Sisters on sick, but JCP has made her go to Ingeus

[Casper's Ghost]

She suffers from panic attacks and has never worked due to being on the sick. She has 3 children one under 2. She has a partner but Ingeus or JC has told her it is up to her to go to work not him.

My Dad has just got off the phone from my sister because she has an appointment today.

She can't go in because her boyfriend has gone out knowing she had an appointment and left her with her son. Ingeus has moaned at her because she can't come in, but they also moan at her because she has to bring in her son.

 

She can't work, has no expirence. Her boyfriend would rather go drinking with friends a few times a week then look after their children. What can she do? She was denied PIP.

[Mr.P]

She suffers from panic attacks and has never worked due to being on the sick. She has 3 children one under 2. She has a partner but Ingeus or JC has told her it is up to her to go to work not him.

 

 

Which programme has she been referred to ?

Does she currently claim JSA, ESA, or IS ?

 

The fact that one child is under two years of age means that she can volunteer for the Work Programme (and most of the other DWP funded schemes). "Volunteering" means she can not be mandated to take part by the JCP or Ingeus. However, depending on which provision she has been "volunteered" for, participation may be mandatory once she has signed up.

 

Knowing which claimant group and the programme she has been referred to will help us point you to the correct DWP issued guidance documents.

 

Best advice is not to volunteer or be bullied in to participating - Most of these schemes fail to provide any worthwhile support or help and are only really intended to pander to the whims of IDS and DM readers.

 

Edit: The Work Programme may just be what the boyfriend needs to kick him in to touch with reality and his responsibilities

[fletch70]

Oh dear casper, you and your family must be the unluckiest people alive.

 

Who is making the claim or are they not living together?

 

I can't see her been made to go to ingeus with a two year old .

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

I'll move your thread to the benefits forum for further advice.

 

HB

[Casper's Ghost]

She's on ESA and has sick notes sent to whereever they must go. I don't know why she has to get them. She's been sent to Ingeus and not him, he was working but quit. She can't exactly work because she has to look after her two daughters after 3pm, whilst he can because sometimes he can't cope with the children.

[Casper's Ghost]

They are living together, have been for about ten years now.

[honeybee13]

She's on ESA and has sick notes sent to whereever they must go. I don't know why she has to get them. She's been sent to Ingeus and not him' date=' he was working but quit. She can't exactly work because she has to look after her two daughters after 3pm, whilst he can because sometimes he can't cope with the children.[/quote']

 

Can you tell us which ESA group please, as asked by Mr P? Is it the Support Group or WRAG, the work-related one?

 

HB

[Casper's Ghost]

I don't know, she only been made to go to Ingeus a few months back, think the beginning of the year. They know she suffers from panic attacks and wanted her to have on infront of them to prove that she suffers from it. It must be the none working one because she wasn't made to go to these work programmes before.

[fletch70]

If she has been on ESA for so long I am surprised that she hasn't been assigned a group. My understanding is that once assessed you do not need to send in sick notes (or fit notes as they are now called). It may help if you tell us which part of the country she is in as different areas have different procedures.

 

She will have to be careful as if she was claiming an income related benefit while her boyfriend was living with her they could frown on that. Could you not help with the childcare to make things easier for her

[Casper's Ghost]

We live in East Anglia, I am looking for work and have my own appointments sometimes so can't always look after my nephew. I do pick up my nieces from school if she has an appointment at Ingeus and she can sometimes let their grandmother look after him.

Been told she's on ESA back to work which she shouldn't be on.

[honeybee13]

Do you mean the work-related group then?

 

If she thinks she's in the wrong group, she should have appealed it when the DWP made their decision.

 

HB

[Casper's Ghost]

This is coming from my dad so not sure. I thought they would ask her boyfriend to go to Ingeus instead of her, and they sometimes ask her to go at akward times like close to 3pm. Silly her she sometimes goes.

[honeybee13]

This is coming from my dad so not sure. I thought they would ask her boyfriend to go to Ingeus instead of her' date=' and they sometimes ask her to go at akward times like close to 3pm. Silly her she sometimes goes.[/quote']

 

I'm sorry, Casper, I think it's going to be difficult to advise on third hand information. Your sister must have letters from the DWP that say which group she's in, we need to know this because as Mr P says, the rules are different for each group.

 

As I understand it, your sister and her partner are treated separately for claims, so what Ingeus are asking her to do doesn't apply to her BF.

