RLP Civil Recovery & Abuse. Police?

[Ames123]

Last week on Thursday me and a friend went to Primark.

 

She asked me to get a sticker off another shoe which was 14 pound

I got it off the shoe and passed it to her.

 

She took the sticker of the shoes that where 20 pound and stuck the sticker ontop of the shoe and paid for them.

 

When we was on the way out a women in no uniform and no badge

came up to my friend grabbed her and dragged her a side.

 

She had a terrible attitude and told her to put her phone away and told her to come with her.

The security guard who was in uniform asked me if I wanted to come with her so I followed.

 

We were told to wait in a room in primark for around a hour

while the women who dragged my friend by the arm

was calling us fat and names to someone outside the room.

 

My friend asked her what was happening as we had been waiting in the room for a long time

and she told us we where being prosecuted and the police where on their way.

 

10 minutes to the shops closing time

2 PSCO's came in and started ripping into us calling us ****

and saying I am sly because I do acting and

 

told us we are being given a civil recovery and if we don't pay it the PSCO themselves

will kick our doors down and take items out of our house at the same value

and when my friend said she can't do that only bailiffs can

she started getting defensive saying she can do it herself.

 

I haven't recieved the letter about the civil recovery yet but what do I do when I get it?!

 

When my friend went out to get a refund on her card for the 16pound for the shoes

he flirted with her and then told her we are probably looking at 130pound?!

 

I am 17 with no income!!

Edited August 14, 2014 by honeybee13

[mch1991]

RLP can do nothing. Same advice as everyone else, just ignore them and get on with your life. There was no loss so there is no claim that can be made.

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

I'll move your thread to the special forum for civil recovery problems and leave you a short term redirect from this forum.

 

HB

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

I agree with the poster above. Wait and see if a letter arrives and we'll help you then.

 

You won't need to pay RLP, but I would strongly advise against doing what you did again.

 

HB

[citizenB]

Dont PCSOs wear some kind of body video ?

[Sparks_]

I would be putting a formal complaint in to both Primark and your police commissioner, no matter what you have done they are not allowed to resort to name calling and threats of violence against you!

[renegadeimp]

OP, we need you to confirm what you stated in your OP. Was that the actual events that happened? As if so, it is a very serious accusation indeed.

[silverfox1961]

Hi and welcome.

 

Unless they have video evidence of what occurred, this could end up as a he said/she said scenario.

 

What is of more concern is as you are under 18 (is your friend under 18 too?) is thaat RLP will initially write to you or your friend or both of you and if you fail to reply, they will then send a letter saying if you fail to respond, they will contact your parents.

 

To avoid this happening, a simple letter denying any liability to them and also to inform them that you refuse them permission to write to any other party.(send by signed for delivery to ensure they received it and keep the receipt) Once that is done, if they then contact any parent, you can have them for breaches of the Data Protection Act.

[Stigman]

2 PSCO's came in and started ripping into us calling us ****

and saying I am sly because I do acting and

told us we are being given a civil recovery and if we don't pay it the PSCO themselves

will kick our doors down and take items out of our house at the same value

and when my friend said she can't do that only bailiffs can

she started getting defensive saying she can do it herself.

 

I would also make a complaint to the IPCC about the two PSCO's...

http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/complaints

 

This is one of my big problems with PCSO's, they have mainly been employed in menial employment, having been bullied throughout their lives so are now able to act tough, bully people around & take their revenge out on society.

 

Stigman

[problemswitho2]

This is almost all too bizarre to be real.

 

Did the PCSO's explain to you that you were being detained? Did the security inform you that you were under arrest? Why were you not taking to a custody suite? Did you admit anything to the security or PCSO's? Again it's all a bit bizarre.

 

Complaining to the IPCC whilst on paper a good idea will come to nothing. Personally I'd file or paperwork in the bin and forget about it. Nothing will happen now.

[renegadeimp]

In my opinion, we havent heard the full story. Lets see if the OP comes back.

[Ames123]

Hi and welcome.

 

Unless they have video evidence of what occurred, this could end up as a he said/she said scenario.

