Can Baillif company add all the fees before they visit newlyns & 2012 CTAX LO

[Leakie]

Hi all

 

Can an Enforcement company add all there fee's on after the compliance stage (£235 and interest) before they try to enforce?

I know it would be irrelevant if they take control of goods

 

just curious if that was allowed.

 

leakie

[SabreSheep]

Can you tell us more about the situation so people have the context in which to offer advice?

[unclebulgaria67]

Hi all

 

Can an Enforcement company add all there fee's on after the compliance stage (£235 and interest) before they try to enforce?

I know it would be irrelevant if they take control of goods

 

just curious if that was allowed.

 

leakie

 

They can only charge the £235 if they actually perform the enforcement visit to look to take control of goods. They will obviously produce their documents with the fee added in preparation for visiting.

 

If someone managed to pay the amount due plus the compliance stage fee, before any enforcement visit, then they should not have to pay the £235.

[Peterbard]

The enforcement stage fees are due on the first visit of the EA, this is at least 7 days after the compliance stage letter is sent. There does not have to be any taking control of goods the simple attendance triggers the fee.

 

The sale stage fee is due when the EA attends with the intention of taking goods for sale. In order for this to be due goods will have had to be taken under control earlier. This is the case in none HCEO enforcement.

[Leakie]

Thanks for the quick replies

 

It is an old LO from 2012,

I am on income support, as I an a single parent with 3 children, now that my youngest (4 years old)has started school ,

I have been in contact with Step change,

So I contacted the council to find out what was owed etc

Once I had the figures I checked it against an Enforcement notice I have received from Newlyns . and the figure did not add up

I contacted the council again and they provided me with a breakdown of the figures.

 

£1483 +£75 +235 +interest at 7.5%

 

I have the above in an email, the figures now tally with the councils explanation.

 

Enforcement has not taken place, but is with one of there agents.

so no control of goods as of yet.

 

The lady I spoke too initially was very good, she is the one who deals with the bailiffs

and advised that the council could not take it back but to sit tight and it would be passed back,

she even advised me that it may be a good idea to do a DRO( through step change) and it would wipe out al the monies owed to the council.

 

I have set up an arrangement for one of my LO's at £3.70 per week with the council.

the oldest one is with Newlyns

 

 

Leakie

[HCEOs]

If no visit has taken place then only £75 can be charged.

 

If a visit has been made then a further £235 can be charged.

 

On a debt under £1,500 the 7.5% is not applicable and cannot be charged.

[daverules]

Quick question for HCEOs,

you state "On a debt under £1,500 the 7.5% is not applicable and cannot be charged."

 

The debt is for £1483, the fact that fee's were added taking it over £1500 would they now be

able to charge the 7.5% for anything over the £1500 sum?

 

Regards

[HCEOs]

Nope the 7.5% is on the 'sums to be recovered'. The fees do not form part of this.

[Leakie]

They have charged the interest,

The £75 compliance stage, takes it over the £1500.00

the amount did not add up this is why I contacted the council today,

and with the 7.5% the amount on the enforcement notice added up correctly.

 

The council seems to think they are allowed to do this,

Well i do not intend to let them in and hopefully it will be passed back to the council, and an arrangement can be made.

 

Leakie

[daverules]

Thank you for the prompt response.

[Leakie]

HCEOs

 

Thanks for clearing this up,

sounds like the council recovery dept need to be re-educated, as well as Newlyns.

 

Leakie

[lookinforinfo]

Are you saying that when the bailiff sent you the Notice of Enforcement did it include the £235 plus the 7.5%. Even before the 7 day notice had expired?

Incidentally I noticed that the debt dates back to 2012 - before the current legislation. Have the Council not referred you to bailiffs way back then?

 

Be careful taking the Council workers word at face value about expecting your case to be handed back to the Council. The bailiff may do but they will want to make sure that there is no way

they can squeeze some money out of you before they do.

[Leakie]

Hi lookinforinfo

 

The 7 days expire a long time ago

 

With previous experience and all the crap going on at the time I did not contact anyone , (please do not judge me I should know better)

 

I had an arrangement with Equita and was ripped off with them so the could claim the extra £235, but did not succeed this was the same LO

It has just reminded the money paid to Equita has not been deducted.( I paid instant payment with the agreement to them but they said I paid 1 week late )

The same with the council recovery bad experience until I spoke too the first lady who was very helpful and set up a payment plan for the latest LO.

 

The EA can try and squeeze as much as they want I have nothing of value

I am on Income support, I am a single parent with 3 children one which has just started school he was 4 in July,

 

I want to get back to work but only have a limited time period I can work. so income will be very low.

they can not get blood out of a stone.

I want too pay all I owe but with all the extra charges it will be hard if it is returned then this will save a lot

 

leakie

[Bailiff Advice]

They have charged the interest,

The £75 compliance stage, takes it over the £1500.00

the amount did not add up this is why I contacted the council today,

and with the 7.5% the amount on the enforcement notice added up correctly.

 

Can you provide the following:

 

The exact amount of the debt passed to Newyn by the council (the Liability Order amount).

 

The amount of fees added.

 

The reason for asking is that I am trying to establish the amount of interest charged. A few weeks back I tackled an in house bailiff firm as they had attempted to charge 7.5% on a debt of just over £1,600 (the amount charged in interest was approx £120). This is not permitted at all as the 7.5% can only be applied on amounts over £1,500. In this cases, the 7.5% interest may only be applied to the £100 (difference between £1,500 and £1,600). The correct figure for interest should therefore have been just £7.50.

