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Bilgeman

Bilgeman v natwest ** WON **

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He has a nice signature though :D


Initially owed £76

Phone call to NatWest - £19 refunded

Now claiming £57

Visit to local branch - Nothing done

Initial letter - Standard refusal letter from Mr. Higley

LBA - Another refusal letter from Mr. Higley

Action filled Monday 7th August - court costs £30

Now claiming £87

10th August - Natwest acknowledge the claim, intend to defend in full

23rd August - Received a latter and cheque from RBS for the full amount

24th August - Send letter to RBS accepting payment on the condition that payment is not confidential

30th August - Payment cleared.

Case closed!

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The bank doesn't see charges as unlawful.

 

Thanks for the comment. I suppose that's why I had a letter from the ubiquitous Mr Higley today saying that whilst the bank notes my thoughts about charges and my disputing the 'debt' (bloomin' cheek - it's only a debt if it's owed), they are not going to be prevented from continuing with collection procedures. I've already got my p*ss off letter written to Moorcroft or whichever other of the scavenging, blood-sucking vulture toilet agencies pays them 10% of the amount.

 

What a waste of time and effort. Surely this kind of conduct can only serve to alientate the banks even more from an already sceptical public. But then, to quote the contemporary saying, maybe I'm mistaking them for someone who gives a toss.

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Hi Bilge, great thread, better than the book I am reading!!

 

My son was asked for his card back, he rang them & let me speak on his behalf. I told them a court case was pending & therefore we would not send the card back because when my son gets his refund he will have no other way of getting to his money (he has no cheque book). He went off for a while, came back & said he would make notes on the account & not do anything til the end of August (hopefully refund will have been paid by then). See my thread 'nat west bank statements' for further details.

 

Good luck will follow your journey with interest!!


7th June mcol £30 + 276.00 + int17.37=£323.37 Abbey

Accepted £291 chq cleared 28th July

7th June mcol £120 + 1135.02 charges + 83.42 chq for £1438.44 paid to bank 2nd Aug

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:mad: Despite the fact that I've told the Birmingham Collections Centre that this matter is in dispute they are continuing to send threatening letters demanding I pay them the money they have taken from me which now results in a £630 'unofficial overdraft'. They are threatening to pass details of MY INDEBTEDNESS - cheeky b******s - to Callcredit, Equifax and Experian. If they do this and later capitulate, can I get them for defamation? That would be nice, wouldn't it?

 

Okay, so the letter I've recieved is headed 'Formal notice of intention to file a default and to take action to recover debt'. They are demanding the return of all cards and unused cheques - they'll be lucky, they were all incinerated with a load of garden rubbish months ago - and advising me that it would be a criminal offence to use the card with insufficient funds in the account. Who do these people think they are?

 

Should I write to them telling them to back off and that I consider demanding money that is the result of unlwaful charges to be harrassment and am going to the Police about it or would it be better just to go ahead with filing my claim. I'm just about to do that anyway but am still trying to gather the £120 court fees so it isn't actually under way yet. Who's been here and knows what the next move should be. I really am getting a little annoyed with their attitude and I don't want to say anything to them that might harm my case.

 

Cheers Folks

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How's this?

 

Despite my previous letter on this matter you are continuing to threaten me with Court over a sum of money which you claim to be a debt and which I do not acknowledge as such being, as it is, the result of unlawful penalty charges applied to my account by you over a period of some months.

Consequently any move on your part to send incorrect information to the credit reference agencies you mention will be looked upon by me as defamatory and dealt with as such.

As you have ignored my request for a refund of all unlawful charges I will be lodging my claim with the appropriate Court this week. There will be no further reminders.

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:x

 

Well, that's that sent off, then. I don't suppose it'll make the slightest bit of differene but the more annoying I can make their day the better as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure there must be a relevant thread but does anyone know the situation if false or incorrect information is sent to credit reference agencies whilst an account is in dispute or, indeed, if the bank has been informed by letter that I consider it would be false because of the unlwaful nature of the penalties and they later relent and pay up before court?

 

Can I sue the little tinkers?

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Sorry, found it in the FAQs but I'd still be interested to know if anyone's been down this road.

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Well, that's that then. Sent my claim to the court and paid the fees. Now the nail biting begins.

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I suspect there's a thread about this somewhere but I haven't been able to find it. Just wondering; my claim was filed with the Court at the end of July but despite this the bank keeps loading charges and interest on to the account - almost £100 since date of service. OK, twelve quid of that was the normal service charge for the account which obviously is fine (even though I'm not able to use the account as it stands which is their fault for making charges --- hmmm - food for thought - why should I pay for a sevice I can't use because of the provider's actions. Might rethink that one) ----

 

--anyway, back to the point. What happens about these extra charges? Will they become part of this claim or will I have to pursue separately later? Wondering if anyone has any experience of this.

 

Thanks in aniticipation...

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No, they will forever remain asunder from the current claim....:D :D :D

 

You've made your cut-off point on the current claim.

