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Carningli

HSBC and TOMLIN ORDER resulting in Default with CRAs

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Hi to all who read this.

 

 

This is my first post, prompted by yet another day of hassle from HSBC.

 

 

Some 6 yrs ago, I opened 3 accounts, Business, Joint and Personal.

All had small overdraft facilities.

 

 

Within the last 3 years the Business and Joint accounts always in credit had,

with no reason given their facilities withdrawn also my wifes credit card which she had never used.

 

 

My personal account has varied from £20,00 credit to £2,200 in debit, facility lmit £1,500.

Latterly the limit has been exceeded fairly regularly.

Inevitably charges and interest have been applied.

 

 

I have sought meetings with Branch managers, been continually fobbed off,

appointments made on bank holidays and on two occasions,

people who stated they were the wrong people to see.

 

 

I then decided on a letter only policy,

my letters being passed on to Customer Service staff for reply.

My questions are not answered and I am asked for duplicate information.

All the time I am issued with threats.

 

 

When the overdraft was cancelled on the joint account, I was forced to replace it with a Flexi Loan.

Today went to check my SO and DD list on internet banking

only to find that all my SOs and DDs had been cancelled by HSBC,

without anyone having the decency to tell me!.

 

I have not as yet taken any action regarding Interest and Charges,

they must be considerable and I am using the Advanced Spreadsheet.

 

 

Could any of your members advise me as to what I should now do?.

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Hi carningli , welcome to the forum :)

 

It seeems as if HSBC are on a Kami Kazi course ..... alienating good customers on a regular basis these days .. :(

 

Dealing purely with your Personal and Joint accounts for the moment - I take it you've got all the statements you need to work out the charges on the spreadsheets ........ If not then a SAR will get you what you need , (if you can't get them online )..... (just in case you need it .....

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/48-bank-templates/110--data-protection-act-1998-subject-access-request-

 

If you've got evrything on your spreadsheet , send a Prelim letter to HSBC asking for it back ........ (leave the 8% interest column off the list you send to HSBC , it doesn't become effective until you get it to court ...

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/48-bank-templates/111--letter-preliminary-approach-for-repayment

 

They will send you a 'Put-off ' letter waffling about the Test Case and evrything being on hold - ignore that and send a Letter Before Action (LBA)

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/48-bank-templates/112-letter-before-action-bank-charges

 

While all this is going on read the FAQs on the site here and you'll get the flavour of how to proceed , but come back and ask anytime if you need more help ...... someone will answer , and we're user-friendly .....:D.

 

As for the other stuff they've perpetrated against you - this is all harassment if you've been operating good accounts - so I'd report them to the Financial Ombudsman (FOS) and the Office of Fair Trading (OFT). In the present climate with the Test Case still ongoing the FSA waiver conditions are being flaunted by these cretins daily...... :(

 

FAQs complaints about bank charges

 

The Office of Fair Trading: Contact us

 

Hope this helps to point you in the right direction .....:)

 

As for the FSA - this is what the banks are supposed to be doing , but they're getting away with iffy practices ......

 

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/disp_monthly.pdf

 

There's a mountain of stuff on here but this is a relevant one I think - try not to laugh .....

 

FSA Waiver -Annex 2 – Dealing with complainants in financial difficulty


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Just a quick note on using online statements, print them off because as a new months statement is posted the oldest one disapears so in a couple of months time you could be left with no proof of the older charges :cool:

 

pete

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Hi Johnnymitch and Castlebest.

 

I owe you a big thank you for your interest. I hope I am conveying these thanks by the coprrect route. I will keep you all informed as to how this case progresses.

 

The latest trick of HSBC has been to take all my business account credit and put it against my overdrawn Personal Account! ( Just as well I had already covered all payments due), I expect they were trying to trap me into another load of charges) on my business account, by leaving it empty, I must really have upset someone in HSBC. In the mean time case preparation continues.

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Hi carningli , we're only too happy to help :)

 

 

The latest trick of HSBC has been to take all my business account credit and put it against my overdrawn Personal Account!

