Jump to content


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 1590 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Hi All,

 

I recently was on benefits and was getting help with our rent & council tax, after finding work and getting out of the benefit rut, we are slowly getting back to normal. However after calling the council to arragne to set up a monthly payment only to find they have place our account with JACOBS and we have to contact them now and not the council. We called the company Jacobs asking them how we can pay as my wages are now paid on the last day of each month. The bailiff stated at first he did not have the paperwork and would call me the following day ( He did not ), last night however he calling at our home and posted by hand a 24hr notice, 3 bills demanding a total of £1397.00 and they state that they have got a Liability order issued by the magistrates court to seize goods.

 

We are happy to replay the council and we have asked for the invoice relating to the amounts but so far nothing has been sent, he has informed us that he needs to call around and meet us to set up a payment plan and we must sign his paperwork, we are very unsure in letting the bailiff into our house just to set up a direct debt we think that once he is in our house they will seize goods, also iam working today and my wife is upset and thinks that they will call aorund change the lock and take goods.

 

We were thinking of setting up a replayment plan via a company Debt Line who on face look like they can deal with Jaobs has anyone used this company, can anyone help use with the isssues above

 

regards

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 67
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Contact the council, and back it up by email and letter and ask

 

When the Liability Order was issued

when was it passed to the bailiff

 

You also need to know when any council tax benefit ceased, to work out if you have been charged the correct amount, as councils have been known to get a Liability Order for a whole 12 months when only 3 was owed due to the benefit claim.

 

in the meantime start paying an affordable amount via the councils online payment system, do it regularly every week without fail to build up a repayment record.

 

Do not telephone the bailiff, unless you can record the call, as the bailiff is an accomplished cheat,,liar and bully, he cannot force entry drag you to jail, bring locksmiths, the Hammer of Thor, to gain entry to snatch your furniture or anything else at this stage.

 

Do not let him in he does not need to use your phone toilet or anything else, he wants entry for you to sign a "Walking Possession" to levy your goods, under the guise of a repayment plan

This will enable them to load fees to the account when they turn up at random times to demand payments.

park any cars a few streets away or locked in a garage if you have one, keep doors and windows closed. if you need to speak to him do it from an upstairs window or through the letterbox.

 

Try not to worry, as I am sure others will be along to advise later. If it's any consolation the cheeky bailiff I mentioned in a thread was from Jacobs

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Link to post
Share on other sites

The questions you need to ask the Council are:

1- how many Liability Orders they have against you - from your original post there appear to be 3

2 - how much each one is for

3 - what period of time each one covers

4 - how much is outstanding on each

5 - if any payments made, the date & amount of each

6 - when each LO was obtained

7 - the date each was passed for enforcement

 

PT

Please consider making a small donation to help keep this site running

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

We were thinking of setting up a replayment plan via a company Debt Line who on face look like they can deal with Jaobs has anyone used this company, can anyone help use with the isssues above

 

regards

 

Is this the proper National Debtline or one of the cowboys that use a similar name? Are they charging you?

 

I suggest you read sequenci's blogs on the subject. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/entry.php?184-Looking-for-a-Debt-Management-Plan-Please-ensure-that-you-don-t-end-up-paying-for-it.

 

What's Best for You?

 

 

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

 

Alliance & Leicester Moneyclaim issued 20/1/07 £225.50 full settlement received 29 January 2007

Smile £1,075.50 + interest Email request for payment 24/5/06 received £1,000.50 14/7/06 + £20 30/7/06

Yorkshire Bank Moneyclaim issued 21/6/06 £4,489.39 full settlement received 26 January 2007

:p

 

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi rippedoff12 this is a link to the FREE National Debtline bailiff page

 

http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/factsheet.php?page=02_bailiffs_and_council_tax

 

The bailiffs should not call today or Monday, as they are Bank Holidays, but may come on a Saturday, although it would be unlikely over a holiday weekend.

 

and as posted by caro read sequenci's blog.

 

All is not lost and try not to stress.

Bn

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Do not let him in once has has acheived peacefull entry he can break in the second time

 

Even then he would need a warrant from the court, and would have to give a date and time of his attendance to remove. Even with peaceful entry and a levy he cannot just turn up, and pretend to phone locksmiths, police the Gorgon, Thor, Odin's Wrath, or anything else, to force entry. He may turn up at random times to add various van and attending to remove fees that may well not be kosher, which may appear on any breakdown requested but no letter was left, notifying of his visit.

