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Thinking of trying for a court order for SAR


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Hi

 

I wonder if anyone can advise, will try and keep it as short as possible.

 

We have sent a SAR to the NHS for my son, NHS being difficult to say the least as the consultant basically does not like us as they breached the DPA 3 times and we put in a complaint and they accepted liability.

 

We sent a SAR and we have received a letter back, basically stating we cannot have anything.

 

We requested everything held on my sons file, his school had to complete some questionnaires to which we would like to see what they have said.

 

Below is the paragraph from the letter which states we cannot have these questionnaires

 

I must advise that we will not be disclosing any information sent to DR XXXX by either XXXX School or XXX school unless the questionnaires were completed by our staff from our organisation.

 

They know the school completed them as thats why they sent them to the school in the first place.

 

Can the NHS withhold these questionnaires?

 

We also know the ED Psychologist has sent several emails to the consultant to which we have asked for copies again they have refused. Below is the paragraph.

 

XXX Health and Care trust is not the provider organisation responsible for the provision of Educational Psychology Services, this means we are unable to assist you with data.

 

All the above information we require is held on our sons medical file at the NHS.

 

Can the NHS refuse to give us this information.

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They are correct, that they cannot supply you with any data provided by a third party.

 

Check with the ICO on Monday, who should confirm this.

 

There are provisions within the Data Protection Act that allow some confidential information to be witheld. So do check with the ICO about what could be witheld. It might help you, as you seek dislosure of some information.

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They are correct, that they cannot supply you with any data provided by a third party.

 

Check with the ICO on Monday, who should confirm this.

 

There are provisions within the Data Protection Act that allow some confidential information to be witheld. So do check with the ICO about what could be witheld. It might help you, as you seek dislosure of some information.

 

I 2nd this. If its been supplied by an external 3rd party, youll needs to send a SAR request to the School.

 

We could do with some help from you.

 

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Thanks for your relies, however If a third party has emailed the consultant would we get a copy of that email or letter? the information would be regarding or son, addressed to the consultant.

 

We have asked the school for all the data regarding his behaviour, incidences, and information regarding when he was removed from the classroom, the school have said they have NO recorded information and they have nothing. Let me tell you, I wrote a diary with every single conversation all the phone calls from the school we received where they removed our son from lessons for disrupting.

 

The funny thing is the ED Psychologist has slipped up and said she has all the school information as she requested it and she has the questionnaires which the school provided as the SECO told us it took them 3 weeks to gather the information she required.

 

I have no doubt the school have the records as the Ed Psychologist slipped up by telling me, however it was verbally.

 

My sons case is very complex, but basically we were given a wrong diagnosis and their diagnosis was premeditated prior to us entering the room at the time.

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A quick question, surely if the consultant has sent questionnaires for the school to complete about our son, this is information about our son and will be held on his medical file at the NHS and would I know be entitled to the information?

 

Does it not come under Data held on the NHS regarding our son?

 

Same for 3rd parties emailing the consultant regarding our son, this is data about our son.

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How old is your son ?

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Have you tried speaking to PALS who would be the Patient Liaison Service within the hospital the Consultant operates out of ?

 

I would have thought that you would have been kept informed of any and all information required/requested in respect of your Son's treatment ?

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Have you tried speaking to PALS who would be the Patient Liaison Service within the hospital the Consultant operates out of ?

 

I would have thought that you would have been kept informed of any and all information required/requested in respect of your Son's treatment ?

 

Not spoken to PALS, not sure if they will help, I just cannot understand why they are with holding information that the consultant requested by means of questionnaires to the school, why the NHS are saying we cannot have them under the SAR, I know they are unhappy that we filed a complaint regarding their breaches of the DPA but an SAR that contains information regarding our son regardless who it is from which is being held on his file we are entitled to see under our SAR request.

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Not quite true, patients can legally access their medical records as can their legal representatives. It isn't just related to insurance and employment.

 

No.

 

The Access to Medical Reports Act 1988 relates to reports for insurance or employment purposes.

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Not quite true, patients can legally access their medical records as can their legal representatives. It isn't just related to insurance and employment.

 

I believe Scarletpimpernel is correct

1 Right of access.

 

It shall be the right of an individual to have access, in accordance with the provisions of this Act, to any medical report relating to the individual which is to be, or has been, supplied by a medical practitioner for employment purposes or insurance purposes.

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Have a read of this NHS link 'How do I access my medical records (health records)?' How do I access my medical records (health records)?

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Sorry didn't make myself clear. Everyone is entitled to access the health information held about them under the DPA 1998. I've done this on behalf of other people on numerous occasions. They can however withhold certain information if it is believed would be harmful to the data subject/patient.

