Barclays Bank - Additions, Reserve Charges and Overdraft Interest - Genuine Hardship Claim

[UrUncleGripper]

Afternoon,

I've been in a bit of a spot recently, lost my job, had to re-arrange my mortage to interest only or risk losing my house, defaulted on my one credit card, missing paying bills every month, I think you guys get the picture but the last year or so has been financial hell for me. My credit report is a sea of red

 

Anyway I'll concentrate just on the Barclays account here. I've had an account with Barclays for around 20-25 years and I have most of the statements which I've started to dump info from into an Excel spreadsheet.

 

I have a question if anyone would be so kind as to help,

 

1) I've dug a folder from around 1998 onwards and logged charges that include

Unauthorised overdraft fees

Additions fees

Transaction charges for insufficient funds in account

Personal overdraft usage fees

Overdraft interest charges

Paid referral fees

Items returned fees

Reserve usage fees

 

I'm missing a few statements here and there so will SAR Barclays today to get the missing information.

 

Naturally I'm awful at administoring my personal finances or should I say I was awful until a few ago when I stumbled across this place. My question is this, what are my chances of recouping any of the above fees and if so over what period. The Additions fees which are small are already over a thousand pounds and I still have another 5 years of statements to go through.

 

I hope I don't come across as a chancer who is trying to claw back money for services that I used. I have a deep loathing of Barclays as they have me by the short 'n curlies since I live in their 'reserve' paying close to £100/month for the privalige of doing so.

 

I never asked for the Additions accounts, I frequently popped into my local branch on occasions to speak about the horrendous charges but was always told that I was on the best package for my current situation, surely this was misleading to say the least?

 

I've read the BCOBS stuff in this section but am still a little confused as to what my next move should be once I've completed my spreadsheet and write to Barclays asking for ermmm, some money back please?

[fkofilee]

Hold Fire

 

Ill draft a response soon.

 

FYI DSAR requests will only go back a maximum of 6 years.

[UrUncleGripper]

Hold Fire

 

Ill draft a response soon.

 

FYI DSAR requests will only go back a maximum of 6 years.

 

DSAR for 6 six years is not too bad, fortunately the older statements that are missing are from a period when my account was in credit. Ahh the good days

 

Muchos gracias, I really appreciate it!

[fkofilee]

No pasa nada ^__^

 

Luckily i lived out there for 4 years haha

 

Right okay... The issue here is Bank Charge.s.

 

Now as you very well may know, there was a Court Case and it was deemed that the charges were fair. Now Im sorry to hear that youve had a bad time. However, we should be able to help get you back on your feet,

 

Unauthorised overdraft fees

Transaction charges for insufficient funds in account

Paid referral fees

Items returned fees

 

You wont get anywhere with the above UNLESS, you follow our or MSEs guide to a financial hardship claim. However, the banks are tough to get them to turn around. I managed with Lloyds, but it took 3 years, and that was without FOS help (FOS will just say Court case yadda yadda)

 

Additions fees

 

If thats the name for an "AVA" (Thinking Lloyds here) (Added Value Account - Silver Platinum etc) then you could very well stand a chance of reclaiming this money.

 

IF they have been missold to you, and you HAVENT used any of the facilities etc / If you were told that you needed to have it to get an OVerdraft etc / Told to have it to get preferential rates when actually it wasnt the case / etc etc

 

You may stand a chance, however YOUR Statments are key here, Barclays wont have statements going back as far.

A DSAR will get you 6 years worth of info. and this could help you somehow.

 

Personal overdraft usage fees

Overdraft interest charges

 

The above will not be challengeable. These come as standard with any OD.

 

Reserve usage fees

 

Barclays own, you wont get anything with this.,

 

I would suggest summing up all the charges you have on your statements and let us know how much per each one you have.

Then ill help you draft something.

 

Slick is also looking at this thread and may have some advice.

[slick132]

Hi Gripper,

 

Apart from the Additions Fees, I doubt the bank will refund any of the other fees.

 

Barclays were known to have changed customers over to an Additions a/c without without their knowledge or consent. In this case you could seek a refund and are likely to get one or two years fees back quite easily.