 

BUT if the door or window is open he can just walk in.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 year later...

Hi, All

 

Can anyone help, we have been issued a summons to attend court for non payment of council tax, which is incorrect we paid last years council tax in full, and the summons relates to an outstanding amount from 2011, during that time I was unemployed.

 

They demand payment of £490.00 now which clearly we do not have as the same time as the summons the council have sent invoices relating to housing benefit over payment ( 1 invoice £207.72 from 30/11/2009 ) & ( 1 invoice £288.46 from 28/02/2011 )

 

I have been paying the council in full every month last years bill in full and now they want more, we have had our bill for 2013 and its gone up as well.

 

Can any one help, I have got a question relating to council tax

 

Information from our bill

 

Cheshire West and Chester Council £1,135.09

Cheshire West and Chester Special Expense £8.88

Ellesmere Port Trustees £1.66

Police £136.19

Fire £60.22

 

My question is the council are claiming £1,135.09 what services are they charging for ??? for example

 

If they are charging to have our bins emptied can I refuse that service and pay for local waste company to do the service. the council have charged a lump sum and do not give breakdown of cost.

 

Quote if you wanted work done on a car you would get breakdown of prices and shop around, you would not pay a person who just states a full price. or are council a law to them selves.

 

cheers

Link to post
Share on other sites

Council tax is a 'hybrid property tax' rather than a charge for services provided - even though the amount payable is actually calculated on the financial needs of the council (they should have included a information on spending in leaflet with the annual bill or published it on their website).

 

The main legislation can be read hear http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1992/14/contents.

 

Sadly just like Income Tax or VAT, I don't know of any option of opting out of paying.

Link to post
Share on other sites

guesses as much, their was no leaflets enclosed with the new bill, just need to focus on paying their demands just don't no where to get the extra cash, I will try to set up a monthly payment to clear the bills, and the new bill for this year, regarding the summons what should we do about that issue.

 

The bill also incudes a fee of £40.00 as well, the bill was £450.00 plus fee Total £490.00, if they issues the summons in court what action can they take can a bailiff enter our home and take property

Link to post
Share on other sites

I would say that keeping on top of the current years bill is the most important thing to do, as in many cases trying to clear the arrears first just creates a vicious cycle.

 

Depending on the council, cost are either applied in full at the summons stage or in 2 lots of charges are applied once for the summons and then again for the liability hearing. The costs must be 'reasonably incurred' by the council and if you choose to attend you could challenge the level in court.

 

The bailiff can't force entry but if doors and window are open they can walk in. If you have a car they could 'levy' against it so it may be worth you moving it elsewhere if you can. If you can enter into discussions with the council early on (ideally before the court date) you may be able to negotiate a payment plan and avoid the bailiff altogether. It may be worth preparing a Income and Expenditure statement, there are free templates on the web or organisations like CAB can help.

 

Just so your aware the council can also take other action rather than sending the bailiff such as:- deductions from earnings/benefits, bankruptcy proceedings, charging order (if your an owner-occupier) or in rare circumstances committal to prison.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 4 months later...

Hi All,

 

Can anyone help, our Council have issued 3 Liability Orders relating to council tax which is outstanding. details as follows:

 

Liability Order Granted on 28/05/2013 £205.00 ( Arrears 01/04/2012 - 31/03/2012 )

Liability Order Granted on 30/04/2013 £405.00 ( Arrears 26/09/2011 - 31/03/2012 )

Liability order Granted on 30/07/2013 £1408.69 ( Current Year 01/04/2013 - 31/03/2014 )

 

The arrears was during the period that I was unemployed and on benefit, we paid all of the year 01/04/2012 - 31/03/2013 in full and have been unable to pay towards the arrears, they issued the liability order for the arrears and the current year is this correct, I understand they can apply the liability order to the arrears, but the current year ?

 

The have attached an income form and have stated we have 14 days to return the paperwork, I have made a payment online last night £100.00, and informed them of this payment only to be told they are not interested as they what the full amount repaying NOW even the current year, and if I refused they would send the file to the bailiffs.

 

Is their anything I can do to stop action on 3 liability orders, and why have the issued 3 as they are using the same council tax ref number.

