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Reminder Notice from Gemini - query about NTK

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Hi All,

 

Hoping you can assist... I have received a letter from Gemini Parking Solutions about a parking ticket that was issued on March 30th. I believe it is a notice to keeper because it references the POFA 2012 and mentions that they have requested my details from DVLA as the registered keeper.

 

However, I have read that they are not allowed to do this earlier than 28 days after the PCN is issued. Which brings the first date that they can do this to April 29th. I sold my car (to We Buy Any Car, not sure if this is relevant) on the 3rd April. How did Gemini get my details, when from 3rd April WBAC would have been the registered keeper???

 

Thanks in advance all.

 

C

Edited by map890
wording

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The DVLA will 'sell' them details of the keeper at the time of the parking occurrence.

 

You've not made it too clear in your post...

 

Was a ticket attached to the windscreen of the vehicle (on the day that it was parked) or is this the first you've heard about it, which would indicate that this is an ANPR job.

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The DVLA will 'sell' them details of the keeper at the time of the parking occurrence.

 

You've not made it too clear in your post...

 

Was a ticket attached to the windscreen of the vehicle (on the day that it was parked) or is this the first you've heard about it, which would indicate that this is an ANPR job.

 

Oh, sorry! There was a ticket on the windscreen, but I was only parked there for about twenty minutes as it was the day I was moving in to the building.

 

 

It was in an underground car park for the building I am living in.

 

 

Honestly I lost the parking ticket and then completely forgot all about it until this letter showed up

 

 

but I could really do without having to pay the massive fine right now.

 

 

Money is super tight because of the moving house.

 

What should my next steps be?

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What fine? There is no fine. Its a speculative invoice that you wont be paying.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

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OK...

 

First things first, it's not a fine, it's just an invoice and would be akin to me sending you an invoice for reading this post, so please get the notion that you have to pay this completely out of your mind. The only way that they can force you to pay this is to take you to county court and win. Neither of which are a foregone conclusion.

 

Now, you say that this ticket was issued in the car park of the building that you're living in. Does your tenancy, leasehold or freehold agreement assign you a parking space on the property (whether in a numbered bay or not)?


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What fine? There is no fine. Its a speculative invoice that you wont be paying.

 

NURSE! He's out of bed again tongue.png


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OK...

 

First things first, it's not a fine, it's just an invoice and would be akin to me sending you an invoice for reading this post, so please get the notion that you have to pay this completely out of your mind. The only way that they can force you to pay this is to take you to county court and win. Neither of which are a foregone conclusion.

 

Now, you say that this ticket was issued in the car park of the building that you're living in. Does your tenancy, leasehold or freehold agreement assign you a parking space on the property (whether in a numbered bay or not)?

OK thank you, you have put my mind at ease!

 

Yes you are able to get assigned a parking space but only if you pay the people that rent the apartments out an extra £50 per month. I only had my car for moving in day, after which I sold it, so I don't have a spot assigned to me.

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OK, not to worry, an assigned parking space would have been the best avenue but all is not lost.

 

 

 

Gemini are members of the BPA, so, it's now time to have a little bit of fun with them (and cost them some more money, which is always a bonus).

 

You now need to appeal, as keeper, and not saying who was driving the vehicle at the time.

 

The appeal can be on absolutely any grounds you like! So, go mad! The driver at the time was unable to move the vehicle as they had been abducted by aliens, they tell me that the sex was ok, but the probe stung a little. Please cancel this invoice or send me a POPLA code. For instance lol.gif, it really matters not what you put at this point, it is only the POPLA code that you're interested in.

 

When Gemini reject your appeal, which they will regardless of what you write (there's no profit in allowing appeals), they are bound by their AOS CoP to issue you a POPLA code (which costs the PPC another £27), which allows you an appeal to an independent* body. It's at that point you submit a full, genuine appeal, which 99% of the time you will win. And even if you lose, the decision is only binding on the PPC, so it still remains that they only way that the PPC can make you pay, is to take you to court and win.

 

*at least more independant.


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OK, not to worry, an assigned parking space would have been the best avenue but all is not lost.

 

 

 

Gemini are members of the BPA, so, it's now time to have a little bit of fun with them (and cost them some more money, which is always a bonus).

 

You now need to appeal, as keeper, and not saying who was driving the vehicle at the time.

 

The appeal can be on absolutely any grounds you like! So, go mad! The driver at the time was unable to move the vehicle as they had been abducted by aliens, they tell me that the sex was ok, but the probe stung a little. Please cancel this invoice or send me a POPLA code. It really matters not what you put at this point, it is only the POPLA code that you're interested in.

 

When Gemini reject your appeal, which they will regardless of what you write (there's no profit in allowing appeals), they are bound by their AOS CoP to issue you a POPLA code (which costs the PPC another £27), which allows you an appeal to an independent* body. It's at that point you submit a full, genuine appeal, which 99% of the time you will win. And even if you lose, the decision is only binding on the PPC, so it still remains that they only way that the PPC can make you pay, is to take you to court and win.

 

*at least more independant.