 

As Fko says, if they sold you the Additions package when you didn't need it, or you had similar "benefits" from other sources, you should see a refund.

 

If you are currently in Financial Difficulty, you need to ask the bank(s) to stop adding interest and default charges to the credit card a/c any bank a/c where interest and default charges are being added.

 

See the letter here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?387436-Letter-for-consideration-regarding-Hardship-or-Financial-Difficulty

 

Although the letter seeks a refund of charges, this may be unlikely. However, the chances of this may be better if you can show the bank was made aware by you, or they should have been aware from your a/c activity, that you were in Financial Difficulty.

 

[UrUncleGripper]

You wont get anywhere with the above UNLESS, you follow our or MSEs guide to a financial hardship claim. However, the banks are tough to get them to turn around. I managed with Lloyds, but it took 3 years, and that was without FOS help (FOS will just say Court case yadda yadda)

 

OK so here goes

Can't pay for necessities - YES, I've had to go on an interest only mortage and have payments plans for some utilitiesas I couldn't afford them every monthCan't pay debts - YES, I defaulted on a CC last year and now can't/won't pay the fake bailliffs (Thank you CAG)!

Income eaten by charges - NOT SURE, I'm currently living in my reserve with no income and the £100/month charges are suffocating any small amounts of borrowed money that I put in there.

Payments regularly returned - YES, my last mortgage payment just got returned..

Substantial drop in income - YES, along with Pat I also got the sack around 3 months ago.

Disability or illness -

Going bankrupt or into debt management -YES, for my defaulted credit card which I am now behind on as well

Continually living off credit - UNSURE, unless living on your overdraft and reserve counts as credit

Regular credit card cash withdrawals - NO, I don't possess a credit card anymore.

Frequently over your overdraft limit - HELL YES, my place of abode in in Barclays Reserves, I've been pretty much living there for years and haven't seen daylight for more than a few months at tops during those years

Bank charges have hurt your situation - Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

The charges are disproportionate - I guess this would be very difficult to prove

 

You are / were stuck in a cycle of charges you can't break out of - Yes I am a human snowball

 

IF they have been missold to you, and you HAVENT used any of the facilities etc / If you were told that you needed to have it to get an OVerdraft etc / Told to have it to get preferential rates when actually it wasnt the case / etc etc

 

I often spoke with the bank staff at my local branch and were told that I had no option to stay with my Additions account as Barclays had repackaged all of their accounts and this was the only option for me. What gets me is that during the last 18 years which I'm looking at, I have always been an Additions customer whether I had 10k in my bank account or 4k overdrawn.

 

I would suggest summing up all the charges you have on your statements and let us know how much per each one you have.

Then ill help you draft something.

 

I'll list the charges for the statements that I have tonight/tomorrow. It should be interesting to see what I have for each amount.

 

Barclays were known to have changed customers over to an Additions a/c without without their knowledge or consent. In this case you could seek a refund and are likely to get one or two years fees back quite easily.

 

As Fko says, if they sold you the Additions package when you didn't need it, or you had similar "benefits" from other sources, you should see a refund.

 

Hey Slick - So the chances are I'll only get a few years worth of Additions fees, man that sucks as it's probably a coupla hundred quid. It's those pesky reserve fees where the monies at. It's a shame as I never used any of the benefits of Additions whatever they were. I don't even know what I was eligable for, car breakdown cover or phone insurance etc.

 

Although the letter seeks a refund of charges, this may be unlikely. However, the chances of this may be better if you can show the bank was made aware by you, or they should have been aware from your a/c activity, that you were in Financial Difficulty.

 

It would be my word against the bank staffs though. I often would go in branch to discuss my account with those personal advisers who would just reiterate the company mantra of ' sorry but if you have no money this is the best account for you'. I'd request a large OD but would be told that it was not possible. I've been living in my reserve for years so the bank really should have known better and been more sympathetic (there's an oxymoron for you - sympathetic bank)

 

Thank you for your help gents, back to my speadsheet for now

[fkofilee]

Going bankrupt or into debt managementicon -YES, for my defaulted credit card which I am now behind on as well

 

NO! No DMP (Fee Paying / IVA) Or Bankrupt.

