Welcome finance and revolving credit

[pauldb38]

Hi this is my first post to the group- My name is paul and live in york.

 

Back in 2004 i took out a home inprovement loan via safestyle uk for the sum of 2171 over a priod of 120 months

and i took out payment protectection at a cost £471.

 

Shortly after taking the loan out as i was contracting my contract wasn't renewed,

upon trying to claim againt my payment protection i was informed i wasn't covered as i was classed as self employed

(shame they never told me this when charging me £471)

 

 

i had a dispute with them as i wasn't working and wasn't covered

after months of haggleing i got them to agree to a pro-rata refund which would go onto my account to clear the arears.

I started and work shortly after and started to make full payments

since then never missed a payment and i thought my payments were up to date.

 

 

Then about 3 years ago i started to get your accounts in arrears calls

to cut a long story short the payment protection refund never appared on my account

and once again in dispute but i continued to pay.

 

 

Last september 2014 my loan should have finished but was informed i actually owed more 10 years on than my actual loan amount.

I have exhausted all ppi possibilities

they claim they don't have anything on the pro-rata refund despite me signing a form in their york office.

 

 

the FOS say as its pre 2005 theres nothing i can do,

welcome say it was sold via safstyle so they wouldn't be responsible

even though i thought i was dealing with Welcome in their office.

 

 

currently despite paying for 11 years my £2171 loan stands at £2852.77

 

 

i told the lady at welcome i had just had a stroke and couldn't deal with this at the moment.

she turned round to me and said well as long as you relise if you die the debt gets passed onto your familly.

 

 

This has really upset me i don't know what to do

Surely they cant charge me for 11 years on a 10 year loan and actually owe more money.

 

 

This loan if continues will never be paid off ?

 

 

Please if someone can help

i don't want this debt hanging over me or

if i die want it passed on to loved ones.

 

 

Apparently i have already paid 7000 on this loan.

[obiter dictum]

Was this a secured loan??

 

120 months is 10 years

 

The loan was only £2171???

 

That should have been a 5 year term max

[theoldrouge]

Hi and welcome to CAG

 

Do you have a copy of the original agreement ?

[pauldb38]

Was this a secured loan??

 

120 months is 10 years

 

The loan was only £2171???

 

That should have been a 5 year term max

 

Hi yes origionally £2171 this was for 2 doors from safestyle uk

[pauldb38]

Hi and welcome to CAG

 

Do you have a copy of the original agreement ?

 

I have a copy

i paid i think £10 for a copy of everything the company has on me,

reason why i got this is i was trying to prove i signed a form in their office allowing them to get a refund on the payment protection,

but sadly it was omitted,

 

 

the only sort of proof i have but again not good enough to satisfy them,

is i said until they sort the refund on the payment protection i wont be making a payment then in december of 2005

 

 

they have a record of me going into the office setting up a new direct debit for the full monthly payment

this was at the time i signed for the pro-rata refund but they omitted that from the report i paid for.

 

 

I was trying to prove the arrears was cleared with the refund so they should be no charges.

 

 

I'm so scared right now.

[Baz1994]

I have a copy i paid i think £10 for a copy of everything the company has on me, reaon why i got this is i was trying to prove i signed a form in there office allowing them to get a refund on the payment protection, but sadly it was omitted, the only sort of proof i have but again not good enough to satisfy them, is i said until they sort the refund on the payment protection i wont be making a payment then in december of 2005 they have a record of me going into the office setting up a new direct debit for the full monthly payment this was at the time i signed for the prorater refund but they omitted that from the report i paid for. I was trying to prove the arrears was cleared with the refund so they should be no charges. I'm so scared right now.

 

post up an edited (personal details etc omitted) copy of your agreement as dx suggested.

 

Sorry was it a secured loan ?

 

was the agreement regulated ?

 

Then I am sure there are enough people on this forum who can assist with this lot.

 

[pauldb38]

i think pre 2005 it wasn't regulated here a scanned doc

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]59982[/ATTACH]

[obiter dictum]

Loans abover 25000 are not regulated

 

Yours has to be regulated by the CCA 1974

 

That agreement is totally pants and missing even the basic prescribed terms

 

Totally unenforceable in my opinion

 

Reminds me of an old credit card application you got out of those magazines

Edited October 20, 2015 by obiter dictum

[obiter dictum]

What are the Prescribed Terms for an Unenforceable Credit Agreement?

 

For a credit agreement to be enforceable in a court of law it must contain a number of prescribed terms. If any contract is missing any of these prescribed terms then it can be deemed ‘unenforceable’ and the debt cannot legally be collected by the lender.

 

In section 127(3) of the consumer credit Act 1974 it clearly states;

 

(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under section 65(1) if section 61(1) (a)(signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner).