Just add them up for the next claim.:D


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I've been wondering about this for a day or two. I know the Court Fees are reclaiamable in Reclaiming Unlawful Charges cases but in the event that somebody employs a solicitor to do the work for them, would the solicitor's fees also be reclaimable. If so, would it make the defendant more or less likely to settle before Court? I'd imagine less likely so they didn't have to pay the costs but more likely to avoid a test case.

 

Just a thought

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On a small claim you cannot get back the costs of legal representation unless the other party has acted unreasonably in the proceedings (and this is hardly ever found to be the case). Your opponent wil know this and indeed many of the banks are stating publicly that this is the very reason they are settling all the cases, and not because of the merits of our claims.

 

There are a limited amount of other costs you can get - check the civil procedure rules for details.

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There's nothing to prevent a person using a solicitor to deal with a small claim but the procedure is not designed or intended for involvement of the legal profession on any great scale. Apart from the Court fees, the only legal costs generally allowable are solicitors costs on the claim which will be a relatively small fixed amount nowhere near commercial rates.

 

For that reason, it is standard practice and has been for many years for many businesses not to bother defending small claims as they are uneconomic. The cost of defending them usually far outweighs the amount of compensation they are being sued for so they just pay up.

 

Legal costs are only one element of the cost structure in small claims though. If witnesses have to be called e.g accountants or other professional witnesses, then the loser will be expected to pay their expenses for attending Court.

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There's quite a lot in the forums about what to do if the banks close our accounts in retaliation for taking action against them but what if the opposite happens?

 

Frankly, I don't want anything to do with the scurrilous lot I'm with once the matter is settled.

I have an account with another bank and all I want to do is get my money back and have done with them.

 

While all this is going on, I'm still paying the monthly subscription charge which obviously will not be reclaimable so I'm going to write and tell them I want to close the account immediately.

 

First of all, is this ok while the account is the subject of a claim and secondly,

if, as I imagine, they refuse (probably because it's overdrawn despite all of that being due to unlawful charges and interest),

can I do anything about it or do I have to wait until it's settled.

 

I suppose they'll want that as well so that when they do pay up, the money will be paid into the account to clear the amount 'owed'. It would be nice to pay a cheque into my other account and then make them wait. I don't think they'd want to play that game.

 

I take it that it's not a problem that arises much.

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A couple of points.

 

THe idea of suing the bank to reclaim what you have paid out is to put you back where you were before they took the unlawful charges. If you owe them money legitimately as well as the charges then i dont think its unreasonable that you pay them back.

 

Secondly if you ask for the moeny to be paid elsewhere and make them wait, unless you have some kind of debt management programme and are planning to distibute it amongts all your creditors then why would the bank be willing to wait for the balance?

 

I guess for me i dont understand why anyone would want to prolong a debt unless they had to.

 

I think as the claimant you can insist they pay you however you like, but if you try to make them wait dont be surprised if the try to make life more difficult for you than it already is.

 

JMHO

 

GLenn

 

PS sorry if its not what you wanted to hear.


Kick the shAbbey Habit

 

Where were you? Next time please

 

 

Abbey 1st claim -Charges repaid, default removed, interest paid (8% apr) costs paid, Abbey peed off; priceless

Abbey 2nd claim, two Accs - claim issued 30-03-07

Barclaycard - Settled cheque received

Egg 2 accounts ID sent 29/07

Co-op Claim issued 30-03-07

GE Capital (Store Cards) ICO says theyve been naughty

MBNA - Settled in Full

GE Capital (1st National) Settled

Lombard Bank - SAR sent 16.02.07

MBNA are not your friends, they will settle but you need to make sure its on your terms -read here

Glenn Vs MBNA

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I agree that if I owe them legitimately it should be paid back, but every penny of the overdraft is the result of unlawful charges, so I don't. Also, although I said it would be nice to make them wait, I don't think anything's to be gained by effectively coming down to their level. But it would be nice. All I really want to do is stop paying twelve quid a month for an account I no longer use but which, until my claim is settled, will still be hundreds of pounds overdrawn

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I would use any claim to repey any over draft that you have. While in the short term it would be nice to have the money, once it has gone it would still leave the OD ball and chain around your neck.


My advise if free and is worth exactly as much as you paid for it….

 

HSBC 28 Oct 2006 Personal accounts ~ Offered and accepted ~ £3514 :)

HSBC 15 Sep 2006 Business ~ Offered and accepted ~ £4980 :)

MBNA 7 Sep Offered and accepted £2290 - (my amount £1170 plus Compound Interest) using the "phone call method" :o

FREEWAY 28th Oct ~ offered and acepted £506 :)

TSB VISA MCOL £300 - court date 27th March 2007

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I know.

What a shame.

 

 

The money that I 'owe' them in unlawful charges is, of course, non-existant as far as I'm concerned;

I don't owe it to them but then neither do I have the right to hang on to it once they've paid up.