Youre not at the end of tether yet and youll be fine...

 

Just need to work at it...

 

You need to provide evidence that it puts you into hardship etc...

[UrUncleGripper]

Ahh you're dead right good sir. And yes again I have no plan to go belly up or self combust just yet (self loath maybe but it'll pass)

[slick132]

Hi Gripper,

 

The letter I linked above has a Budget Planner which you should complete asap for submission to the bank and to the credit card co. to seek a halt to default charges and interest.

 

The bank and the credit card should have been aware of you having FD's when you were going into unauthorised O/D, you were having items returned unpaid or you failed to make CCard payments as required.

 

If you can identify a point in time when they should have realised you were in trouble, THAT is when the bank or CCard should have acted to help, in accordance with The Lending Code.

 

[UrUncleGripper]

If you can identify a point in time when they should have realised you were in trouble, THAT is when the bank or CCard should have acted to help, in accordance with The Lending Code.

 

Slick, According to this speadsheet of mine I've been consistently overdrawn and living in the reserves for around 5 years. It's a rather stand out point in time as before then my fininaces were pretty good. I do recall at that point trying to seek help in arranging a larger overdraft so my bank were definitely aware that I was struggling to make ends meet.

 

Ok so the first thing that I'm going to do is fill out that budget planner and attach it to hardship letter and get that off to the bank. I'll do this first thing and then carry on with logging banking charges.

 

Cheers!

[slick132]

Ok.

 

You can adapt the letter to confirm when you think the bank should have identified that you were in FD's and use that date for when the bank should have acted proactively.

 

[AndyOrch]

Lets not forget only last year.......

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2763083/Victory-bank-charges-open-payout-floodgates-Court-backs-customer-hefty-overdraft-fees.html

 

Regards

 

Andy

[fkofilee]

Lets not forget only last year.......

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2763083/Victory-bank-charges-open-payout-floodgates-Court-backs-customer-hefty-overdraft-fees.html

 

Regards

 

Andy

 

Yes correct, it is still possible to claim on these. You may have to be willing to go to the courts for this.

[UrUncleGripper]

Intestesting that link from the DM. Well done to Foster Burnell.

 

A ruling is not expected until later this year. Until then, the county court ruling is not a legal precedent. However, judges can use it for guidance.

 

Does anyone know what the outcome of the ruling was?

 

So I've completed my banking spreadsheet and it makes for 18 rated viewing. The figures below are appx has I have missing statements,

 

Additions charges £2000

Overdraft interest £1500

Paid referrel fee £560

Item returned unpaid fee £150

Reserve usage fee £2000

Guaranteed transaction fee £50

Returned transaction fee £150

Unpaid transaction fee £ 50

Emergency borrowing fee £400

Overdraft fees £700

 

All in all pretty shameful reading. Lets hope that the kids don't use the above figures for our Friday night family quiz night.

 

I've filled out the budget planner but have a blank in my letter to the bank regarding financial hardship and how much to claim back. So I have a few questions,

 

1) Can I claim back Additions fees from the beginning? I've started my sheet in 1998

2) Should I only try and claim for the time that I was in financial hardship?

3) Which of the above charges can I try and claim back

4) Do I consult my uncle who works for Wonga about adding interest to these charges?

 

Cheers

[fkofilee]

Your uncle works for Wonga?!!!!!?!?!?!?!?

[UrUncleGripper]

Your uncle works for Wonga?!!!!!?!?!?!?!?

 

No I'm only messing mate

 

Just wanted to know if I could add any interest to those pesky charges at Wongaesque rates

[fkofilee]

Possibly. 8% i believe

 

But dont quote me

[slick132]

Any charges that you reclaim, you'd normally add simple 8% int't from the date of charge. This is only actually claimable once you start court action but no harm in claiming it from the outset.

 

The additions fees could be reclaimed as per post #5 above if you didn't need the benefits..

