EU demands foreign docs be allowed to work in UK WITHOUT any checks on qualifications

[Conniff]

Personally I support us in being in EU, it gives ALL of us an opportunity to work within the whole of Europe,

 

So what you are saying is that 'no' Brit has ever worked inside any country in Europe until we joined this lying, cheating, money grabbing, German ruled club and if we leave, then all Brits will be kicked out of other European countries.

Edited January 4, 2016 by Andyorch
Edited

[unclebulgaria67]

The Mail comes out with stories like this on a daily basis, when put under scrutiny, often they are misleading or just downright untrue.

 

Personally I support us in being in EU, it gives ALL of us an opportunity to work within the whole of Europe, it is not a one way street, millions of Brits work abroad, my family runs a business in France, and no they were not checked if they could speak French.

 

I do worry about the state of UK democratic debate. I really cringe, when i hear people quote from newspapers, without ever considering whether the information is totally true or is only part of the story.

 

Whether you are pro or anti EU or whatever your politics are, you should treat with caution every bit of information that is realeased. Question it thoroughly to see whether it really stacks up and if it is true, whether it really makes any difference.

[andydd]

I do worry about the state of UK democratic debate. I really cringe, when i hear people quote from newspapers, without ever considering whether the information is totally true or is only part of the story.

 

Whether you are pro or anti EU or whatever your politics are, you should treat with caution every bit of information that is realeased. Question it thoroughly to see whether it really stacks up and if it is true, whether it really makes any difference.

 

Very good point, I've no doubt that some people still genuinely believe that Freddie Star ate hamsters

[unclebulgaria67]

So what you are saying is that 'no' Brit has ever worked inside any country in Europe until we joined this lying, cheating, money grabbing, German ruled club and if we leave, then all Brits will be kicked out of other European countries. What crap.

 

Some could lose residency rights or rights to access services. For example a UK state pensioner living in Spain as an EU citizen, can use local healthcare, providing they are registered with the Spanish authorities. There is an arrangement for UK government to pay Spain an annual sum for these people. If the UK left the EU, this type of arrangement might be subject to change. The Spanish could withdraw this healthcare and legally they would be entitled, as British citizens would no longer have rights as EU citizens.

 

If the UK voted out of the EU, it would take years to sort out all of the various agreements on a huge range of issues. Then there would be years of parliament having to amend legislation. Not to mention businesses having to make changes, particularly those who trade across the EU. It would be years and years of mess ahead, with plenty of arguments. The Scottish people and possiblly tbe Welsh mat decide to leave the UK, so they could apply to join the EU as independent countries.

[unclebulgaria67]

Very good point, I've no doubt that some people still genuinely believe that Freddie Star ate hamsters

 

The media only have one interest at stake, their own ! If their financial interest was going to be harmed by Brexit, they would have pictures of Farage on their frontpages, with a headline ' is this the most dangerous man in Britain ? '

 

You can just imagine the Express headline near referendum voting day. ' Britain to be hit with weeks of toxic rain from EU mainland '.

 

They manipulate the British people like Sheep and some people act like Sheep.

[san_d]

So what you are saying is that 'no' Brit has ever worked inside any country in Europe until we joined this lying, cheating, money grabbing, German ruled club and if we leave, then all Brits will be kicked out of other European countries. What crap.

So what you are saying is that if we leave we can kick all the EU migrants out but they won't kick our expats out? What manure!

[andydd]

Disappointing by some points on here, some people have been listening to the rubbish Farrage and his idiotic chums has been spouting and believe that by leaving the EU will be some sort of magic tonic that will leave everyone in the UK richer and happier.

 

Im a proud European, traveled there quite a lot, spend most of my summers mountain biking in France where there are many ex-pats working and running businesses, this is all at risk should we leave the EU, unless as san_d points out you think that the Uk can take tough sanctions against Europeans wishing to work here but for some reason Brits will be free to work in EU countries, this is wishful thinking.

 

As a consumer site we should welcome some of the positive changes introduced, capping Roaming charges is an example that springs to mind.

[Consumer dude]

Usual Daily Mail racist claptrap.

 

What have they said that is racist ?

[king12345]

Before the EU, Europeans were working here and Brits were working abroad.