They are not allowed to do this - write to them and tell them to put it back or it can cause you all sorts of problems with the Taxman - (if you Google 'mixing business and personal accounts ' you'll see what I mean)

 

I would also tell the taxman what they've done ...... he may write and tell them to reverse it ......... and report them to FOS , IMHO this is a serious offence .......

 

Have a look at the conditions for 'Rights of Set-off ..... '

 

banking: firms' right of 'set off'

 

I would say that the 3rd 'condition which must be met' is the relevant one here ...........

 

How are you progressing with this one carningli? :)


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Hi Johnnymitch, Castlebest et Al,

 

Thank you for your on going enquiry,

I have been a little tied up business wise at month end, but am progressing well.

 

I have to hand all the statements I require

and have a good working copy of the advanced/complex spreadsheet which I am completing.

(I am actually quite shocked at the level of fees I have paid out).

I have also been reading up about the procedures and making copies of relevant information that may, be of use in the future.

 

I have received a default notice from HSBC re my Flexi Loan, it would however appear to be flawed, as they were asking for redemption within 10 working days, I am keeping this up my sleeve.

 

As they cancelled all my DDs and SOs, they of course sent me their usual letter saying

that they could'nt pay the Flexi Loan instalment.

 

 

To wrong foot them I have made arrangements to pay instalments from another bank,

direct to the Flexi Loan account. With regard to the Overdraft,

I believe this to be largely made up of charges applied, at the firms discretion to my disadvantage

and therefore represents my money.

 

Will keep you posted, with grateful thanks. Carningli.

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Oh I like it , carningli , it looks like you've got them sussed and are keeping a couple of steps ahead of them :D. To keep that flawed default up your sleeve is a masterstroke..... extra ammo for when you need it ........

 

I'll be interested to see how this pans out - thanks for the update :)


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Hello all,

Progress is steady and now at point of submitting PRELIMINARY LETTER with details of claim, without 8% interest. I am using the advanced spreadsheet which is headed "UNLAWFUL CHARGES" is this correct or should these words be amended to "UNFAIR CHARGES"?.

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Hi carningli :)

 

You could amend it , although I don't know if it'll make a lot of difference - there must be thousands sitting 'stayed' in the courts with 'Unlawful Charges ' on the Spreadsheets ......


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Hi Fellow Cagers,

The preliminary letter has been sent to head office, addressed to the Director of Retail Banking HSBC..... I doubt if he will see it, however it may just catch the eye of someone with some authority in HSBC!!!

 

One lesson I have learnt is check everything you receive from HSBC for accuracy. During this exercise I have found £50 added to my charges on statement over and above those on the relevant "Summary of Current Account Advance Charges and Interest" notice, letters promising refunds of charges in which the amounts stated are not honoured and charges made on loan accounts for the return of uneccessary instalment payments as payment already made. In a nutshell what a shambles.

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Welcome to HSBC world .... carningli ......:)

 

Be interesting to see what they come back with ...


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Hi to all you HSBC lovers.

Myself and hubby have been well and truly stitched up

 

 

we have suffered at their hands and the effects are going to linger with us for years due to their total incompetance.

If any of you watched the channel 4 programme "despatches" about the company called Marlin....

. WELL we reckon the HSBC and their associates, including sovereign collections and D G Solicitors

can beat that company hands down.

 

 

My life has been turned upside down by these muppetts and I no longer feel safe

and secure and able to hold my head up and smile.

 

 

I lost my fight through the illness and sadness they caused but I am keeping on the ball

by reading the success stories of you who can keep your fight going.

 

 

After hearing their profits announced on the news the other evening I couldn't help but say out loud..

... yeah, all that profit made from poor unfortunates like all us on the HSBC rant pages.

 

 

Good luck to you all.

Maybe one day people will see this bank for exacly what they are.

We did change banks luckily,

they are well aware of the situation and are totally disgusted at the treatment

we have had and have even taken copies of letters that we have had from HSBC

and associates as they have been shocked at the contents of them.

 

 

Going to a new bank was a godsend for us.

We are trying to look forward each day but it is difficult.