 

cheers :mad2:

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi All,

 

Can anyone help, our Council have issued 3 Liability Orders relating to council tax which is outstanding. details as follows:

 

Liability Order Granted on 28/05/2013 £205.00 ( Arrears 01/04/2012 - 31/03/2012 ) - you say below you paid this in full but it appears there must have been some outstanding.

Liability Order Granted on 30/04/2013 £405.00 ( Arrears 26/09/2011 - 31/03/2012 ) - if you were unemployed did you not claim Council Tax Benefit

Liability order Granted on 30/07/2013 £1408.69 ( Current Year 01/04/2013 - 31/03/2014 ) - I assume you have not made any payments towards this years bill?

 

The arrears was during the period that I was unemployed and on benefit, we paid all of the year 01/04/2012 - 31/03/2013 in full and have been unable to pay towards the arrears, they issued the liability order for the arrears and the current year is this correct, - Yes - I understand they can apply the liability order to the arrears, but the current year ?

 

The have attached an income form and have stated we have 14 days to return the paperwork, - it is a legal requirement that you return this to them, it appears they may be looking to do an attachment of earnings - I have made a payment online last night £100.00, and informed them of this payment only to be told they are not interested as they what the full amount repaying NOW even the current year, and if I refused they would send the file to the bailiffs.

 

Is their anything I can do to stop action on 3 liability orders, and why have the issued 3 as they are using the same council tax ref number. They cover 3 different years.

 

cheers :mad2:

 

PT

Please consider making a small donation to help keep this site running

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bailiff enforcement is only a problem in two circumstances and this being if you let the bailiff into your home or alternatively, if the bailiff were able to levy upon your vehicle.

 

There is no legal obligation to allow a bailiff into your home and in fact, in your case should be AVOIDED as the fees that will be applied will add significantly to the debt.

 

Do you have a car and is this parked outside the house?

 

If you have a car how much is it worth and is it on finance?

 

Did you receive the legally required 14 day letter from the council to advise that they had obtained the Liability Orders and did you call them or make a payment proposal within the 14 days?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you still on benefits?

If so why not ask the court that dealt with it , to have a financial means hearing at the court that issued the liability orders for a financial assessment hearing to make weekly payment from your benefits at an affordable rate, not only will this be easier for you, the court can take the money owed to them from your benefits before you even get them, so you will never fall into arrears or get in such a pickle again, this way the bailiffs will not be able to add further charges and fees?

 

If you are now working and on a low income you could still do so and ask for more affordable level of payments to be made? then stick to the arrangements this way you will be better served and make the payments on time every time

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

mikeymack

 

Just so that you are aware, as the Liability Order has already been granted there is no provision for a Means Hearing. Such a hearing is normally only available in cases of court FINES. This is an entirely different regulation altogether.

 

Also, it is important for anyone reading this that they really should attend the Liability Order hearing and, at the very least....oppose the granting of costs.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I attended the unfair liability hearing and got the case adjourned, and the council were forced to reassess me (which is still wrong as they haven't taken into account me being on SSP and going onto ESA as my condition is a long-term debilitating one!

 

These liability orders should be STOPPED and the councils across the country banned from issuing them like confetti.

 

Unfortunately the Council Tax legislation was issued under a different economic climate and this dramatic change in peoples incomes has never been taken into consideration. Luckily most councils have been forced to stop increasing this unfair tax.

Link to post
Share on other sites

TT as you are aware if you receive a fine or anything from a court you can apply at any time to have a means hearing case, the order of the court can be adjusted to meet your current financial circumstances, the reason behind this is to allow you to live and pay your bills and not become destitute, I am at court everyday and often see this as a matter of course, its unusual but correct, any fine/order imposed by a court can and does get reheard and new collection rates amended. No disrespect to you TT

 

What is getting really concerning is the amount of cases now before the courts, regarding LA's and CT arrears non payment, now with cases already being heard for the "bedroom tax" only months after it became due, I feel that the LA's are in a pile of trouble now and need to get as much money in as quickly as possible, caseloads are going to increase and even more advise from this great site will increase exponentially.

Edited by mikeymack2002

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I attended the unfair liability hearing and got the case adjourned, and the council were forced to reassess me (which is still wrong as they haven't taken into account me being on SSP and going onto ESA as my condition is a long-term debilitating one!

 

These liability orders should be STOPPED and the councils across the country banned from issuing them like confetti.

