check the number on the agreement you've got it does not match the POC

 

 

dx

[Cricketwidow509]

go count those numbers again

a credit card need to have 16digits

 

if its got 14 digits its the bank account

so hoist don't know what the heck they are going on about -

seen them do this before

I bet if check the number on the agreement you've got it does not match the POC

 

 

dx

 

In the POC it lists 14 digits, and corresponds to the 'account number' stated on the transaction summary they have provided.

 

 

On the transaction summary is also listed the 16 digit card number

(this does not appear on the POC)

[Cricketwidow509]

In the interests of full disclosure,

the final payment they list as being made to the debt was on 07/02/11.

 

 

By this time I had switched banks, having opened a new account on 26/01/11.

 

 

I have the bank statement to cover this period,

and it shows that no payment was made from this account

dispite all income showing as being paid into this new account.

 

 

Therefore the old Santander account (that they were taking the contractual/non authorised payments from (offset payments???))

was no longer being used at this time.

 

 

Sadly I no longer have any Santander bank statements,

but this lack of transaction in my only active bank account at the time

may go some way to prove that I did not manually make the payments,

but rather they were automatically retrieved from my account

without my express authorisation?

 

 

Im probably overthinking all this, as you can see I am literally trying to think of anything to put their claim into dispute here!

[dx100uk]

In the POC it lists 14 digits, and corresponds to the 'account number' stated on the transaction summary they have provided.

 

 

On the transaction summary is also listed the 16 digit card number (this does not appear on the POC)

 

 

so the 14 digits are the same as the full 16 digits of the credit card you think it is - but simply 2 are missing?

sorry but this might be important.

[Cricketwidow509]

no, the 14 digit number which is on the POC also appears on their transaction summary.

the 16 digit number on the transaction summary is different and does not appear on the POC.

[dx100uk]

well what are they claiming for then???

 

 

the poc says its for a credit card but the number appears to be for a current account

so their claim is flawed?

 

 

trying to understand what you are telling me

there are two sets of transaction summaries?

 

 

dx

[Cricketwidow509]

well what are they claiming for then???

 

 

the poc says its for a credit card but the number appears to be for a current account

so their claim is flawed?

 

 

trying to understand what you are telling me

there are two sets of transaction summaries?

 

 

dx

 

no one transaction summary, it lists 'account number' at the top as well as 'credit card number', the account number is the same as listed on the POC. sorry, I'm probably being dense, I just assumed it might be an internal account number assigned to a credit card account? or that a credit card account would have both a card number and an account number?

[dx100uk]

is this transaction summary from satans bank

or

its something that hoist have produced and its 'their' ref number they've use on the poc

which the y should not

is must be the credit card number

 

 

sorry but something smells here to me....

 

 

could you poss scan the claimform and the stuff they've sent through

and email me it if I send an email by private msg.??

 

 

also, are you saying that these came attached as exhibits to their WS?

 

 

or is it simply the reply to the CCA /CPR

in otherwords, have they submitted it to the court as well as part of their ws/dq

or

they've simply been sent to you direct?

 

 

dx

[Cricketwidow509]

is this transaction summary from satans bank

or

its something that hoist have produced and its 'their' ref number they've use on the poc

which the y should not

is must be the credit card number

 

sorry but something smells here to me....

 

could you poss scan the claimform and the stuff they've sent through

and email me it if I send an email by private msg.??

 

also, are you saying that these came attached as exhibits to their WS?

 

or is it simply the reply to the CCA /CPR

in otherwords, have they submitted it to the court as well as part of their ws/dq

or

they've simply been sent to you direct?

 

dx

 

It's submitted as an exhibit to their witness statement.

It LOOKS like a Santander transaction summary, but looking closely at the top it has the card number,

account number (from the POC) and a hoist reference, so perhaps it's been generated by hoist?

 

 

I can certainly scan all the docs and send them over for you, thank you so much for your time!