Paid for car parking but still 'fined', POPLA denied appeal!

[zose]

I paid for parking via mobile and received a penalty notice for non payment.

 

 

The appeal went to POPLA, and APCOA then agreed in their statement that they had received payment but not my vehicle reg.

 

 

I stated that I entered my vehicle reg with my payment details.

 

 

APCOA claimed that they sent me a separate text message asking for vehicle reg.

They did not.

 

 

I did however receive a voice mail from them saying that payment process was complete and I was entitled to park for 24 hours,

so I assumed that everything was in order. (APCOA haven't denied this message).

 

 

POPLA denied my appeal, the assessor stated that I hadn't entered my reg details (even though I disputed this) so payment wasn't valid.

 

 

What did I pay for if it wasn't parking?

 

 

I followed exactly the instructions communicated to me and APCOA didn't have any loss of income.

 

 

I cannot understand the assessors decision.

[silverfox1961]

Hi and welcome to CAG

 

If APCOA decide to take this matter to court (as that is the ONLY way they can get you to pay) then in your defence, you would want proof via their phone logs that a text message was sent. Just because they say they did, does not prove it.

 

I hope you have kept all messages and texts from them.

 

Remember, this is not a 'fine' and has no standing unless a court says it does.

 

From now on, I would ignore until/unless court papers hit the mat

[Dublindel]

Well if you paid for a service then they owe you your money back. They can then deal with a non payment issue. They can't have it both ways. Ask for a refund.

[BankFodder]

I think that I would write them one single letter pointing out that you don't accept the decision from POPLA

and you look forward to following it up in court where you are sure that the judgment which you will get in your favour will have the effect of holding POPLA up to even more ridicule

[dx100uk]

who is the PPC please?

 

 

I'm sure you'll find they did not send you a penalty charge notice

and neither have they used the word 'fine' anywhere.

 

 

dx

[zose]

Thank you for all your responses, much appreciated.

 

silverfox1961, I have kept all messages, logs etc, but if I ignore it and it goes to court and APCOA win I will then have to pay all costs, scary thought.

 

Dublindel, I'm not really bothered about the £3.25, I don't feel I ought to pay the £85 charge.

 

BankFodder, again, a bit concerned that the court won't find in my favour. I couldn't believe it when POPLA denied my appeal so I now have little faith in official proceedings.

 

dx100uk, not sure what you mean by PPC? APCOA gave me a Parking Charge Notice and I have to pay a parking charge. My apologies for using the wrong technical terms, and thank you for taking the time to point this out.

 

I guess what I really want to know is, is there anywhere where I can get free legal advice by someone who can tell me if I stand a good chance of winning this case? I have been quoted £100 an hour by a solicitor just to look at it.

[havinastella]

Court costs are fixed, NOT SCARY.

 

POPLA and offical in the same sentance, FUNNY.

 

You have had your FREE legal advice. You owe nothing. Do nothing except send the one liner as advised or ignore and move on with your life.

[zose]

Just another point, in making her decision the assessor stated,

'although the appellant made payment for parking, the appellant’ vehicle registration number was not entered upon making payment. This has not been disputed by the appellant.'

This statement is incorrect, I had already told them that I had entered my vehicle reg when I entered my card details.

In my appeal I wrote,

'as I have already stated, I did receive a voice message telling me that I had succesfully completed submitting my details (which included my vehicle registration number and bank details)'.

The assessor was definitely wrong on that point.

Edited June 4, 2015 by zose

[zose]

Havinastella, how much are the court costs? I don't have as much experience in these matters, please excuse my ignorance.

[havinastella]

https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/court-fees

 

They won't go near court. If they do, you will win.

[zose]

Thanks havinastella, that tells me how much I would pay if making a court claim, but I am concerned how much court costs I would be charged if APCOA weaseled out of it and it went against me, - £100s or £1000s? I have no idea. I know legal proceedings are very expensive, that is why it is scary.