 

HAHAHA ok I will write something to that effect! If they write back with the POPLA code I will post on this thread again for more advice.

Thank you so much for your help!

 

C

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HAHAHA ok I will write something to that effect! If they write back with the POPLA code I will post on this thread again for more advice.

Thank you so much for your help!

 

C

 

They will write back to you and issue you a POPLA code, they have to do that if they want any chance of 'enforcing' this invoice. Not doing so would sink any chance of winning if they decided to take you to court.

 

We'll be happy to help you write a full genuine appeal for POPLA when the time comes, and the members of this forum have a pretty darn good track record where winning at POPLA is concerned cool.png


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Oh, and in 2014, Gemini proceeded to court less than 5 times. So the chances of them growing a pair in your case are fairly slim I'd wager. I don't know how many invoices they dished out in 2014, and how many of those weren't paid, but I'd put good money on it being a lot more than 5 thumbup.gif


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They will write back to you and issue you a POPLA code, they have to do that if they want any chance of 'enforcing' this invoice. Not doing so would sink any chance of winning if they decided to take you to court.

 

We'll be happy to help you write a full genuine appeal for POPLA when the time comes, and the members of this forum have a pretty darn good track record where winning at POPLA is concerned

 

Does it matter if realistically I don't think I have a leg to stand on though? I mean I was parked in a bay when I shouldn't have been, even if it was only for a few minutes. But it's not like there weren't any other spaces available (there were about five other cars parked down there).

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Doesn't matter one bit.

 

Assuming that this invoice is for the usual £100 or £60 if paid within X days.... Please tell the court how you have lost £100 by the mere presence of my clients vehicle in the near empty car park? I paraphrase, but I'm sure you get the point.

 

 

They'd probably have a job on to prove that they'd actually lost £100 by your vehicle being in the car park, even if it'd been parked sideways in two spaces while upside down and on fire!


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Doesn't matter one bit.

 

Assuming that this invoice is for the usual £100 or £60 if paid within X days.... Please tell the court how you have lost £100 by the mere presence of my clients vehicle in the near empty car park? I paraphrase, but I'm sure you get the point.

 

Aha - got it. Yes I read on the Parking Cowboys website that the amount be requested should be reasonable for the contravention.

 

OK - thank you again for your help, I will post back when I get to the next stage :-)

 

C

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how much does it cost to park there on a good day for say an hour?

You say you can buy a permit for £50 a month, who do you buy it from? Are the properties rented out by the landowner or are they leasehold? If the latter what does the lease say about managemnt charges and parking allocation etc. It may be that this rule was invented by the managemnt co and has no legal standing whatsoever and that make any contract that Gemini hold absolutely worthless. You have a bit of time before you have to get your POPLA appeal in, IF Gemini give you the code that is- and then you can cause them to go deaf and dumb.

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how much does it cost to park there on a good day for say an hour?

You say you can buy a permit for £50 a month, who do you buy it from? Are the properties rented out by the landowner or are they leasehold? If the latter what does the lease say about managemnt charges and parking allocation etc. It may be that this rule was invented by the managemnt co and has no legal standing whatsoever and that make any contract that Gemini hold absolutely worthless. You have a bit of time before you have to get your POPLA appeal in, IF Gemini give you the code that is- and then you can cause them to go deaf and dumb.

 

There is no such thing as parking for an hour. This is one of the reasons I ended up selling my car - there are no temporary permits for visitors. Paying £50 per month for a permit is your only option, and there is NO parking on the streets nearby that isn't already marked out by Gemini or one of the council parking signs.

 

The properties in my building are rented out by a company called Get Living London who also provide the permits. I am not sure who actually owns the land - the property is in the Olympic East Village if that is helpful? I guess Get Living London have some sort of arrangement with Gemini?

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The owners of the land will be the rump of the Olympic delivery authority who will be the landlord. Normally only the landowner has the right to make contracts but in this case I am not certain what rights have been transferred so wont guess. However, this does not mean that you are in the wrong and one wonders how people get things delivered and whether hearses would be treated the same way.

Your defence when it comes to POPLA will be the old favourite of gemini needing to show a loss or the amount being a genuine pre-estimate of loss and this wont be so as the £50pm goes to the managing agents. There losses will be £50 divided by 30(days) divided by 24(hours) which is 7p

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Hi all,

Me again... I sent my request for POPLA to Gemini using special delivery. They tried to deliver today but no one was around to sign for the letter.

 

What happens if the POPLA appeal letter can't be delivered?

 

TIA

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If there's an address, send it by email as well. Tell your email client that you'd like delivery and read receipts wink.png


We could use your help

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

 

 

Please note that my posts are my opinion only and should not be taken as any kind of legal advice.

 

If I've helped you at all, please feel free to click on the little star under my posts and leave feedback :)

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if they dont send you appeal code they can only pursue driver but will then fall foul of a judge when he asks them about why no POPLA. If you have identified yourself as driver then it means they are chasing right person but if not then after 35 days have passed from your original appeal to them they lose the right to claim from keeper.

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