 

HB

[Lapsed Workaholic]

Paragraph 22 of Chapter 2 of the Work Programme Provider Guidance:

 

22. ESA Lone parent on the Work Programme with a child or children under the age of 13 can only be required to participate in the Work Programme during the child's normal school hours. It is important to ensure that you have regard to this restriction when mandating them to an activity. They cannot be mandated to carry out Work Related Activity outside of the child's normal school hours.

 

No ifs, no buts. This means that the sister need not make herself available at the WP establishment until she has dropped her child off at school or wherever else she needs to leave them. She is also entitled to leave the WP establishment in plenty of time to be able to pick her children back up.

 

Taking that paragraph literally would suggest that since there are no school hours during school holiday times then there is no requirement to participate in the work programme during those times.

 

This obviously refers to the WRAG group since the Support Group don't need to be there in the first place if they don't want to.

 

Sounds like the partner is a selfish and inconsiderate waste of space.

 

 

By the way, I thought that DWP/WP are responsible for arranging child care facilities and/or paying child minding costs for mothers with small children who are mandated onto schemes like WP.

Edited February 26, 2015 by honeybee13
Suggesting violence.

[fletch70]

Doesn't having a pre school child exempt you anyway?

 

As HB says, until there is a definitive answer to the questions and not just 2nd hand info it is impossible to give accurate advice.

 

If you are in WRAG don't they remove the need for sick notes, I know they did with me.

[Nystagmite]

 

If you are in WRAG don't they remove the need for sick notes, I know they did with me.

 

Yes it does. You only need to send in sick notes in if you're on the assessment rate of ESA.

[Lapsed Workaholic]

Doesn't having a pre school child exempt you anyway?

 

As HB says, until there is a definitive answer to the questions and not just 2nd hand info it is impossible to give accurate advice.

 

If you are in WRAG don't they remove the need for sick notes, I know they did with me.

I thought I read that somewhere too Fletch.

 

Paragraph 22 as quoted is straight out of the DWP's own Guidance. It is not second hand information. There is no reason to doubt its veracity. Answers to any other questions are irrelevant as far as the point at issue is concerned.

 

Edited February 26, 2015 by honeybee13
Removing encouragement of violence.

[honeybee13]

LW, I've removed your last sentence again. Please don't repeat it.

 

HB

[Lapsed Workaholic]

Sorry it upset you HB. Thought it was the best advice I gave all day.

[honeybee13]

Sorry it upset you HB. Thought it was the best advice I gave all day.

 

It didn't upset me, I thought your comment was against the ethos of CAG. Hence I removed it.

 

HB

[Alfie29]

The Jobcentre just don't understand people's background do they. Could they instead of her going into Ingus call her by fone? My mate has panic attacks and they were ok when they had an interview with him to do this by phone.

 

Also I totally agree with MR P on Volunteering and that it SHOULD be ur choice if u want to or not. To me it will never make a difference. I have been on Income support for 6 years now and they send me on pointless courses and they DO nothing either!

[Casper's Ghost]

They know about her background she has told them about her children. She was forced to go to the JC when she was several weeks pregnant with her son. They knew she was suffering from morining sickness but requested her to come to the JC. She threw up everywhere.

 

She is full carer to the children, the father goes out whenever he likes. So it should be him going to work. He was working around the time my nephew was born. But it lasted a few weeks due to bullying-I don't know if he was telling the truth.

[honeybee13]

I think we should stick to discussing your sister's problems with the JCP on this thread, CG. I don't see us being able to get your sister's partner into work unfortunately.

 

HB

[Casper's Ghost]

How can they possibly make her work? Can she actually cancel Ingeus appointments? I need to tell her something that cab help.

[Mr.P]

How can they possibly make her work? Can she actually cancel Ingeus appointments? I need to tell her something that cab help.

 

As an ESA claimant, she can not be forced to apply for, or take up work.

As for cancelling appointments, that depends on exactly which claimant group she falls in to. Please have a read of: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/394681/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf (assuming she is on the Work Programme).

 

Also check any appointment letters for the all important phrases "Please note that if you do not undertake the activities required in this notification your benefit could be affected" and "This activity forms part of your work-related activity action plan".

 

Note: As an ESA claimant, she has the right to ask for a reconsideration of any "activity" that she feels is inappropriate to her circumstances or health condition.