Done over by my company?

[DemolitionRed]

I have been working selling data information for the past six months.

 

 

For six months I have worked on a minimum wage whilst working towards commission.

The commission target is set fairly high.

 

During that six months I have become an expert at what I do.

I have been rewarded monthly for winning conversions and lottery tickets for most sales in a week.

I have worked diligently and earned myself some great testimonials from customers on LinkedIn.

 

Six months in and this was the big one.

I had two deals due to close this week that were huge.

I’ve been working on both these deals for months and together they were worth millions to the company

plus a very hefty monthly commission to me.

At last all my hard work was going to pay off.

 

On Tuesday I received a call from my managing director instructing me to leave the office immediately.

He told me it was over a gross misconduct matter and he would be emailing me.

Stunned I went home and read the email.

 

 

I have been accused of suggesting a client send me a cheque in my name…in other words attempted theft.

I was informed they would phone me for a conference call in 24 hours.

 

 

24 hours of wondering what the hell was going on before I got a phone call from my director saying he had viewed the evidence

and was dismissing me immediately.

 

 

I strongly protested my innocence and asked to be furnished with this evidence.

I reminded him that it would be impossible to try and rob the company because no transaction of data is released until a payment has been made.

He said he would call me back in 24 hours.

 

 

At this point I really believed he was listening to me and that he would see that someone else on the sales team had tried to set me up

but 24 hours later he called and told me that after reviewing this case he was firing me under constructive dismissal.

 

I did ask him to go to the police with these allegations.

He was after all accusing me of committing a crime

he said that because he’s changed my dismissal from gross misconduct to constructive dismissal there was no need to take it further.

 

On Wednesday night I received a message from LinkedIn saying someone had attempted to get into my account.

The IP address was from a Mac within my office area.

 

 

On Thursday night I got an email from my line manager asking me to pick up my things from reception.

I checked his IP address and it’s the same as the person who tried to get access my Linked In account.

I messaged him back and told him that I knew what he had done. I got no response to that allegation.

 

I have just found out that on Thursday,

before I was officially sacked,

my line manager took over my two large deals and closed them.

This means he’s now going to get the hefty commission each month that I should have been getting.

 

Obviously it’s a dirty company and because I haven’t worked there long enough, it seems there is nothing I can do.

As far as I’m concerned this company has used me and fired me fraudulently to gain themselves a hefty amount of money.

 

 

What’s more and this is the bit that really smarts;

they have damaged my impeccable reputation with false claims of attempted theft.

It seems that unless I have very deep pockets (and I don’t because I’m now unemployed) I can’t fight back.

 

Any ideas ?

 

 

Has something similar happened to anyone else?

[unclebulgaria67]

I think in this position, I would email the Managing Director asking why the line manager had attempted to hack into your Linkedin account and if they were behind the client allegation, they stand to gain, having taken over completing the work you had been doing. Say that you intend to pursue the matter with the Police, as you have some evidence, which they could use to investigate this further.

 

If the owner of the business is different to the Managing Director, you should also think about contacting the Chairman of the company.

 

Your problem is that sometimes these businesses operate in a small world and whatever you choose to do, should not damage your chances of getting work elsewhere. I don't think you have much choice but to pursue this, as on your CV and when interviewed you will have to address the constructive dismissal. I think I would send the email as suggested and see how they respond. Would the Police investigate ? I am not sure of this, as they may say it is a private commercial matter and they don't think there is evidence of a crime being committed. If they say this, you should consult a Solicitor and see what they suggest. See if you can get a free half consultation with a local Solicitors or see if you have a legal advice centre locally. Sometimes Solicitors will act on a no win no fee basis or Pro Bono.

[TartanBunnet]

Regardless of your length of service your former employer hasn't followed the correct procedure for dismissing you. Even with allegations of gross misconduct employees are entitled to notice of a hearing, an opportunity to defend themselves against the allegation, and the right to appeal against the decision if they think it's too harsh or unfair. You appear to have been denied all of this.

 

Your former employer also seems to be misinforming you as they appear to be confusing "constructive dismissal" with "summary dismissal": dismissing someone without notice or payment in lieu of notice, which is what they seem to have meant, is summary dismissal rather than constructive dismissal. Constructive dismissal is where an employee has no choice but to resign because the employer's actions have breached their contract of employment. (In other words, it's something an employee would claim against an employer rather than a reason an employer would give an employee for dismissing them)

 

As far as I understand it a wrongful dismissal tribunal claim can be made by anyone regardless of length of service so it could be worth seeking professional advice on this. Best of luck with it- you sound like you deserve a much more appreciative and ethical employer than that lot

[Sidewinder]

Regardless of your length of service your former employer hasn't followed the correct procedure for dismissing you. Even with allegations of gross misconduct employees are entitled to notice of a hearing, an opportunity to defend themselves against the allegation, and the right to appeal against the decision if they think it's too harsh or unfair. You appear to have been denied all of this.