[Leakie]

Morning BA

 

This is the break down I have received from the council

 

£1483.45 Council Tax to be collected

£75.00 Compliance Fee

£235.00 Enforcement Fee

£68.00 percentage sum to be recovered exceeding £1500 at a rate of 7.5%

 

£1861.45 Total

 

 

These figures were emailed to me by the council

They also stated that it would be advisable to contact Newlyns for a break down of how theses figures have been calculated.

 

Looking at the figures I can not see how they got the £68.00

They are charging interest @7.5 % on aprox £906.50

 

I think the council could not work it out themselves, thus advising to contact Newlyns for how it was worked out.

 

I have not had an EA at the property yet, but it is with an EA, so any time soon.

 

Leakie

[lookinforinfo]

Leakie quite a few of us have buried our heads in the sand so no judgement made on that score.

It would help though if you could answer what financial year this is that is still due and whether on the NOE giving you 7 days included the £235 charge. If it didn't, the inference is that the bailiffs have already called at your property thus incurring the £235. If they haven't been round, you do need to coontact the bailiffs with a view to arranging a repayment schedule to avoid them coming round and charging you that extra

amount. If you are sure they haven't been to you then you must challenge them and put them to strict proof when they did call.

 

You will note that I have asked again for what year the CT is for and you said 2012. if that is the case, why has it taken so long to be passed to Newlyns, or if it has been with them for a while, I would have thought

that they would have come knocking ages ago. On the other hand, depending on when the Council passed it to the bailiffs perhaps they should not be charging you the £235 or the £75 at all.

[Leakie]

Hi Lookingforinfo

 

This is Council tax 2012/13

 

At the beginning of 2013 My wife had a mental breakdown, and accidental hurt my eldest son the children were put into care.

2012 I had very little work so struggled financially,

from January to October I could not work properly due to depression and meetings with the social workers.

we move out in June 2013 , and stayed with my parents for 4 months, until we moved to our present property

 

We had no contact with bailiffs in 2012 part paid in 2014 (equita )

I had a visit from Equita in February 2015 but no further action taken and passed back to the council.

 

Newlyns have had the account for the last 4 months.

If they did call they did not leave a notice of them doing so.

I have had a few compliance notices for this LO from Newlyn all different amounts shown.

 

From previous experience I did not speak too the council or Bailiffs firm because

1 The council did not want too know and 2 the Bailiff company always find ways to make you default,

I paid as advised on the internet which was instant, and they enforce because they said the payment did not show up for a further week,

so as far as they were concerned I had defaulted but previous payment were done the same way were OK

 

I am now a single father with 3 children on income support, I want too get back to work now my youngest is at school, but will have limited income.

I am trying to sort it out at the moment, before I start work again.

 

Leakie

[Leakie]

Nope the 7.5% is on the 'sums to be recovered'. The fees do not form part of this.

 

BA if as HCEOs has quoted then there should not be any interest at all

Leakie

[ploddertom]

Do you still live in the same Council area?

[Leakie]

Yes I do PT I move out of the district on a temp basis to my parents june -october then moved back

 

Leakie

[ploddertom]

Yes I do PT I move out of the district on a temp basis to my parents june -october then moved back

 

Leakie

 

I would contact your local Councillor(s) and ask they help you. There appears to be so much wrong with what you have and you need a timeline of everything that has happened so far. The figures you are getting from Newlyn appear to be at odds to what they are charging for - not the first time this has been seen and may be a good idea if they purchase a new Abacus as obviously their computers and/or calculators are subject to virus or battery problems I would hazard a guess there are fees pre-April 2014 that Newlyn are trying to wriggle out of and have confused themselves in doing so.

 

It also appears that you may be classed as vulnerable and if so the Council should be taking this back and agreeing a way forward with you.

[brassnecked]

As you are on Iwouldn't an AOB be better, as the council are hammering a potentially vulnerable family with outrageous potentially unlawful interest on debt and fees?

[Leakie]

The council are just accepting what the enforcement companies say.

This is why they have advised that I contact Newlyn 's for THERE breakdown of the figures.

 

At the end of the day The council do not care what anybody is charged as long as they get the monies owed ,

which I understand.

 

The enforcement agencies should be whiter than white with the new rules

I know it is a small amount, the difference . but at the end of the day this is trying to obtaining money by deception.

or fraud which is criminal. you or I would be up in fount of a Judge , for even a smaller amount

The person from the council said to me the EA companies have to abide by the rules now, what does that say about both parties.

 

Vulnerable people are being screwed even more now,

I have leant this from experience, thus my lack of trust from any body in authority.

 

Leakie

[Leakie]

I think the biggest problem is the council will not accept any arrangement until they have a Lo

but this increases the debt.

and makes it harder for people at the bottom to climb out of debt.

this is what has happened to me,

I want to Pay but can not without help ,

More charges makes it worse.

 

sorry rant over

 

Leakie

[Leakie]

Well just an update

Bailliff came this morning and popped notice through the door,

I have been up since 5am but did not hear him come

Says he will return at 11am, I will not be here as I have a meeting at the job centre, to do with my income support.

 

Leakie