[havinastella]

You can work out the costs by the amount they are claiming from you.

 

So for anything less that £300 the costs would be £35 (£25 if they file online) So even if you lost in court (HIGHLY DOUBTFUL) all the extra work you put them through will only add those costs to the amount.

[andydd]

Havinastella, how much are the court costs? I don't have as much experience in these matters, please excuse my ignorance.

 

If you are defending there wont be any costs to you, the parking company will no doubt have to use a solicitor at £100 (but prob nearer £200) an hour, pay court fees, pay to travel to your local court. its not worth it for them (this was admitted on last weeks Watchdog), as it would be a small claim, very little of these costs are recoverable.

 

You, on the other hand don't need to fork out for a solicitor, its easy to represent yourself, plenty of advice on here..but don't worry, its very unlikely they will go anywhere near a court especially as it appears you have good evidence.

[zose]

Thank you for your patience havinastella and andyydd. That all sounds very positive. Can I just confirm then that if I did lose, I would only be liable to pay their £35/£25 cost to file against me, not their solicitors fees etc?

[DragonFly1967]

Thank you for your patience havinastella and andyydd. That all sounds very positive. Can I just confirm then that if I did lose, I would only be liable to pay their £35/£25 cost to file against me, not their solicitors fees etc?

 

There's a little more to it than that, they can claim up to £50 in 'legal fees', but yes, that's more or less it. And the beauty of it is, even if they win (which is in no way a certainty), they lose.

 

 

And just so that you're aware, in the whole of 2014, APCOA took the grand total of 7 (seven) cases to court (I don't know how many of those they won/lost) and you can bet your life that there were a lot more than 7 non payers

[zose]

Thank you DragonFly1967, that gives me a lot more confidence! I was feeling pretty rubbish about it this morning, thinking I had little option but to pay. It is a lot clearer now and I am grateful for all the input from everyone. I will be writing to APCOA in the morning declining their kind offer to lighten me of £85!

[DragonFly1967]

Thank you DragonFly1967, that gives me a lot more confidence! I was feeling pretty rubbish about it this morning, thinking I had little option but to pay. It is a lot clearer now and I am grateful for all the input from everyone. I will be writing to APCOA in the morning declining their kind offer to lighten me of £85!

 

And that's exactly how they want people to feel. The majority of people see the threat of court action and "panic pay" rather than defending any claim (if one gets made at all). Contrary to what their websites would have you believe, they don't actually win the vast majority of cases in the county court. And most of the "wins" shown on their sites are won by default, where the defence didn't file one thereby leaving the judge with no other option.

[zose]

I've done a lot of research over the last few days and this is the first site I've found to explain things and answer my questions, so it's it's not surprising that people just give in and pay. Of course ignorance is what these companies rely on.

[ericsbrother]

you should complain to POPLA and restate the fact and ask them to reconsider on the grounds that they have made an error regarding matters of fact or you will consider seeking a judicial review. If you are on benefits this will cost you nothing and them an absolute fortune. if you are just ordinary Joe Soap then it is not a goer but they dont know that.

[zose]

Thanks Ericsbrother, I did complain to POPLA and stated numerous reasons why the decision was unfair/wrong, including that the assessor had stated an incorrect fact in her reasons to deny the appeal. They said the Assessors decision is final. I don't want to take them to court but is there a governing body to POPLA that I can report this to?

 

Apart from making her decision based on a factual error the assessor also holds a position of responsibility/impartiality.

1. The assessor didn't believe I had given my registration number when paying. (APCOA's phone system would not have replied with a confirmation voice message if I hadn't correctly entered all the information they requested.)

2. The assessor did believe APCOA when they claimed they had sent me a further text message requesting my reg number even though APCOA did not provide any proof that this text was sent.

[andydd]

Just ignore

[SabreSheep]

As above ignore it, but return here in the unlikely event a N1 claim form arrives. If that does happen return Promptly. I suspect more chance of winning the lotto