 

This may well be true, but only if it is a specific contractual matter. DemolitionRed - do you have a contract? Does it entitle you to a clearly stated disciplinary process? Does it apply from inception or only after a qualifying period?

 

If so, then you MAY have a case to take action for a breach of contract and claim damages for the failure to allow you the process outlined in your contract. If not, then you may find things difficult. Get as much evidence as possible - notes, emails, screenshots etc as these could be used if you were able to action a claim. Write a concise timeline of who said what and when and who witnessed any conversations.

 

And if the employer is really saying that they are dismissing you for Constrictive Dismissal, then that is ridiculous - there is no such thing!

 

And don't forget that if you have just been 'let go' then you should still be entitled to notice pay (again check your contract to see whether this gives you more than the statutory period) and you must receive any outstanding holiday pay regardless of the reason for dismissal.

[DemolitionRed]

Thank you all for your very helpful responses. Unfortunately I was exited from the office so quickly that I didn’t clear my desk, meaning I left my contract behind. I will be collecting this on Monday at 9.30pm

 

The line manager is also one of three directors. They are the three shareholders in the business. My line manager/director is not the one who phoned and dismissed me. I will write to the other two directors regarding the attempted hijacking of my account and I will mention the large gain my line manager will of made from my dismissal.

 

I have collected a good amount of evidence and I have taken full notes on phone calls and what was said and when it was said and I do have evidence that before my employment was officially terminated but whilst on suspension, my line manager moved in and closed one of my large deals and my accounts were reallocated to other members of the sales team. This apparently happened before they had made a decision on me.

 

As for the confusion in the way I was dismissed, what has been written here is very helpful and possibly the one sticky point I can get them on.

 

I am a member of BNI and made a few phone calls this afternoon. I’m now reassured that other members are rallying round to find me a solicitor who can properly advise me.

[Pusillanimous]

If you have it in writing you are entitled to commission on secured deals, make a claim for it. Presumably these big clients will be willing to vouch for you.

 

It might not help you directly, but report it to ActionFraud as someone appears to have dishonestly gained from your loss.

 

Put an advert in a local paper asking for former sales staff to come forward if they have experienced something similar. As it's sounds like a s c a m, it's probably not the first time they have done it.

[SabreSheep]

Regardless of your length of service your former employer hasn't followed the correct procedure for dismissing you. Even with allegations of gross misconduct employees are entitled to notice of a hearing, an opportunity to defend themselves against the allegation, and the right to appeal against the decision if they think it's too harsh or unfair. You appear to have been denied all of this.

 

Your former employer also seems to be misinforming you as they appear to be confusing "constructive dismissal" with "summary dismissal": dismissing someone without notice or payment in lieu of notice, which is what they seem to have meant, is summary dismissal rather than constructive dismissal. Constructive dismissal is where an employee has no choice but to resign because the employer's actions have breached their contract of employment. (In other words, it's something an employee would claim against an employer rather than a reason an employer would give an employee for dismissing them)

 

As far as I understand it a wrongful dismissal tribunal claim can be made by anyone regardless of length of service so it could be worth seeking professional advice on this. Best of luck with it- you sound like you deserve a much more appreciative and ethical employer than that lot

 

Incorrect.

2 years service required for any wrongful dismissal case

[DemolitionRed]

If you have it in writing you are entitled to commission on secured deals, make a claim for it. Presumably these big clients will be willing to vouch for you.

 

It might not help you directly, but report it to ActionFraud as someone appears to have dishonestly gained from your loss.

 

Put an advert in a local paper asking for former sales staff to come forward if they have experienced something similar. As it's sounds like a s c a m, it's probably not the first time they have done it.

 

They weren’t done deals until the first cash transaction was made and that was supposed to take place late last week. One of those clients is on LinkedIn and has made contact with me. They are clearly concerned about what has happened and are holding back with this company at the moment.

 

I did look through ActionFraud but there is nothing on that site (unless I’ve missed it) that relates to employers committing a fraudulent act on an employee. I have a mountain of proof that these deals were about to go through and I believe that going after this company for fraud of an employee is the right route to go down.

 

I would love to trace old employees but not sure if a local paper would allow me to make an accusation against a company when nothing has been legally proven. There are enough alarm bells regarding ex-employees for me to explore a route to tracing them and I do have a family member who is an investigative journalist so I’ll be talking to him over the coming week.

[CrappoMan]

Incorrect.

2 years service required for any wrongful dismissal case

 

You are incorrect. There is no service qualification for a WRONGFUL dismissal claim.

 

2 years service is required to bring an UNFAIR dismissal claim.

