Update - TEC now saying Te7 and TE9 not received despite sending email acknowledgement

[LittleHen]

Never been involved with bailiffs before so very very worried. The situation is as follows (will try to be as brief as possible) and relates to a parking ticket apparently levied on my husband in Lambeth in Dec 13.

 

Dec 13 - parking ticket issued although not found on my husband's vehicle, and he was displaying what he understood to be a valid parking scratch card at the time. Poor quality photos obtained from Lambeth do show the scratch card as well as the parking ticket (which was not there by the time my husband returned to his vehicle).

 

Notice to Owner sent Jan 14 to old address

Charge certificate sent Feb 14 to old address

Notice of debt registration sent Apr 14 to old address

Warrant of execution sent May 14 to old address

 

We moved to our present address in Aug 13 after living in temporary accommodation following sale of our old address mentioned above in April 13. Present address uninhabitable from May till the August due to building works. Husband sent off V5 and driving licence to DVLA in May for updating but they lost the docs and husband had to complete new forms, matter only resolved and vehicle re-registered in Feb 2014.

 

Notice of enforcement from Equita bailiffs dated 1 July received at our present address on 19 July but not opened till 20th. First we had heard of the matter and my husband contacted Equita immediately spoke to an individual who told him he had 7 days in which to contact council to make representations before any further action would be taken. He has this individual's name.

 

Further letter from Equita dated 21 July received. Husband contacted Equita who would not even allow him opportunity to pay had he wanted to and said he had to deal direct with bailiff appointed. Husband called and texted mobile number provided multiple times (can be evidenced via phone records) but never received any response. He checked number more than once with Equita to make sure he had the right details.

 

In despair following searches on web we found details of stopping the bailiffs and details of the TEC. Contacted them in morning of 14 Aug as we were going on holiday following day and completed and filed forms TE7 and TE9 that day. Confirmation received via email timed 15.40 on 14 August and our understanding was that forms received prior to 4pm would be processed same day and details provided to council and bailiffs same day, so that enforcement would ceased immediately pending investigation. Costs per Equita at that time were £127 for the parking ticket plus £75 bailiff fee.

 

Husband called Equita mid morning of 14th Aug to say he still unable to get in touch with bailiff. Equita said this bailiff no longer assigned to husband's case and did not know who it would be passed to. Husband wanted to get in touch with whichever bailiff dealing with case to make sure they were aware of filing with TEC so nothing should be done whilst we were on holiday. Equita would not take any details to provide to new appointed bailiff and said husband would just have to wait for the bailiff to get in touch with him when appointed.

 

We left for holiday mid morning on 15 August and had received no communication from any bailiff at all, either in person or by phone.

 

Returned from holiday to find a slip of paper posted through the door, UNDATED, stamped 'Enforcement notice'. Threatening further action if we did not contact bailiff within 24 hours. We left message straight away on mobile no provided to say TE7 and TE9 received by TEC on 14 Aug and nothing should be done till outcome determined. Bailiff answer phone message says he will not make calls to mobiles. My husband is only contactable on mobile during business hours as he is self employed working on different sites. He can only be contacted on our house landline evenings and weekends.

 

The Notice of Enforcement added a further fee of £235 onto the fees already charged as above. How, given that the TE7 and TE9 were received by TEC on 14 Aug and we did not receive any bailiff visits certainly before we left for holiday on 15 Aug, was the bailiff entitled to visit our home and charge a huge additional fee when action was supposed to be suspended.

 

What on earth do we do now?

 

Any help much appreciated, we are so worried about what the bailiff will do next if he is prepared to make enforcement visits when enforcement is supposed to have been stopped. Needless to say atmosphere at home is stressed to say the least and the end of our holiday has ben ruined thanks to these people.

 

Very best LittleHen

[Jamberson]

First thing I would do is phone the council, if you haven't already, and confirm that action is currently on hold, pending a decision on your TE7/TE9. Also check with them the date they received notification of your forms from TEC. There should be NO bailiff action from that point on - but action prior to that is legit (and fees can be charged). Anything done and charged after the Council were informed is not legit and should be withdrawn. So, when you have that date, you can ask the bailiff firm for a breakdown of fees (which you are entitled to, free) and that should give you the date of the visit they charged for.

 

Meantime, you need to wait for a decision on your case. It would have been good to have posted here for advice on what to include, but there's nothing can be done now, except to see what they say. If it goes your way, then problem solved. If not, there are further avenues to follow but it gets harder.