 

 

The money on top of the 'overdraft', ie nearly five hundred quid which they took from my account by swallowing up my wages before I changed accounts, is mine.

 

 

My original point, which I seem to have strayed from, is, I

want to close the original account NOW so that I'm no longer being charged twelve pounds a month to keep it open -

a legitimate charge which I haven't tried to claim back so far.

 

 

However, if I try to close the account and they won't let me (haven't tried yet but may do this week) then I would consider that further monthly charges (from the day they receive my request to close the account), even those which are legitimate under normal running of such an account, unlawful and ripe for claiming back in any future claim - which there will be because they've continued to add charges since I filed the current one.

 

In short, I ask the bank to close my account. They refuse and continue charging me 'admin' charges. Those charges, surely, are unlawful, whatever they argue about the account being overdrawn or in dispute???

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I know. What a shame. The money that I 'owe' them in unlawful charges is, of course, non-existant as far as I'm concerned; I don't owe it to them but then neither do I have the right to hang on to it once they've paid up. The money on top of the 'overdraft', ie nearly five hundred quid which they took from my account by swallowing up my wages before I changed accounts, is mine. My original point, which I seem to have strayed from, is, I want to close the original account NOW so that I'm no longer being charged twelve pounds a month to keep it open - a legitimate charge which I haven't tried to claim back so far. However, if I try to close the account and they won't let me (haven't tried yet but may do this week) then I would consider that further monthly charges (from the day they receive my request to close the account), even those which are legitimate under normal running of such an account, unlawful and ripe for claiming back in any future claim - which there will be because they've continued to add charges since I filed the current one.

 

In short, I ask the bank to close my account. They refuse and continue charging me 'admin' charges. Those charges, surely, are unlawful, whatever they argue about the account being overdrawn or in dispute???

 

This sounds like a NAtwest advantage Gold account - drop it to current plus which has no charge. I have opened account elsewhere and left o/d at the balance that I have in court claim - when I get money back it is just a debt paid and cleared, and then I will close account. Apologies if this is not a NW account.


Consumer Health Forums - where you can discuss any health or relationship matters.

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Guest ian cognito

Just a word of warning from personal experience - although I know we are far more clued up now, I had an account with Smile - £500 overdraft which I left at £400 when I stopped using the account, because I didn't keep an eye on it, they swallowed up the £100 then started charging penalties - I now owe them £1600+! I know I can claim it back but I'd rather not have the bother!!!!!!!!!!!

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Just a word of warning from personal experience - although I know we are far more clued up now, I had an account with Smile - £500 overdraft which I left at £400 when I stopped using the account, because I didn't keep an eye on it, they swallowed up the £100 then started charging penalties - I now owe them £1600+! I know I can claim it back but I'd rather not have the bother!!!!!!!!!!!

 

My o/d is 5000 and my limit is 7000 - so a lot of charges will need to occur for that happen but thnaks anyway.


Consumer Health Forums - where you can discuss any health or relationship matters.

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I can see your problem here Bilgeman.

 

If all of your O/D is made up of charges and they won't let you close your account because of said O/D then I would include your account charges in your settlement demand. It is a legitimate loss to you because had they not levied the unlawful charges you would be able to close your account anyway and cease paying the account charges. In short, you are only incurring the account charge as a direct result of their unlawful charges so it is reclaimable.

 

P.


Northern Rock; S.A.R sent 11/8/06 - Delivered. Recieved details of 6 yrs charges on 8th. Wrote back asking whether or not they hold information going back further than that.

MBNA; S.A.R sent 11/8/06 - Delivered 14/8/06

Barclays; S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) request sent 11/8/06 - Del 14/8/06

Diners Club; S.A.R sent 11/8/06 - Delivered 14/8/06. Recieved form to fill and return with fee on 17/8/06. Sent form back, delivered 4/9/06.

Intelligent Finance; Prelim letter emailed 16/08/06, claiming £318. Email recieved from "Anne-Marie" 17/8/06 saying my email has been passed to Customer Relations dept. Fob-off letter received 23/8/06, letter sent in return same day - Delivered 24/8/6 Recieved letter offer 25% settelement - refused - LBA sent. MCOL on 10th revcieved notification that they intend to defend on 13th. 06/9/2006 WON!!!!!!

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Well, this is all ongoing at the moment. Cobbett's have written asking for further info which I've sent and then this morning I get a letter from someone calling themselves Credit Management Services demanding that I contact them regarding repayment of the 'debt'. So I rang them and told them this is an ongoing court case and they shouldn't be writing to me. The woman was totally uninterested, told me that the charges were legal and that taking them to court would be a 'waste of time' as the charges were correct and lawful. I repeated that this was an ongoing (that word crops up a lot) case and would they please take note. She told me she would make a note but seemed unaware of any court case or the fact that Cobbett's are dealing with it. 'Left', 'right' and 'hand' are words that spring to mind. Anybody think this is out of order or are they perfectly entitled to do this?

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