[steampowered]

To be clear, a wrongful dismissal claim would just be a claim for one week's notice (or longer if mentioned in the employment contract).

 

 

You could claim for notice pay, outstanding holiday pay and the commission through Employment Tribunal or a small claim in the county court. The second option is probably better. The first stage would be to write a formal letter before action to the employer asking them to pay those amounts, and see what you get back.

[SabreSheep]

OK

I error ed, you are correct, no service require for Wrongful dismissal.

 

However as pointed out, the compensation will be purely for notice period and very little else. That alone makes the tribunal route uneconomical due to the new changes requiring claimants to pay.

 

You could in theory pursue your notice period from the civil courts. Again, compensation will be limited to what you contractually lost. The deals in question will not be able to be assessed in this.

 

However

 

As for newspaper listing. An article stating "Did you work for X between xxxx and xxxx? I would be extremely interested in talking to you. Please contact me on XXXXXX"

 

Not liable in any way but opens the door if people want to talk about it. Where you go form there is another question.

[DemolitionRed]

Here's a turn up for the books. I wrote to a good friend of mine in Baltimore last night and she immediately sent my letter to a barrister friend of hers in London. I ended up chatting online to him and this is what he's said;

 

1. The dismissal is plainly unfair! Number 1, extremely difficult to establish gross misconduct on a single offence but yes, if it is a one-off offence it would have to be something very close to a criminal one. In addition, you had no opportunity to participate in the dismissal process at all, which was bizarrely one-sided, nor have you had a chance to appeal.

 

2. On the other hand you seem to be victim of (1) as a minimum malicious falsehood but also, if xxxxx does indeed take the commission on those deals (2) arguably conspiracy to defraud, which is a criminal offence as well as civil wrong. xxxxx also maybe attempted to commit a cyber-crime, but that probably wont go far, but might be useful as part of a conspiracy allegation.

 

3. He is putting me in touch with a particular law firm in London and a man who ran the Jean Tigana's employment dismissal case, which he says was very similar to mine. He did win that case and is well known as a very good employment lawyer. He is also helping me to put together an appeal letter.

 

I'll keep you informed here as to what happens next.

 

Many thanks for your responses so far.

[steampowered]

Hi

 

It is good to hear you are in touch with someone who sounds like they can help. As previously advised, there is a 2 years service requirement to claim compensation for unfair dismissal. There are a few exceptions to that but I can't see any that might apply here. I don't want to be negative but just want to manage your expectations.

 

The only real remedy for an unjustified dismissal before you have 2 years' service is a claim for notice pay (or any other payments owing e.g. holiday pay or commission). The minimum required notice for someone with six months service is one week.

[DemolitionRed]

Hi Steampowered,

 

Over the weekend I have set myself up as an independent broker...something good may come of this and I have an interview on Tuesday for a sales team management position.

 

Although I would of enjoyed those commissions, this is no longer about the money but about clearing my good name. I still feel very angry that the company or at least one of its directors would set up an employee/me like they did and so I intend to fight my corner. I know that sales can be very dirty business and things like this happen all too often but it seems there is little to nothing that employee can do unless they have worked a certain length of time. This makes new employees highly vulnerable to this sort of unscrupulous practice and the chances are, this particular company have probably got away with this before. I intend to show them up for what they are and if I get compensation that will just be an added bonus.

[steampowered]

That's great to hear that you have another interview, best of luck with that.

 

 

I can certainly understand the 'clearing your name' point and the desire to hold this company to account for the way they have conducted themselves. You should be aware that winning in court or at Employment Tribunal wouldn't necessarily clear your name as the company would still be free to write negative references about you. My experience is that the losing side will almost always complain that the decision was wrong for some reason or another. However, it is very common to agree a neutral reference as part of any settlement.

[BazzaS]

That's great to hear that you have another interview, best of luck with that.

 

 

I can certainly understand the 'clearing your name' point and the desire to hold this company to account for the way they have conducted themselves. You should be aware that winning in court or at Employment Tribunal wouldn't necessarily clear your name as the company would still be free to write negative references about you. My experience is that the losing side will almost always complain that the decision was wrong for some reason or another. However, it is very common to agree a neutral reference as part of any settlement.

 

If asked to provide the firm's details for a reference, if you had taken them to an Employment Tribunal and won, there is nothing to stop you telling the new employer "I'm happy to provide their details, but you may need to view any reference in the light of me having taken them to an Employment Tribunal (or County Court, small claims track) and I won."

 

No doubt the company can claim the court / tribunal's decision was wrong / unfair, but it will still cast doubt on any negative reference : which still must be truthful, and you can obtain a copy by an SAR!.

[Pusillanimous]

As steampoweref says, all of this might be proveable. However, an Employment Tribunal does not have the jurisdiction to hear your case, as you have been there less than two years.

