Father caught with my 18+ oyster

[fabled]

Hello,

 

Yesterday, my father took my 18+ oyster by mistake and was stopped by an RPI during his journey. At first, my father said it was his but admitted it was mine when asked again. He gave his details and went on his way. I will be asking for more details about the questions posed from him later but for now, I'm well aware of the consequences and am seeking advice from you guys. What can be considered helpful to prove my father's lack of intent?

 

No letters have arrived yet, but I'm making sure to be proactive and collect evidence of non-habitual misuse of the service. I'm looking for avenues of legal aid, so when I draft a letter this weekend, I can get a professional opinion. Unfortunately, I haven't found any free solicitor services that can deal with Fare Evasion. If any of you know one such organisation or service, please let me know.

[honeybee13]

Hello,

 

Yesterday, my father took my 18+ oyster by mistake and was stopped by an RPI during his journey. At first, my father said it was his but admitted it was mine when asked again. He gave his details and went on his way. I will be asking for more details about the questions posed from him later but for now, I'm well aware of the consequences and am seeking advice from you guys. What can be considered helpful to prove my father's lack of intent?

 

No letters have arrived yet, but I'm making sure to be proactive and collect evidence of non-habitual misuse of the service. I'm looking for avenues of legal aid, so when I draft a letter this weekend, I can get a professional opinion. Unfortunately, I haven't found any free solicitor services that can deal with Fare Evasion. If any of you know one such organisation or service, please let me know.

 

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

It's good that you're being proactive, but I think you need to slow down a little please. There is no point writing to ?TfL until they write to you. If you send a letter shortly, they won't have a reference number for your Dad's case and won't be able to marry up the paperwork.

 

In terms of intent, it hasn't been mentioned yet and again you will need to wait until they write. But how do you know he didn't intend to use it? Please don't say that the Oyster card had been taken out of a wallet that distinguished it from other types of Oyster card and put into one that looked like someone else's card.

 

When you say non-habitual misuse, do you mean that your father only used the card once? If he made other journeys with it, TfL will be able to check the history of your card.

 

I don't think legal aid is available for fare evasion, you might have some luck with a local community law centre. We can review the letter for you if it would help, once we know what the ?TfL letter says.

 

You might also find it useful to have a read around the forum for similar threads to see what others have written.

 

My best, HB

[fabled]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

It's good that you're being proactive, but I think you need to slow down a little please. There is no point writing to ?TfL until they write to you. If you send a letter shortly, they won't have a reference number for your Dad's case and won't be able to marry up the paperwork.

 

In terms of intent, it hasn't been mentioned yet and again you will need to wait until they write. But how do you know he didn't intend to use it? Please don't say that the Oyster card had been taken out of a wallet that distinguished it from other types of Oyster card and put into one that looked like someone else's card.

 

When you say non-habitual misuse, do you mean that your father only used the card once? If he made other journeys with it, TfL will be able to check the history of your card.

 

I don't think legal aid is available for fare evasion, you might have some luck with a local community law centre. We can review the letter for you if it would help, once we know what the ?TfL letter says.

 

You might also find it useful to have a read around the forum for similar threads to see what others have written.

 

My best, HB

 

Thank you for such a quick reply!

 

It's because I know how serious this can get that I might sound that I'm rushing it, but I meant that I would have a letter ready to explain his side properly when their letter arrives.

 

As for his intent, I know what he's like. He makes sure to pay for things and made a mistake. I found an old card holder that was the same as his to use and left it lying around, and he mistook it for his on his way out. It's such a laughably stupid excuse that I can't help but worry and expect the worst, especially when he'd lied at first. I want to show that he regularly tops ups his oyster and that this was indeed a one-off.

 

Thanks for your suggestion, I've been looking around a lot and the forum is proving to be very informative. I'll probably be back with more details and more specific questions. Although, I may avoid them too specific in case this reaches a court.

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

The letter can take 6-8 weeks to arrive, you have time.

 

If you want to show that he tops up his own Oyster card, you could print off the payment history of your father's card.

 

HB

[fabled]

Thanks again for the assurance, honeybey13. I've made sure to do that already.

 

I spoke to my father some more about the questions he was asked. It seems he told the RPI that he had done it on purpose. No other comments. He was not cautioned.

 

A letter has arrived today asking for his comments, and that the facts are being considered.

 

I've read through most of the forum and made sure to read up on the relevant policies. All things considered, admitting to the misuse of a student card is misuse of tax payer's money. Prosecution in the interest of the public and Justice. I hope that our oyster usage at least shows that it has never happened before. Perhaps they'll consider that as well, but not likely it seems.

 

Explaining that it was my mistake would look dishonest and any mention of PACE might aggravate things and lead to a cautioned interview or prosecution. I'm not optimistic.

 

I've found some leads to firms that might provide legal aid for criminal cases, so I'm slightly optimistic on that front. I just wish I hadn't been so stupid and caused this for him. He says he doesn't mind because it won't affect him much, but it certainly bothers me.

 

 

 

Any advice, anyone?