 

There is a separate part of the forum for bailiff advice, and you might be better off posting on there with updates, and also checking the basic validity of the last set of charges, and the amounts being demanded (assuming they were prior to the council being notified of your TE7/9 - if not, they are invalid anyway).

[LittleHen]

First thing I would do is phone the council, if you haven't already, and confirm that action is currently on hold, pending a decision on your TE7/TE9. Also check with them the date they received notification of your forms from TEC. There should be NO bailiff action from that point on - but action prior to that is legit (and fees can be charged). Anything done and charged after the Council were informed is not legit and should be withdrawn. So, when you have that date, you can ask the bailiff firm for a breakdown of fees (which you are entitled to, free) and that should give you the date of the visit they charged for.

 

Meantime, you need to wait for a decision on your case. It would have been good to have posted here for advice on what to include, but there's nothing can be done now, except to see what they say. If it goes your way, then problem solved. If not, there are further avenues to follow but it gets harder.

 

There is a separate part of the forum for bailiff advice, and you might be better off posting on there with updates, and also checking the basic validity of the last set of charges, and the amounts being demanded (assuming they were prior to the council being notified of your TE7/9 - if not, they are invalid anyway).

 

Many thanks for your reply Jamberson

 

Wish we had known about this website as we would definitely have asked for advice. Only found it today. If this ever happens again - which I hope it will not - we will know where to come.

 

Husband filed his TE7 saying that he has changed address and not received any of the notices sent by Lambeth in relation to the ticket, and that in addition he was displaying a parking scratch card which he understood to be valid.

 

TE9 filed with box ticked to say that he had not received PCN/Notice to Owner.

 

We will see what they say.

 

Have not yet contacted Council as we arrived home late Friday evening and Council not contactable apparently weekends and Bank Holidays. Husband going to call TEC and Council first thing tomorrow to find out what the hell is going on.

 

I will post this in the Bailiff section also and see what advice is given - many thanks for the idea.

 

many thanks, any more input very gratefully received.

 

Best

 

LH

[ploddertom]

Thread moved to Enforcement Agents (Bailiffs) Forum

[tomtubby]

Little Hen,

 

You say that you found details on the web for stopping the bailiffs and details about TEC and that your understanding was that if the forms were submitted before 4pm that they would be processed on the same day so that enforcement would cease immediately pending investigation.

 

You submitted your TE7 & TE9 at 15.40 on 14th August (Thursday).

 

Can you post back to let us know whether this information was provided to you by the Traffic Enforcement Centre website?

[hallowitch]

every possibility its one of my old posts from MSE as I always mention this site when it comes to parking tickets

a point of interest

ive taken this from another site (consumer action group) it was posted by a very well known poster called tomtubby who is an expert in bailiff law

 

If you had no knowledge of the pcn then the correct course of action would be to file an Out of Time witness statement with the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The bailiff is NOT permitted to enforce a warrant at a new address. He KNOWS this.

 

Once an Out of Time witness statement has been filed all enforcement MUST cease. BY LAW!!!!

 

PS: The Out of Time witness statement must be sent to TEC by email and if received by 4pm today all enforcement will be

 

 

 

 

possibly taken from these threads

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?357219-help-with-Bailiffs-please-unknown-traffic-offence&highlight=TEC+by+email+if+received+by+4pm+today+all+enforcement+will+be+on+hold.

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?396163-Urgent-help-equita-bailiff&highlight=TEC+by+email+if+received+by+4pm+today+all+enforcement+will+be+on+hold.

[LittleHen]

Little Hen,

 

You say that you found details on the web for stopping the bailiffs and details about TEC and that your understanding was that if the forms were submitted before 4pm that they would be processed on the same day so that enforcement would cease immediately pending investigation.

 

You submitted your TE7 & TE9 at 15.40 on 14th August (Thursday).

 

Can you post back to let us know whether this information was provided to you by the Traffic Enforcement Centre website?

 

Hi TomTubby

 

My understanding was obtained verbally over the phone from a chap at the TEC whose name I have, who picked up the phone when we called first off to find out about the forms, what to do etc. He was very helpful. It was him that confirmed that they would contact the council and bailiffs same day to halt proceedings if the forms were received by 4pm. Husband submitted forms initially and the TEC actually emailed back to say he had missed out a bit from one of the forms so it was rejected first off. Husband completed the forms, re-submitted and received a fresh email confirming receipt by TEC at 15.40 on 14th. No notice to say any problem with the forms at the re-submission. I don't recall looking at the TEC website in any detail other than to get the phone number to make contact.