 

Good Luck

Stitch

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Stitch post up whats happened in your own thread and let us see what they have done to you :( not saying we can do anything about it but I would guess we can :D we are bloody good :p and I promise at least you will be able to hold your head up again :)

 

pete

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Would be very interested in finding out what happened with yourselves & HSBC especially DG solicitors , who stiched me up:!:


:mad2::-x:jaw::sad:

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For the two of you who have shown a response about our dealings with HSBC

It is an awful long story, that in October will have been dragging it;s feet for 2yrs

but I will spare you the hours it would take to explain everything and try to get it over as short as possible.

 

Oct 2007 Hubbys job uncertain, mine def uncertain (bouncing monthly pay cheques)

Went to HSBC to make appointment as responsible people to discuss options.

 

 

1st app cancelled by them so another made.

This app cancelled by them, so another made.

In all 4 apps made and cancelled by them.

Finally got to see someonein Dec, by then too late

 

 

.I had been off work sick(sinusitus) only to return to find my hours had dropped

and it would cost me more to get to work than what I ws getting paid so left,

Hence at the appointment I was not working so no income

 

 

.Had argument in bank and pointed out that if 1st app had been kept

there wouldn't have been a problem it could have been sorted.

 

 

things went from bad to worse April 2008 as you can imagine but kept plodding on as best we could.

Hubby got a job but they didn't pay him his wages so he found agency work to tide him over

and earn money while he sourced new employment ( not much around though)

but he worked for the agency.

 

 

Letters of all sorts passed although HSBC deny ever having had most of ours

despite the local branch having copies and sending them out through their own internal post. (laugh).

HSBC stopped paying all our bills etc and didn't tell us.

 

 

Instead they had all the money from our accounts for themselves.

Harassment by phone from HSBC and a complaint was made.

Things went on and on harrasment etc.

 

 

Well 2009..... received letters from Sovereign about wanting money.

Sorry but who are you and where was the correspondence to say you were taking accounts over.

So paying them now.

 

 

But oh then we get letters fron DG solicitors.

Who are you.

We are paying sovereign.

Hey no payments made. H

ang on yes they have we have NEW BANK PROOF OF PAYMENTS. Start paying DG now. Nightmare.

 

to cut a long story even shorter we found out that SOVEREIGN kept changing the sort codes for the payments to go to

, so hence they had been returning the payments back to our new bank.

This has also happened with DG too.

 

 

At no time had they notified us of this change but just did it.

MAKING OUT THAT WE WEREN'T PAYING THEM.

We have all the proof of this from our new bank.

We make payments by standing order which they don't like but tough.

 

 

We have been set up by these to the point we now have a ccj to our name,

which we can't erase all because when hubby rang DG about it

(having never seen one before and not understanding them. We are both in our 50's)

they told him how to fill it in, and of course you know the rest of it if you have dealt with them.

They told him exactly what to put so that it dropped us in it even more.

 

 

We have only just recently found out that we could have filled it in totally different

and argued but it is too late now as the damage has been done.

 

Have had a partial payment from the bank charges claim only

because I wrote 5 letters (yes 5) under the hardship case.

Stll waiting to hear like evryone else.

 

Fed up of panic attacks when the door goes or a car etc pull up outside the house.

Frightened to go out as I feel that myself and the house are being watched

and petrified of the post coming each day.

 

 

I don't smile or laugh very often these days or sleep well but just live day to day on a knife edge

. Even had to change phone company and number to stop the harrasment by phone.

 

 

No one only friends have the house number as it is unlisted and a barred number.

We have all the security set up with the provider that we can have.

What a godsend as the phone doesn't frighten me anymore.

Hence we have 2 box files of letters dating back to 2007.

Would be here hours if you want the full story.

 

Good luck Stitch;):?

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Sounds similair to my experiance after my heart attack:mad::mad: DG are HSBC own in house monkeys, I wish I had known, maybe someone could advise a set a side and investigate procedures as it niggles me I think they short cut legal system?????


:mad2::-x:jaw::sad:

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Sounds similair to my experiance after my heart attack:mad::mad: DG are HSBC own in house monkeys, I wish I had known, maybe someone could advise a set a side and investigate procedures as it niggles me I think they short cut legal system?????