 

Which of the other charges, and how much of them you try to reclaim, you will have to decide based on your circumstances. For instance you can argue, as discussed above, about the time from which the bank should have known you were in FD's and how they should have assisted you re charges and interest on any Lending. This includes credit cards, loan a/c's or overdraft.

 

[UrUncleGripper]

Hi Slick or any member of the CAG forum,

 

I need some advice on gaining access to an excel sheet which I don't have the priviledge to link to

 

I believe that is the advanced spreadsheet link taken from the Interest Tutorial in your sig. I'm trying to work out how this interest malarky works and kinda have a fair understanding of it but would love to have a few excel formula's to help speed things up a little.

 

Cheers

[slick132]

Hi Gripper,

 

The best spready for you is the 8% simple interest. It's the first one linkied in post #1 here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?330996-Latest-Spreadsheets-PPI-Claims-and-Charges-Claims-Dec-2011

 

[UrUncleGripper]

Cheers Slick, appreciate your help mate!

[UrUncleGripper]

Quick update.

 

Hardship letter drafted and ready to go. I've enclosed schedules of all charges on seperate sheets with the 8% interest taken from the CAG provided excel sheets (amended to remove any reference to PPI).

 

I've claimed for,

 

All Additions charges from beginning

Overdraft interest from date of FD

Paid referrel fees from beginning

Reserve usuage fees from date of FD

Emergency borrowing fees from date of FD

Overdraft fees from date of FD

 

I showed this thread to a friend of mine last night who is a barrister (criminal law unfortunately) and he at least offered to help me with any paperwork should this go to court which is a relief. From the general vibe that I've picked up around here I think that it may just have to go that far. He skimmed over the Lending code guidelines and cross referenced it with my bank statement data and thought that I had a good case. The only downside that he mentioned was that 'financial hardship' is a grey area and it's interpretation is left to the banks who will naturally tell me to naff off.

 

Anyway this is out of my hands now, with the help of FKO and Slick I am as informed as I could possibly be and ready to fight back!

 

I'll keep ya posted

[slick132]

Hi Gripper,

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Barclays reply denying they owe you anything but offering a Goodwill Gesture of £100 to £200.

 

You should be wary of taking this to court. The Supreme Court ruling on current a/c fees means you need decent grounds to take court action.

 

[UrUncleGripper]

I understand what you're saying Slick but this whole thing is rather confusing. I have actually taken time to read the lending code, especially section 9 and it is here that my bank has seriously failed me. I remained in contact with my bank during the period that I am claiming for explaining that I was in financial trouble but they did nothing about it aside from smacking more charges on me, this is contrary to the lending code and the only real foundation for my case against them.

 

However having read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Fair_Trading_v_Abbey_National_plc which preceeded the lending code I'm left wondering why the banks would sign up to the lending code or rather the relevence of such a code after the OFT vs Abbey case.

 

I'll probably get a kick in the teeth, it's to be expected; but I'm no chancer trying to grab a quick buck from the banks. I honestly feel that I have been wronged so must try and fight my corner.

 

I'm just curious as to why I should be wary, is it that I could be ruined financially or wouldn't have the means to fight this if I wanted? Or just that I shouldn't get my hopes up high as you've probably seen my kind of enthusiasam before only to see it come to nothing. Either way my wife is gonna beat me if I lose as I've spent ages doing all these spread sheets and I can almost feel the 'told you so's) on the horizon. You don't have to be kind, be brutal!

[slick132]

Hi Gripper,

 

Sorry if you mistook my use of the word "wary". I meant that you shouldn't rush to take court action if the bank don't refund as requested.

 

If we were talking about default charges on a credit card, a bank loan, a mortgage or a catalogue a/c, court action is still a good option.

 

But for a bank current a/c, you need to be cautious and make sure you have good grounds to claim. You certainly wouldn't get financially ruined if you took court action as it would be on the Small Claims Track and the risk of costs against you is pretty limited.

 

The Lending Code does not give you a direct cause of (court) action and BCOBS is probably your best hope.

 

Get your letter off anyway and let's see how they reply.