 

Hope this helps - any further advice so gratefully received.

Edited August 25, 2014 by LittleHen

[LittleHen]

every possibility its one of my old posts from MSE as I always mention this site when it comes to parking tickets

a point of interest

ive taken this from another site (consumer action group) it was posted by a very well known poster called tomtubby who is an expert in bailiff law

 

If you had no knowledge of the pcn then the correct course of action would be to file an Out of Time witness statement with the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The bailiff is NOT permitted to enforce a warrant at a new address. He KNOWS this.

 

Once an Out of Time witness statement has been filed all enforcement MUST cease. BY LAW!!!!

 

 

 

Hi Hallowitch

 

We did file an out of time witness statement which I believe is the form TE7? We specifically called the TEC to obtain advice as to what forms we needed to submit and were advised that the TE7 and TE9 would be needed. Those are the forms husband completed and submitted to TEC, receipt of which confirmed by email timed 15.40 on 14 Aug. I had understood that the enforcement would be put on hold that day based on what the person we spoke to at the TEC said. Notwithstanding, a bailiff attended our home at some time after mid morning on 15 August and put the notice of enforcement slip through the door. As it is undated he may seek to assert that he visited before our ford were submitted on 14th and it would only be our word against his that he did not visit before 14th.

 

The correspondence up to May was sent to our old address, the correspondence from Equita came to our present address, not sure if any warrant is for our old address or the present one.

 

Any further advice greatly welcomed

[tomtubby]

Thank you H/W. I updated the information regarding Out of Time applications in the past year. The correct position is that if a TE7 & TE9 is submitted to TEC by 4pm the application will be processed by TEC by the end of day.

 

TEC will then send an email to the local authority which should be received by the following day (normally mid morning).

 

The local authority are under a legal obligation to advise the relevant bailiff company to cease all enforcement until the decision has been made by the local authority as to whether or not the vehicle owner has provided a good enough reason why they are submitting the witness statement late.

 

In this particular case, the OTT had been filed shortly before 4pm on Thursday 14th August. The local authority would have received confirmation of the OTT by mid morning on Friday 15th August.

 

Equita should have received notification some time after midday on the Friday 15th August.

[tomtubby]

I would suggest that you call TEC first thing in the morning. They open at 8.30 am. I suspect that the visit on the 15th August had crossed with TEC advising the local authority to cease enforcement.

[LittleHen]

Thank you H/W. I updated the information regarding Out of Time applications in the past year. The correct position is that if a TE7 & TE9 is submitted to TEC by 4pm the application will be processed by TEC by the end of day.

 

TEC will then send an email to the local authority which should be received by the following day (normally mid morning).

 

The local authority are under a legal obligation to advise the relevant bailiff company to cease all enforcement until the decision has been made by the local authority as to whether or not the vehicle owner has provided a good enough reason as to why they are submitting the witness statement late.

 

In this particular case, the OTT has been filed shortly before 4pm on Thursday 14th August. The local authority would have received confirmation of the OTT by mid morning on Friday 15th August. Equita should have received notification some time after midday on the friday.

 

hi Tom Tubby

 

Thank you very much for this. Based on your comments above, it would appear that, if the bailiff visited any time after say mid afternoon on the Friday, their visit would not have been legitimate and the fee would have to be withdrawn.

 

My husband is contacting TEC tomorrow to find out when the council were notified.

 

Does the putting through of the enforcement notice without a date look like sharp practice on the part of the bailiff, to allow him wiggle room? Reading these forums (should that be fora?), it seems like Equita are not the most scrupulous in the business.

Edited August 25, 2014 by LittleHen

[LittleHen]

I would suggest that you call TEC first thing in the morning. They open at 8.30 am. I suspect that the visit on the 15th August had crossed with TEC advising the local authority to cease enforcement.

 

Husband is going to do just that. We are not sure if the bailiff visited on 15th or later but can say for sure that no-one had visited prior to about 11 on 15th Aug as we were in the house all morning packing and loading up the car for our holiday till that time. Husband mentioned during his call to Equita on 14 August that we were going to be away and that we had filed forms with TEC so possibly Equita used this information to expedite a visit. However when he spoke to them on 14th they had apparently not assigned a new officer to our case.

 

If the visit did indeed cross with the TEC advising the local council, what is our position vis a vis the £235 fee?