[honeybee13]

I just wish I hadn't been so stupid and caused this for him. He says he doesn't mind because it won't affect him much, but it certainly bothers me.

 

Hello again. Is this part new? Why did you cause the problem please?

 

HB

[Old-CodJA]

Hello,

 

Yesterday, my father took my 18+ oyster by mistake and was stopped by an RPI during his journey. At first, my father said it was his but admitted it was mine when asked again. He gave his details and went on his way. I will be asking for more details about the questions posed from him later but for now, I'm well aware of the consequences and am seeking advice from you guys. What can be considered helpful to prove my father's lack of intent?

 

 

If any case gets to a Summons to a Court hearing a person charged with the intention to avoid a fare will be judged on their words and actions at the time the alleged offence was detected.

 

 

No letters have arrived yet, but I'm making sure to be proactive and collect evidence of non-habitual misuse of the service. I'm looking for avenues of legal aid, so when I draft a letter this weekend, I can get a professional opinion. Unfortunately, I haven't found any free solicitor services that can deal with Fare Evasion. If any of you know one such organisation or service, please let me know.

 

 

It is your father who has been detected and reported as the offender and therefore any letter that arrives will be correctly addressed to him. It will be your father who must respond to that letter.

 

If this results in a Summons and if the person charged has no previous conviction for a similar offence a custodial sentence will not be an option for the Magistrates therefore legal aid will not normally be available.

 

 

Thank you for such a quick reply!

 

It's because I know how serious this can get that I might sound that I'm rushing it, but I meant that I would have a letter ready to explain his side properly when their letter arrives.

 

As for his intent, I know what he's like. He makes sure to pay for things and made a mistake. I found an old card holder that was the same as his to use and left it lying around, and he mistook it for his on his way out. It's such a laughably stupid excuse that I can't help but worry and expect the worst, especially when he'd lied at first. I want to show that he regularly tops ups his oyster and that this was indeed a one-off.

 

 

You are right, it is the single most common excuse that is offered when travellers are found to be using transferred or stolen tickets / Oyster cards / Railcards in order to avoid fares.

 

Thanks for your suggestion, I've been looking around a lot and the forum is proving to be very informative. I'll probably be back with more details and more specific questions. Although, I may avoid them too specific in case this reaches a court.

 

 

Whilst you should not give any details from which your father can be identified, it will be absolutely necessary to give accurate information if there is any chance of forum users providing answers that will be helpful.

 

 

Thanks again for the assurance, honeybey13. I've made sure to do that already.

 

I spoke to my father some more about the questions he was asked. It seems he told the RPI that he had done it on purpose. No other comments. He was not cautioned.

 

 

I am a little surprised that if you father was reported by an RPI, that he was not cautioned in a case like this however, not being cautioned does not mean that the incident cannot lead to prosecution.

 

 

Did your father sign anything at the time he was questioned?

 

 

A letter has arrived today asking for his comments, and that the facts are being considered.

 

I've read through most of the forum and made sure to read up on the relevant policies. All things considered, admitting to the misuse of a student card is misuse of tax payer's money. Prosecution in the interest of the public and Justice. I hope that our oyster usage at least shows that it has never happened before. Perhaps they'll consider that as well, but not likely it seems.

 

 

That is correct, but very occasionally the company may offer an administrative settlement opportunity. They are not obliged to do so.

 

 

Explaining that it was my mistake would look dishonest and any mention of PACE might aggravate things and lead to a cautioned interview or prosecution. I'm not optimistic.

 

 

Why would your father 'explain it was YOUR mistake' unless YOU had deliberately lent him your Railcard? Making such a comment would put doubt in the mind of a prosecutor and they would probably then consider whether a second charge might be possible. A person who transfers or loans a ticket or Railcard to someone else to enable that person to travel without paying the correct fare can also be prosecuted for a criminal act.

 

 

I've found some leads to firms that might provide legal aid for criminal cases, so I'm slightly optimistic on that front. I just wish I hadn't been so stupid and caused this for him. He says he doesn't mind because it won't affect him much, but it certainly bothers me. Any advice, anyone?

 

 

If the company decide to prosecute your father will be well advised to seek qualified help of a solicitor who specialises in criminal law and who is known at the Court at which any Summons he might receive is listed to be heard.

[fabled]

I just wish I hadn't been so stupid and caused this for him. He says he doesn't mind because it won't affect him much, but it certainly bothers me.

 

Hello again. Is this part new? Why did you cause the problem please?

 

HB

 

I was feeling very frustrated that I left it lying around, leading on to this. I'm much better now.

 

Did your father sign anything at the time he was questioned?

 

No. However, he said he did write his name down himself.

 

If the company decide to prosecute your father will be well advised to seek qualified help of a solicitor who specialises in criminal law and who is known at the Court at which any Summons he might receive is listed to be heard.

 

Thanks for letting me know, I hadn't known that before. I'll be sure to keep that in mind while we wait for their reply.

 

Currently, my dad has sent his comments and he wrote it with the help of a solicitor over the phone as well. I will update when there is news.

 

In the meantime, I have to thank you two for all the information so far. It's been very helpful, and the forum has been very useful to me.