Leaving the EU wouldn't mean that we won't be allowed to go abroad or let Europeans work here.

It would only mean that we won't be subject to the stupid EU ruling on internal affairs and we would save billions we now pay for the running of a pointless and failed confederation of states.

Switzerland and Norway don't seem to be doing that bad and they have a large number of EU migrants working there.

Of course they're also allowed to work and move anywhere in the EU.

[andydd]

What have they said that is racist ?

 

The Daily Mail is well known for its right wing racist agenda, surely this isnt news to you ?

[unclebulgaria67]

Before the EU, Europeans were working here and Brits were working abroad.

Leaving the EU wouldn't mean that we won't be allowed to go abroad or let Europeans work here.

It would only mean that we won't be subject to the stupid EU ruling on internal affairs and we would save billions we now pay for the running of a pointless and failed confederation of states.

Switzerland and Norway don't seem to be doing that bad and they have a large number of EU migrants working there.

Of course they're also allowed to work and move anywhere in the EU.

 

Both Norway and Switzerland have to pay in and apply many EU rules. They have small populations and have built economic success based on oil or banking. Norway has put money away from oil revenues and invested it all over the world. I think it was the PM of Norway who said that the UK would be unwise to walk away from the EU, as they would still have to do much of the same, without a seat at the EU table, where they could have influence.

 

There is no reason why the UK could not do just as well or better outside the EU. My fear is the potential risk, of a failing EU badly affecting the UK economy and the UK breaking up following EU exit. If people voted out of the EU, we could see a domino effect causing the EU to fall apart. This could severly affect the UK economy leading to a period of recession. Personally i would not vote for a risky proposition and agree with what William Hague said recently.

[andydd]

Before the EU, Europeans were working here and Brits were working abroad.

Leaving the EU wouldn't mean that we won't be allowed to go abroad or let Europeans work here.

It would only mean that we won't be subject to the stupid EU ruling on internal affairs and we would save billions we now pay for the running of a pointless and failed confederation of states.

Switzerland and Norway don't seem to be doing that bad and they have a large number of EU migrants working there.

Of course they're also allowed to work and move anywhere in the EU.

 

Bit more complicated than that, BUT the automatic right we have to accept any job within the EU wouldn't exist, it would be down to smaller individual agreements. Its questionable whether Switzerland and Norway could in anyway be compared to the UK, have you visited ?, both are absurdly expensive, even for people who live there, a lot of Switzerlands wealth is dubious to say the least, mostly in less than transparent banks that other countries are slowly getting worried about. I really dont think that we in the UK can say hey lets be like Switzerland, we are a completely different type of economy.

 

As mentioned above I dont believe the EU has stupid rulings, if you believe that then perhaps you are in the wrong forum, they have done a great deal for individual human rights and consumer laws, yes some governments such as the present Tories dont like that as they have no interest in representing the average consumer, just big companies that are happy to rip us off.

 

This myth that the EU somehow rules over us and makes our lives worse is in my opinion an absolute fallacy.

[tobyjugg2]

As mentioned above I dont believe the EU has stupid rulings,

 

if you believe that then perhaps you are in the wrong forum,

 

That seems to me to be the definition of what is wrong with this sites management, where certain people think that anyone who disagrees with their opinion should not be here.

 

 

they have done a great deal for individual human rights and consumer laws,

 

This myth that the EU somehow rules over us and makes our lives worse is in my opinion an absolute fallacy

Yes I agree the EU have done a great deal for human rights which it is unlikely any of our parties would have done without that prodding,

 

but the EU are certainly NOT faultless and an example of a very wrong approach is:

Germany weeing all over the rules, laws and security of the EU by not just allowing, but encouraging illegal migrants into europe while leaving genuine refugees in refugee camps

 

Whether Camerons stance that refugees should come via legitimate methods from refugee camps is just rhetoric delay tactics or not, what he says is the right approach, and Merkels decisions on behalf of a very opposing EU is one example of a very wrong 'edict'.

Which has put the structure and security of every nation in the EU and the EU itself at great risk.

[unclebulgaria67]

The point being made is not only Human Rights, but all of the consumer and employment rights that have come from the EU, which may not have been given by UK parliament.