 

Would the fact that my husband tried on multiple occasions to contact the original bailiff assigned to the case, without response, allow us to advance an argument that as he was not able to reach anyone to discuss payment (which he would have been prepared to do before we found out about forms TE7 and TE9 as husband thought he had no right of appeal after all that time had elapsed) the enforcement visit fee should not be applied. He would have paid up somehow, if he had been able to get in touch with the first bailiff, so a visit would not have been necessary. Equita refused to take payment themselves over the phone when my husband tried to do this, saying they could not accept it once the case had been referred to their bailiff.

[tomtubby]

Call TEC in the morning and please do post back.

 

The enforcement should be on hold for approx a further 4 weeks. It is important to make use of this time to request evidence of the personal visit etc.

[LittleHen]

Call TEC in the morning and please do post back.

 

The enforcement should be on hold for approx a further 4 weeks. It is important to make use of this time to request evidence of the personal visit etc.

 

Presumably we should approach Equita for this rather than the Bailiff? I see something about requesting a fee schedule which should include the dates of visits, is that what we need to ask for?

 

Will let you know how husband gets on with TEC.

 

many thanks for all your help and time - it is so reassuring to know there is someone out there who can help

[Jamberson]

I think it would help to get a statement of when the visit was made, and that would be either by asking the bailiff (and hoping you get an honest answer) or requesting a breakdown of costs in writing, with those details on. It is possible the visit was late, in which case the fees could be easily revoked if all parties are clear on what happened - or they might be just beforehand. It would help to know for certain.

[LittleHen]

Update - husband has now called TEC. They say they have not received the forms TE7 and Te9 which husband submitted on 14 Aug, despite him having received an email confirmation from TEC timed at 15.34 acknowledging receipt. What on earth do we do now?

[LittleHen]

You may have seen below my post concerning a bailiff vist after my husband submitted TE7 and TE9 to the TEC and receiving acknowledgement of receipt of the forms from the TEC by email. My husband called the TEC this morning to ask about when the forms had been passed on to the council so we could see whether the bailiff had visited after the forms were filed. The TEC girl he spoke to claims that they have never received the completed forms husband re-submitted (following an initial submission which was rejected because one box had not been completed). My husband said that he had received email acknowledgement of receipt of the resubmitted forms dated 14 August at 15.34. The girl said they had not received the forms and there was nothing they could do. How can this be right? Husband will re-submit the forms along with the initial confirmation of receipt email but I have asked him to hold off pending advice from you guys what to do and whether we should seek help with completing the forms from you guys (which I think Jammerson suggested we should have done in the first instance). All help most gratefully received. We are beyond stressed with this, trying to do the right things and it seems to be going from bad to worse.Many thanks

[tomtubby]

Update - husband has now called TEC. They say they have not received the forms TE7 and Te9 which husband submitted on 14 Aug, despite him having received an email confirmation from TEC timed at 15.34 acknowledging receipt. What on earth do we do now?

 

Resend the forms straight away !!! I assume the copies of the TE7 & TE9 will be on your computer.

 

You may want to check the TE7 again before sending to ensure that you have provided a GOOD reason for sending the forms late. You need to explain the changes of address and detail the reason for updating DVLA date.

 

Any questions, please post back.

 

PS: A lot of OTT's are rejected as the REASON has not been outlined. There is no purpose in sending the forms if they are going to be rejected in a few weeks. Make sure that they are completed correct first time.

[rebel11]

Threads merged, no need to start a new thread.

[unclebulgaria67]

Update - husband has now called TEC. They say they have not received the forms TE7 and Te9 which husband submitted on 14 Aug, despite him having received an email confirmation from TEC timed at 15.34 acknowledging receipt. What on earth do we do now?

 

When you do resend the forms, I would suggest that you inform them that they did receive forms on 14th August as their system acknowledged them at 15.34, but they then appear to have lost them. Ask TEC to investigate why forms received have gone missing.

[LittleHen]

Resend the forms straight away !!! I assume the copies of the TE7 & TE9 will be on your computer.

 

You may want to check the TE7 again before sending to ensure that you have provided a GOOD reason for sending the forms late. You need to explain the changes of address and detail the reason for updating DVLA date.

 

Any questions, please post back.

 

PS: A lot of OTT's are rejected as the REASON has not been outlined. There is no purpose in sending the forms if they are going to be rejected in a few weeks. Make sure that they are completed correct first time.