 

Even if you did qualify, don't use terms such as "conspiracy to defraud" or "malicious falsehood", as neither are mentioned in employment law (the legal term is "detriment"). Secondly, you would simply get the judge's back up, as they like to draw their own conclusions.

 

Your options, as I see it, is to tell your story to a newspaper ("so sue me") or some how get the police to take it seriously. Characteristically, they will decline to get involved in civil disputes.

[DemolitionRed]

Pusillanimous, this is not an employment tribunal. Both the barrister and an employment judge I spoke to yesterday have strongly suggested I take this down the civil/criminal route. This is a counter allegation against the company which could come to trial and the words you suggest I shouldn't use are the very words my barrister suggested I do use.

[DemolitionRed]

My husband is a journalist and understands the law surrounding journalism. Naming and shaming walks a very fine knife edge regarding heavy penalties on newspaper companies. A local paper wouldn't name and shame anyone without evidence of a full trial and a proven guilty party.

[Pusillanimous]

Good idea to take it to a civil court. At least when you set out your claim, you can get everything out into the public domain.

 

Caveat: it's expensive. If you lose, there will be costs.

[DemolitionRed]

I consider myself very lucky so far. A conference with a barrister and lets face it, most solicitors would of insisted on that conference, would of set me back £500. Because of a good friend I got that conference for free and the result of that conference was, I've got an incredibly strong case. In all honesty I don't want this to go to court; I want the company to do a proper investigation and show me the evidence and if they are unable to do that...well, lets just see.

 

If I hadn't had the offer of a free conference and lets face it, its an unusual freebie, I likely wouldn't of chosen to go down the legal route because once your unemployed you have to rein in on your spending. This is where the laws of employment fail the employee. Any employee who has the potential to earn big commissions is vulnerable to dishonest practice by their employers; at least for the first couple of years and it seems there are few places they can turn for help without spending a huge amount of money. I'm amazed that my social networking accounts have been inundated by people who have been through similar experiences to mine and hitting brick wall after brick wall when it comes to finding help.

 

I decided today that I would like to put together a campaign that I can take to parliament. There is a huge hole in employment law regarding commission earners and it needs to be brought to light.

[steampowered]

Just be very careful about this. Conspiracy to defraud and malicious falsehood are serious allegations. They both require a very high burden of proof and I am struggling to see how you could prove them based on the information in your post. It is the kind of case where you would be at risk of having to pay the other side's legal costs, even if small claims, if the judge decided you did not have a proper basis to be bringing claims of that nature.

 

The reality is that the government has made a conscious choice to say that you can't bring an unfair dismissal claim before 2 years. They could have dismissed you at any time for no reason whatsoever with only a week's notice, the dishonesty allegations are not necessary for that.

[Migster]

Just a point regarding the IP address. I may be wrong, but with networked PCs within a company, I think it is possible that a single, static IP address can be used for all internet traffic, regardless of which user and/or PC is involved (pretty sure that's how we are set up at work). As such, the fact that the LinkedIn "hack" and the email from your manager came from the same IP, my not prove anything (other than that both originated from within the organisation).

[DemolitionRed]

The IP address came from a personal computer at his home...the home of my line manager

 

Update:

I received a call on Thursday from my MD advising me that he had recieved my letter and could he drive over on Friday and have a meeting with me because something had been revealed to the company. I met my MD for coffee yesterday morning.

 

He revealed to me that after further investigation they had discovered three employees who had set themselves up to defraud the company and they had used my name in an attempt to try and escape an accusation. All three have been dismissed and criminal proceedings will be taking place against them. He profusely apologized and immediately offered me my job back along with compensation. He also told me that my line manager was being moved to another department so I would no longer be working under him.

 

I have slept on things and made the decision to return to work providing I get a full apology in writing and the deals I was about to sign re-allocated back to me.

 

I'm still dubious about what I've been told but then I was shat on from a great height and so bound to be suspicious.

 

The advise given to me by the two lawyers was highly valuable and clearly I had a strong case against the company; no doubt about that. I believe if I'd done nothing my job wouldn't be offered back to me now but with a pending court case, the company had no choice but to further investigate and come clean.

 

I want to thank those who supported me and advise those who tried to warn me that I was being overly risky in my counter claim, that such a claim...all of which was true, was no more tenuous than the claim they made against myself which led to my immediate dismissal. This was not, as has been suggested, about unfair dismissal but about a fraudulent, possible criminal act against my person. If I had taken your advise then I would of done nothing and believed I wasn't in a position to fight my corner regarding allegations of me committing a criminal act.

 

I guess the final moral of this story is, if you think your right then pursue it because like me, you might just sort things out and not end up on the unemployment ladder with no reference.

[Emmzzi]

this sounds more like a film script than reality! blimey!