 

The Tories want to opt out of the EU chapter regarding employment rights, as they think it would benefit employees and employers. It is a question of whether you believe government would legislate to protect employees, if there was not EU wide law offering protection.

[andydd]

The point being made is not only Human Rights, but all of the consumer and employment rights that have come from the EU, which may not have been given by UK parliament.

 

The Tories want to opt out of the EU chapter regarding employment rights, as they think it would benefit employees and employers. It is a question of whether you believe government would legislate to protect employees, if there was not EU wide law offering protection.

 

Yes some excellent points, we stand to lose a lot of rights/protection and yet gain what ? Its all about Tories wishing to weaken workers/consumers rights IMO.

[Sali]

 

If you break your leg or have a heart attack in any country, do you start asking for proof of medical qualifications of the Doctors and Nurses helping you, before they start any treatment.

.

 

Oh, I've been tempted. It is my understanding that a doctor must be registered by the GMC before being allowed to practise in the NHS. It seems to me that the NHS/GP practice see this (registration by the GMC) as a green light to forgo or minimise thorough pre-employment checks. Dr Ubani is a case in point. It wasn't just his language skills that were poor.

[Consumer dude]

The Daily Mail is well known for its right wing racist agenda, surely this isnt news to you ?

 

I personally don't see it..

[Sali]

And this subject (no check on foreign doctors) was already mooted some years ago by UK doctors. They are angry too.

[Conniff]

Plumbers, bricklayers and taxi drivers are allowed, so why not doctors.

[renegadeimp]

because doctors have a direct effect on health and if you live or die. The others dont. Doctors are also much more highly trained and spend upwards of 10 years in university and medical school. Brickies and plumbers can do it over the summer in night school

[san_d]

Before the EU, Europeans were working here and Brits were working abroad.

 

Well, yes and no. Yes, but you had to have either a working visa or there were bilateral agreements between states to import (usually unskilled) workforce, not that kind of crowd you really want.

 

20-30 years ago unemployment rates were very low across all Europe and it was almost automatic to get a visa. Also most women didn't work and chose to be housewives rather than to pursue a career.

 

Different times. Chalk and cheese.

[caro]

Well, yes and no. Yes, but you had to have either a working visa or there were bilateral agreements between states to import (usually unskilled) workforce, not that kind of crowd you really want.

 

20-30 years ago unemployment rates were very low across all Europe and it was almost automatic to get a visa. Also most women didn't work and chose to be housewives rather than to pursue a career.

 

Different times. Chalk and cheese.

 

I'll ignore the comments on unskilled workforce but your recollections of 20-30 years ago regarding employment and women choosing to be housewives are very different to mine!!

[unclebulgaria67]

The last 30 years has seen the biggest changes since the industrial revolution. New computer based technology is replacing human labour, at a time when human populations are rising sharply. Asia was used as a source of cheap labour, but those economies are investing in new technology, which means they don't need the same number of workers.

 

The EU is struggling, but it is mainly because of the problems with the world economy. The various governments have not worked out how globalisation works for them. The EU needs skilled migrants such as Doctors, Nurses, Engineers, Scientists, but it does not need too many unskilled migrants, who come to take jobs on minimum wage or below. How can the EU control migration, if they don't have agreed controls on all borders, particularly those bordering countries outside the EU. There also needs to be rules on skilled workers registration, to support free movement across the EU.

 

The UK cannot isolate itself from the rest of the world and even outside of the EU would have to work with countries all around the world on all of the issues including migration. Leaving the EU is not the magic solution to controlling population, as the UK actively encourages migration e.g foreign students, working visas, rights of some commonwealth citizens. It might stop some EU migration, but it might also mean some Brits cannot relocate to EU mainland.

[Conniff]

This has been said by so many in so many different ways about isolation. The UK will not go outside and isolate itself from the rest of the world. that means cutting all trade deals and ties with every other country etc etc. I've no idea where this idea keeps coming from.

 

You are suggesting that this was the poorest country in the world before we joined Europe when the exact opposite was the truth, we were one of the strongest. Yes things change, but there is no reason why enterprise cannot continue to flourish.

[king12345]

Well Said Conniff!