 

Here is an overview of the requirements of section 127(3) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. For a credit agreement to be enforceable it must contain the following prescribed terms;

 

1) Amount of credit

 

There must be a term on the agreement which states the amount of credit which has been issued

 

2) Credit Limit

 

The agreement must include regarding a credit limit or if a credit limit is not required (i.e. in the case of a loan)

 

3) Repayments

 

The agreement must contain information on how the debtor is to make repayments. This could be in the form of any of the following points;

a. Amount of repayments to be made

b. Date the repayments are to be made

c. Timing of payments

d. Frequency of payments

e. Total number of repayments (For instance, when a loan is required)

f. The power of the creditor to vary any of the above mentioned

f. The manner in which any of the above is to be determined.

4) Rate of interest

 

There must be a term referring to the rate of interest to be applied to the credit agreement

Credit Cards;

 

If you have a credit card then sections 2, 3, and 4 apply to you.

 

Loans;

If you have a loan sections 1 and 2 apply.

 

What if my credit agreement does not contain any or one of these points?

You credit agreement does not comply with the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and is invalid. If you credit agreement was to be taken to a court the judge would not be able to make an enforcement order to enable to debt to be collected by the lender.

 

When this happens the debt effectively sits in ‘limbo’ as it cannot be legally collected and you are not obliged to repay it. Most lenders don’t want loose ends or debts sat in ‘limbo’ as it takes up more of their resources maintaining dormant accounts so in the majority of cases the lender will write the debt off.

 

Section127(3) also provides that the court may not make an enforcement order unless a document containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor. This basically means a lender needs to be able to supply a ‘true copy’ signed copy of a credit agreement, along with signed terms and conditions in order for it to be enforceable in a court of law. If a lender cannot supply this then the debt can also be rendered unenforceable.

 

 

Pinched from andy

 

Your agreement is prior to April 2007 so 127(3) applies

[obiter dictum]

Either i am blind but nowhere on that agreement shows you took out payment protection insurance

 

The most you should have paid back in total is £4500

 

I smell welcome creative accounting again

 

This loan is now finished, at an end and you have a big wedge coming your way me thinks

 

Do you have a recent statement you can post up?

Edited October 20, 2015 by obiter dictum

[pauldb38]

I have one but they also sent me a settlement letter which is a joke

why would i pay for a loan for 11 years when it should be ten year

and then expect to pay £2800 some 700 more than the starting balance.

 

 

I can post up the other info tommorow ?

So what do i do next ?

I'd be happy if i could just get them off my back and not hve to pay another penny.

[obiter dictum]

From what you have posted up this agreement is now history

i need to see a statement first before the next step

 

Welcome went bust because of the endemic fraud committed within ther branch offices,

 

Agreements re-written without the knowledge of the account holders, loans being made out to people who never even applied for loans, fictious fees and charges, you name it

[pauldb38]

The latest statment is 3 doublesided a4 sheets do you need them all ?

[obiter dictum]

Just one sheet /side will do

[obiter dictum]

I will be honest with you and it is just my opinion with knowing how welcome operate

 

I think they have taken out a PPI agreement after you cancelled yours without your knowledge

 

This shortfall is not the original loan, but thye PPI insurance extra you know nothing about

[pauldb38]

heres a sheet of latet statement

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]59985[/ATTACH]

[obiter dictum]

Where are your correspondents coming from now

 

Is it Batley in Yourkshire

 

Might be under cattles

 

How do you know you are still paying PPI??

 

Sorry for the stupid question but i have to ask

[pauldb38]

on th statment its headed ruddington notts

[pauldb38]

I also just checked my credit report at both the creditexpert and noodle and there not listed in any form ?

[obiter dictum]

Ruddington is no more

 

Welcome has gone bust

 

The acccounts are being handled by the parent company in Batley, Yorkshire. Cattles

 

Check back tomorrow while i do some more digging

 

How do you know you are still paying PPI??

 

Sorry for the stupid question but i have to ask

[pauldb38]

Ok thanks so much for your help and time

[obiter dictum]

Me and Welcome are old friends

 

Sorry but i need to know

 

How do you know you are still paying for PPI????

 

Stupid question but i have to ask

[Baz1994]

on th statment its headed ruddington notts

 

Hi Paul,

 

Have you been receiving any annual statements from Welcome since 2008 ?

[dx100uk]

not sure what going on here

 

 

safestyle are GE money [as the agreement says]

nothing to do with welcome finance

which the statement seems to be from.

 

 

dx

[Baz1994]

not sure what going on here

 

 

safestyle are GE money [as the agreement says]

nothing to do with welcome finance

which the statement seems to be from.

 

 

dx

 

Lol dx you beat me to it - I was just about to ask the same thing.

 

Safestyle would be the salesman and GE / First National the Lender ?

 

Statement from Welcome ?