 

Sorry to hear about your heart attack and hope you are well on the road to recovery, :-) and not hampered by hsbc.

O K similar feelings to ours. Think the in house monkeys should be labled "In House Idiots" though. Funny how we don't catch on straight away though isn't it about their antics. Perhaps an investigation would find some very dodgy practices as apparentley when I queried 5times a certain MS packwood, nobody new of her, but it appears everyone gets letters from her ???????????? It infuriates me that HSBC are allowed to get away with the practices that they carry out. Bring on an Investigation, "MARLIN" have nothing on these muppets, what a pity it wasn't hsbc uncovered on the tv. Maybe that could be a future programme for the makers.:!: Stitch

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Perhaps an investigation would find some very dodgy practices as apparentley when I queried 5times a certain MS packwood, nobody new of her, but it appears everyone gets letters from her ????????????

 

This is the famous, elusive, Helen Packwood we're talking about here - but apparently it's not illegal to use a fictitious signatory in a large company .... used quite frequently , especially for template letters ...

She may have worked there at one time and they don't want to waste millions of template letters by having to change the signature .... or she could just be the figment of HSBC's imagination .... whichever , it's allowed, apparently ... :D


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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Hi Fellow Caggers,

An update: Response received from HSBC after 6 working days to CAG template Preliminary Letter. Although I had also added some personal material fact to the letter, this was completely ignored and the HSBC letter was one of their standard template responses complete with leaflet " Putting your Finances in Order" letter signed by Retail General Manager Mr J Large although addressed to Director Retail Banking.. Clearly nobody read my letter in detail or took any notice of it's content or that leaflets were not required. (So much for their "trying to be helpful", should they not also be reported to Trading Standards for misleading information?. With regard to signatures HSBC always use facsimilie signatures, so I think I will resort to doing the same. So without any meaningful response I move on to Subject Access Request.

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Hi Fellow Caggers,

An update: Response received from HSBC after 6 working days to CAG template Preliminary Letter. Although I had also added some personal material fact to the letter, this was completely ignored and the HSBC letter was one of their standard template responses complete with leaflet " Putting your Finances in Order" letter signed by Retail General Manager Mr J Large although addressed to Director Retail Banking.. Clearly nobody read my letter in detail or took any notice of it's content or that leaflets were not required. (So much for their "trying to be helpful", should they not also be reported to Trading Standards for misleading information?. With regard to signatures HSBC always use facsimilie signatures, so I think I will resort to doing the same. So without any meaningful response I move on to Subject Access Request.

 

Can I ask are we talking financial hardship claim?


.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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Don't you mean move on LBA , carningli ......:)?


Nemo me impune lacessit

 

 

Advice & opinions given by johnnymitch are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

 

If you think I've helped you please feel free to tickle my star :-D

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As for the other stuff they've perpetrated against you - this is all harassment if you've been operating good accounts - so I'd report them to the Financial Ombudsman (FOS) and the Office of Fair Trading (OFT). In the present climate with the Test Case still ongoing the FSA waiver conditions are being flaunted by these cretins daily...... :(

FAQs complaints about bank charges

 

The Office of Fair Trading: Contact us

 

Hope this helps to point you in the right direction .....:)

As an aside ;)

Since August 2008 since the hardship criteria was added can you guess how many complaints were made to the FSA about potential breaches of the FSA Waiver?


.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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As an aside ;)

Since August 2008 since the hardship criteria was added can you guess how many complaints were made to the FSA about potential breaches of the FSA Waiver?

 

None?


The REAL Axis of evil: Banks, Credit Card Companies & Credit Reference Agencies.

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None?

18 were made. The first three months of this year when there was huge publicity on the OFT test case there was 0.


.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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I just want to add, I'm not picking on JM but when you see a complaint and the advice is complain as JM has done then follow through and do it especially where there maybe a breach of the FSA Waiver.

I would email a complaint to:

 

centralwaiversteam@fsa.gov.uk

 

JM can I ask you to add this to the list of contact details you have so that if you spot a breach that you know which is the best way to complain about a potential breach of the FSA Waiver?


.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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