CP Plus MOTO service station ANPR overstay - Should I be worried?

[Poor-Paulus]

Good morning to you all,

 

 

I have had the attached "Charge Notice" drop through my door.

 

 

I have not had anything parking related for a few years and from looking at the advice on this WONDERFUL forum,

 

 

I believe that the "just ignore it" may no longer apply.

 

 

So, can anyone advise on what should I be doing with this to make it go away?

 

 

Many thanks, Paul.

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

You're right about not ignoring, the guys should be along later to tell you how to deal with this. In the meantime, here's a link to the forum stikky with more information.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?412953-Have-you-received-a-fine-from-a-Private-Parking-Company-DO-NOT-IGNORE-IT

 

HB

[silverfox1961]

Hi

Ignoring is now not the best idea. By you appealing the speculative invoice, this gives you the opportunity totake the appeal to POPLA once CD Plus reject you (as they do in the majority of cases) Once the second appeal to POPLA goes in, this costs CP+, not you.

 

Your initial appeal can be anything (so long as it is relevant) but once you get to POPLA you will need to get them to consider the Genuine Pre Estimate of Loss (GPEOL). This usually has the desired effect. It's not as if you can park up and leave the site.

[ericsbrother]

OK, we need to know a little more bout the circumstances so did you see the signs sayiing that you could pay for any overstay at the time? Did you keep any receipts for your purchases ot buy anything on a card so the payment can be verified? The latter will help you get the MOTO people interested in persuading ANPR from dropping their actions.

I note that they say a £40 admin fee is payable if you dont pay up in 28 days. Utter cobblers, that may come back to bite them if they do try and enforce that. Why would it cost them £40 more to collect the money after 28 days compared to say 27 days?

You are right though not to ignore the demand Your first appeal should be as the keepr of the vehicle to ANPR and can really say anything such as you were unaware of a contract being offered as the signage wasnt visible to the driver on the entrance to the car park and therefore there was insufficient notice for a contract to be formed.

They will reject your appeal but this does give you a little ammunition to make them work a bit harder in supplying evidence to a POPLA appeal, which is the next stage. When you get your letter of rejection they should give you a code for an appeal to the independent adjudicator. This appeal costs them £27 so with the cost of the DVLA search they will have spent £30 so far and then your appeal will cost them time and money to gather their evidence and it will cost you NOTHING.

At POPLA use the same arguments that can win any appeal, you do not believe that a contract exists between ANPR and the landlord that assigns the rights for ANPR to create contracts or make civil claims for any monies in their own name and demand that ANPR give sight of such a contract if it does exist. Furthermore, the signage at the point of entry to the site was not visible to the driver of the vehicle and therefore insufficient to lead to an offer and consideration of a contract and so no contract was formed. The keeper puts it to ANPR to show that there is sufficient signage of a suitable size font and in language that is sufficiently clear to be considered as an offer of contract for consideration. In any case, the overstay by the driver in a free car park has caused no loss to ANPR and therefore the claim for £50/100 does nto represent their actual losses not are they a genuine pre-estimate of loss caused directly by a breach of contract by the driver, should such a contract actually exist and is therfore an unlawful penalty.

 

Let us know when you get your letter back from ANPR and we will consider its answer to the inadequate signage matter.

[Poor-Paulus]

Thanks for the help everyone...I'll be back when I have a reply-or-two.

[Poor-Paulus]

Hi there everyone,

Despite me sending the email of appeal, I still got the attached (if it's worked) demand. Look familiar? It's pretty much a carbon copy of the original demand.

I have now received the following...

"Thank you for your email. We can confirm that you appeal has been carefully considered and rejected. If you wish to take this further then you can now appeal to POPLA. We will hold this Charge at the current rate of £50 for a further 14 days from the date of this correspondence. Your faithfully, CP Plus Limited."

So then lovely people, what's my next step? Paul.

[silverfox1961]

Did CP + not include the POPLA code? If not that is grounds for complaint as you will not be able to continue the appeal without it.

[armadillo71]

You have uploaded the reminder.

 

 

Is there a validation code for POPLA in the rejection email?

[ericsbrother]

check to see if there is a 10 digit number anywhere as a reference or pcn no for example. They like to disguise them and then claim that it has been issued so they can avoid losing at POPLA

[Poor-Paulus]

There is no 10-digit POPLA ref. There is a 13-digit Charge Notice Ref No (blanked out on the above) - nothing else. Other than the above letter and email, I haven't received anything else.

[ericsbrother]

I expect they want you to write back to them to beg them to give you a POPLA code. They wont want to issue it as a matter of course because they know that by asking for it you are going to cost them money. however, by not following the protocols they remove the right to pursue the keepr of the vehicle for the debt of the driver and since you dont have to identify the driver they are stuffed.

If you want to wind them up complain to the BPA saying that twice you have asked for the POPLA code from these bandits and twice they have failed to issue

[Poor-Paulus]

So realistically, what's my next step?

[ericsbrother]

do nothing, thye have 35 dyas to applt for the code and send it to you, if they dont they can only chase the driver, who is unknown to them

[EngimaPart1]

This is normal for CP Plus who are really ranger services. Their systems often dont put the charge on hold and customers continue to receive reminder letters

 

When you do the POPLA appeal in order to beat CP Plus you should try and get hold of a loss statement for the site in question (if its paid for parking) then you must rebut the evidence pack they sound through to POPLA. It much better if you can do this in advance, but not essential.

[armadillo71]

The OP has stated that they have not been given access to POPLA in the rejection letter.

[EngimaPart1]

The OP has stated that they have not been given access to POPLA in the rejection letter.

 

I mis-read that.

[Poor-Paulus]

The clock's ticking...I await the POPLA number with baited breath.

[Poor-Paulus]

Hi everyone, I've had not communication from CP+, other than another demand for money. It's basically the same document as before with an additional £40 admin fee and "Legal Action Pending" in big letters. For some reason, the Manage Attachments button isn't working, so I can't upload a copy. Should I ignore this? It's beginning to get boring. Paul.

[ericsbrother]

You ignore this as it isnt part of the protocols of the PoFA. They ahve a fixed time to do things properly or it is game over for a claim against keeper. They have 35 days from the time your appeal landed on their desk so a coupld more weeks and they are stuffed.

[Poor-Paulus]

Nice one! Once again, the clock is ticking......tick...tock...tick...tock...

[Poor-Paulus]

UPDATE: I've now had a letter from DR+ with an unpaid parking charge of £120 and threatening legal action. As said above, I have requested this POPLA twice which has been ignored on both occasions. Should I be worried now? I'm beginning to get a bit vexed with all of this. P.

[themagician]

remember! you came here for the best advice,just sit back and follow that advice and enjoy the c.a.g.ride. p.s put the kettle on.

[Poor-Paulus]

Message received and understood

[armadillo71]

CP Plus have not met their legal obligation to allow you access to the independent appeals service POPLA.

 

Therefore they cannot use the POFA for keeper liability, so can only chase the driver.

 

You will receive a few more toothless debt collector letters which carry no weight and can be ignored.

 

You only need to respond to a LBA from CP Plus or their legal representative... which I doubt will happen.

 

For information purposes, not up to date, but you'll get the gist;

 

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/187599/response/463631/attach/html/3/A%20FINAL%20REPLY%20TO%20Alex%20Shipp%2087189.doc.html

 

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/205660/response/510306/attach/3/AA%20REPLY%20TO%20Craig%20Lewis%2090006%203.doc

[silverfox1961]

Did anyone see the name at the end? Sarah Connor. "I'll be back"