 

Unfortunately the Council Tax legislation was issued under a different economic climate and this dramatic change in peoples incomes has never been taken into consideration. Luckily most councils have been forced to stop increasing this unfair tax.

 

I totally agree with you, but the councils are in such a mess now it deplorable that they seek out vulnerable/less informed people to take to court then make their life hell.

 

I was recently at my local court handing out information to the attendees regarding this out of 30 cases not one actually got into court, these people in this situation need and must seek the best help that they can, this includes the councils themselves.

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There was a lady at Croydon Magistrates Court in the reception area dealing with Council Tax, she was the one who adjourned my hearing, she was horrified when she saw the letter the council had sent stating they would not make any changes to the assessment until liability was granted - so in other words they were trying to make me pay something I was not liable for!

 

Just as well I am a seasoned CAGger and was able to head them off at the pass.... other people are not so knowledgeable (as I once was).

Link to post
Share on other sites

There was a lady at Croydon Magistrates Court in the reception area dealing with Council Tax, she was the one who adjourned my hearing, she was horrified when she saw the letter the council had sent stating they would not make any changes to the assessment until liability was granted - so in other words they were trying to make me pay something I was not liable for!

 

QUOTE]

.

Sillygirl1

 

From what you have written it would seem that you had done the right thing and approached the Magistrates Court BEFORE they had granted a Liability Order. You did exactly the right thing.

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

TT as you are aware if you receive a fine or anything from a court you can apply at any time to have a means hearing case, the order of the court can be adjusted to meet your current financial circumstances, the reason behind this is to allow you to live and pay your bills and not become destitute, I am at court everyday and often see this as a matter of course, its unusual but correct, any fine/order imposed by a court can and does get reheard and new collection rates amended.

QUOTE]

 

.

.

mikeymack2002

 

Thank you for the above info. Are you saying that in cases where a LIABILITY ORDER has been granted that the MAGISTRATE COURT's allow debtors to attend the court for a Means Enquiry Hearing as I have never before come across this.

 

Means Hearings are commonplace with criminal fines but I am very interested to hear from somebody "in court" (so to speak) that a person subject to a LIABILITY ORDER may also attend.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ideally you need to speak to the council, since they took you to court they opened the door to allow you to ask for more favourable repayment options, you were "fined by a court" they have to make it so you CAN afford to live, not be unable to live at a level where you have not got enough money to live on, so you can ask for the terms to be looked at again.

 

As with ALL court fines or orders they have the final say in the matter and its up to them to make a repayment level suitable for the money you have to live on. Say you have £100-00 per week to live on, the fine/order is £705-00 they will not take or make you pay more than you can afford to pay, ultimately its a legal debt and must be paid in full, but at a level you can afford.

 

A liability order is and as such comes under the rulings that allow the bench to make an affordable repayment scheme, if they refuse then the council that got the order can not make you pay more than you can reasonably afford to pay, this is why they push it out bailiffs as soon as possible, so they get their money faster by means of seizure of goods and chattels. Hence why bailiffs get involved soon after the case has been heard, they want their money asap without being told that they must accept a lower repayment than they want. This is why everyone that has to attend court must do so, as a face to face is much better than leaving it undefended, which is what the councils want.

Edited by mikeymack2002

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

We have now cleared 2 of the old council tax bills ( £610.00 ) this week will they send confirmation that the amounts paid have cleared 2 Liability Orders, and the only bill is the current year which also has got a Liability Order as well.

 

question they have asked for income details and employment, as we have repaid all the old bills can they demand employment information regards the current year

 

cheers

Edited by rippedoff15
Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you contacted the council to ascertain the precise amount of EACH Liability Order. This is important as otherwise you cannot accurately work out whether the fees charged are correct.

 

Once a Liability Order has been granted the debtor is under a LEGAL OBLIGATION to provide financial information to the local authority or indeed their "back office provider" if requested.

 

Unfortunately, there a a number of internet sites that constantly encourage debtors to display notices outside of their home in the mistaken belief that such a notice (removing the implied right of access) will magically make the bailiff leave the premises. Not only is this NOT the case but it is such poor advice that is leading to an unprecedented rise in the number of local authorities who are instead looking at making an Attachment of Earnings Order against the debtor.

 

However, such an order may ONLY be considered by using the information from the Financial Statement. If you are self employed an AEO cannot be applied and it is only of serious concern to anyone working for an employer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • dx100uk changed the title to CTAX Debt
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...