 

Many thanks TomTubby How does this wording sound? I never received the Notice to Owner or any further correspondence from Lambeth relating to the PCN as all correspondence was sent to a previous address. I (husband) sent off my V5 and driving licence to DVLA in May 2013 (and my wife will attest to this) for updating. A charge was apparently due and I paid this online on [date], and the money was taken by the DVLA Driver Online Service on 2 May 2013. Bank account records confirm this and the money has never been refunded. I fully moved to my present address [address] in August 2013 after living mainly in temporary accommodation following sale of our old address [address] in April 2013. My present address was uninhabitable from May till August due to structural building works which I (husband) was undertaking during daytime, evenings and weekends in conjunction with other tradesmen. I did not pursue the non-receipt of the updated V5 until winter 2013 as my time was fully occupied by the renovation of our present address which continued after August, and caring for my wife who was coming to the end of a complicated pregnancy culminating in the early delivery of our son. I was also caring for our elder child at this time. Once matters had settled and my wife and son were back to full health, I chased up outstanding matters including the V5. A number of calls to the DVLA were made and it was found that the documents were lost or never received. I obtained new forms as my V5 had been lost and submitted these to the DVLA in January 2014. I received my updated V5 in February 2014. Is this too long?

[LittleHen]

BTW sorry for lack of paragraphing, computer playing silly devils it seems

[Jamberson]

Forgive the intrusion - I know you asked TT what she thought of the wording, but as she's not posted back yet, this is my view...

 

The TE9 is the main application. You need to tick the box stating you did not receive the Notice to Owner. Get your husband to sign and date it. (I'm assuming he's the person named as the debtor on all the case documents.)

 

The TE7 is the place to explain why it is out of time (which it is, because the bailiffs are already chasing it). This is where it is important to give the right info, and I do think what you said is too detailed. I would say something like this:

 

"I did not received the Notice to Owner or any further correspondence from Lambeth as I moved house in August 2013, before the PCN was issued. DVLA records were not updated, and so all correspondence was sent to my previous address. I attach proof of address [**add in something here - see my note below **]. I also did not get the PCN which was attached to the vehicle, so was entirely unaware of this matter until the bailiff contacted me recently. (I attempted to file this form immediately, but TEC seem to have lost the original - this is my second attempt.)

 

** You can word this bit according to what documents you have - proof of address from August 2013, or where you were living on the day the PCN was issued, or proof that you'd moved out - anything like that which is clear and proves the point.

 

 

Attach whatever proof you can about the address. I think that's all you need to say. Get hubby to sign, if he's the debtor.

[LittleHen]

Forgive the intrusion - I know you asked TT what she thought of the wording, but as she's not posted back yet, this is my view...

 

The TE9 is the main application. You need to tick the box stating you did not receive the Notice to Owner. Get your husband to sign and date it. (I'm assuming he's the person named as the debtor on all the case documents.)

 

The TE7 is the place to explain why it is out of time (which it is, because the bailiffs are already chasing it). This is where it is important to give the right info, and I do think what you said is too detailed. I would say something like this:

 

"I did not received the Notice to Owner or any further correspondence from Lambeth as I moved house in August 2013, before the PCN was issued. DVLA records were not updated, and so all correspondence was sent to my previous address. I attach proof of address [**add in something here - see my note below **]. I also did not get the PCN which was attached to the vehicle, so was entirely unaware of this matter until the bailiff contacted me recently. (I attempted to file this form immediately, but TEC seem to have lost the original - this is my second attempt.)

 

** You can word this bit according to what documents you have - proof of address from August 2013, or where you were living on the day the PCN was issued, or proof that you'd moved out - anything like that which is clear and proves the point.

 

 

Attach whatever proof you can about the address. I think that's all you need to say. Get hubby to sign, if he's the debtor.

 

Hi Jamberson No need to apologise, any help gratefully received. TE9 has been ticked as you describe above. I have the solicitor's completion statement for purchase of our new place, dated in April 2013. Would that do as proof of the move? We moved in to new place only briefly but moved to temporary accommodation from May to end August 2013 during building works.I will get husband to file with the new wording straight away once you confirm that the completion statement would do. so many thanksLH

Edited August 26, 2014 by LittleHen

[LittleHen]

We are attaching: - completion statement for sale of former home, addressed to my wife in her maiden name at our present address - house bought by her in her name solely - marriage certificate evidencing wife's former name and our marriage (ie we live in the same place) - email from council confirming our registration for council tax at our present address, with moving in date shown as April 13 Does this sound OK?