 

 

QUOTE=obiter dictum;4803507]I believe Scarletpimpernel is correct

1 Right of access.

 

It shall be the right of an individual to have access, in accordance with the provisions of this Act, to any medical report relating to the individual which is to be, or has been, supplied by a medical practitioner for employment purposes or insurance purposes.

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Thanks everyone for all your replies, I have been searching around and stumbled across this link, it appears they can with hold the information

 

http://systems.hscic.gov.uk/infogov/links/dhaccessrecs.pdf

 

Have a look at page 11

 

Situations where health information may be limited or denied

20. The Data Protection (Subject Access Modification) (Health) Order 2000 enables the

data controller to limit or deny access to an individual’s health record where:

• the information released may cause serious harm to the physical or mental

health or condition of the patient, or any other person, or

• access would disclose information relating to or provided by a third person who

has not consented to that disclosure unless:

- The third party is a health professional who has compiled or contributed to the

health records or who has been involved in the care of the patient.

- The third party, who is not a health professional, gives their consent to the

disclosure of that information.

- It is reasonable to disclose without that third party’s consent.

 

I know they are being difficult, and to be honest why would NHS want to with hold a set of questionnaires

that a school have completed about our son sounds like they are hiding something same with the email correspondence from the Ed Psychologist.

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Yes I totally agree with you. The problem is they don't have to say why they are witholding info. Call me cynical but if they want to hide something they can hide behind the rules

 

What is the point of sending an SAR to anyone if they can withold information and do not have to give a reason why? it seems pointless

 

I am going to call the ICO tomorrow ad see what they say

 

There is no reason for them to withold this information other than just being difficult because we made a complaint about 3 beaches of DPA and I got it in writing saying they accepted liability.

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This link takes you to the ICO Subject Access Request Code of Practice Checklist PDF Titled 'How do I handle subject access requests - Dealing with requests from individuals for personal information':

 

https://ico.org.uk/media/for-organisations/documents/1599/subject-access-checklist.pdf

 

This ICO link is there report on dpa guidance they gave schools in 2012 may be an interesting read its a PDF document:

 

https://ico.org.uk/media/action-weve-taken/self-assessments/2790/report-dp-guidance-for-schools.pdf

Edited by stu007

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This link takes you to the ICO Subject Access Request Code of Practice Checklist PDF Titled 'How do I handle subject access requests - Dealing with requests from individuals for personal information':

 

https://ico.org.uk/media/for-organisations/documents/1599/subject-access-checklist.pdf

 

This ICO link is there report on dpa guidance they gave schools in 2012 may be an interesting read its a PDF document:

 

https://ico.org.uk/media/action-weve-taken/self-assessments/2790/report-dp-guidance-for-schools.pdf

 

 

I have seen both of those links, I will ask the schools for permission for the NHS to release, its funny as I know the school have what I want, but have said previously they do not have records on our son.

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UPDATE

 

I called the ICO this morning and the NHS regardless of who and where the information come from, as long as it is about my Son and the fact the Consultant sent the questionnaires to the school they have to give us the information

 

Benn advised (which we have done) to write back and explain that we re not happy bla bla and if they still refuse the information then the ICO will step in and get the information.

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It would be worth sending a SAR to the School, and the education authority to get a copy of what they have too, might be a useful way of comparing, if you get all, and it is clear one has been edited before being sent to you.

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

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  • 1 month later...

I sent a SAR to the NHS what will be 40 working days on Thursday. I wanted my sons records which in particular some questionnaires that his primary and secondary school have completed, I got a letter after about a week stating I could not have them, we sent a curt email back asking them on what principle of the DPA were they declining.

 

We got an email back stating they will pass that email on to the person dealing with the request, we never heard anything.

 

I called today to ask if I can make payment as the 40 days are expiring on Thursday to be told the clinician has to authorise everything that is being sent, they went on bla bla about this, and I said that I hoped that the records were going to arrive on Thursday.

 

Obviously I had to contact them today as I had heard nothing about payment, I have sent a cheque today, which obviously they will wait for it to clear so they will be in breach of the SAR.

 

My question is do I let them get away with the fact they will of failed to comply to the 40 days?

 

The fact I had not heard anything else regarding the questionnaires, they never responded to my email, do I wait and see what arrives and then if the questionnaires are not in there, then act upon it, or do I ask now before they send the records?

 

I assume had I of not contacted them today, no one would of contacted me at all and I would never of received the records at all.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

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With regards to the "payment" you mention, is this the £10 fee for the SAR?

 

This should have been sent with the original SAR request, if you didnt send the £10 fee, then you are unlikely to receive anything

 

Could you clarify this please?

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