 

What is of more concern is as you are under 18 (is your friend under 18 too?) is thaat RLP will initially write to you or your friend or both of you and if you fail to reply, they will then send a letter saying if you fail to respond, they will contact your parents.

 

To avoid this happening, a simple letter denying any liability to them and also to inform them that you refuse them permission to write to any other party.(send by signed for delivery to ensure they received it and keep the receipt) Once that is done, if they then contact any parent, you can have them for breaches of the Data Protection Act.

 

My mum knows what has happened but not about the fine as we are in financial difficulties. There was a camera pointing at me in the room but I don't know if it would of picked up the sound?

 

OP, we need you to confirm what you stated in your OP. Was that the actual events that happened? As if so, it is a very serious accusation indeed.

 

Everything I said happened.

 

Dont PCSOs wear some kind of body video ?

 

There was a camera in the room pointing at me.

[problemswitho2]

My mum knows what has happened but not about the fine as we are in financial difficulties. There was a camera pointing at me in the room but I don't know if it would of picked up the sound?

 

 

 

Everything I said happened.

 

 

 

There was a camera in the room pointing at me.

 

Okay - there is no "fine" only a court can impose a fine. What you will get is a glorified invoice. Follow everyone's advice on here and ignore it. File it in the bin and ignore any other letters they send you.

 

There is nothing more to add to this. No PCSO is going to come to your house, no one is going to come to your house full stop. It's up to you if you believe this, but it's right.

 

Have a nice life now. Don't steal, don't [problem] and move on from this. You got lucky. Congratulations.

[silverfox1961]

I'm glad your mum knows. A problem shared etc...

 

We cannot even say whether RLP will write to you or not as your role was very minor and they may go after your friend for the full sum demanded so it is well worth pointing her to CAG.

 

They state that they will keep video footage as evidence of crime should the case go to court. If you want a copy of the video you will need to send a SAR to primark as the security staff work for them. RLP may have a copy and if so, you are entitled to a copy as part of your defence.

 

The end story is that if you are targeted by RLP, do not worry. RLP cannot take anyone to court. RLP may pass this fictitious amount to a debt collector who can also not take court action. Primark cannot be bothered to take action.

 

If you were to look at the RLP website, the last case that went to court was over 2 years ago. If Primark/RLP were so sure of themselves, more cases would be listed.

 

This is due to a case in 2012 where a retailer and RLP were soundly beaten in the civil courts.

[ericsbrother]

If the store send RLP a copy of the cctv they are in breach of the DPA if they do so without your permission.

I bet all of this goes nowhere other than the standard letters from RLP. The PCSO was making a noise to try and scare you into thinking that this can come back anf haunt you- it cant. They have no powers other than those posessed by the person in the street.

If there is furhter police interest you will be entitled to see any evidence they have, even if they dont intend using it so those recordings will do the PCSO's no favours whatsoever if they actually exist by now.

[silverfox1961]

If the store send RLP a copy of the cctv they are in breach of the DPA

 

I bet they would quote the exemption on the grounds of preventing and detecting crime where no permission is needed.

[gtman]

When we was on the way out a women in no uniform and no badge

came up to my friend grabbed her and dragged her a side.

 

Primark has uncover security officers, Mainly just one. No badge is worn by the undercover security

 

We were told to wait in a room in primark for around a hour

while the women who dragged my friend by the arm

was calling us fat and names to someone outside the room.

 

There are two rooms that are used for holding people, in primark own managers office or a security room.

 

 

 

10 minutes to the shops closing time

2 PSCO's came in and started ripping into us calling us ****

and saying I am sly because I do acting and

 

told us we are being given a civil recovery and if we don't pay it the PSCO themselves

will kick our doors down and take items out of our house at the same value

and when my friend said she can't do that only bailiffs can

she started getting defensive saying she can do it herself.

 

You say the shoes are like £20, that won't stand up in court. The worst that will happen for a thief under something like 100-500 is a fine unless there a ton of evidence ect.

 

1) ask any member of staff of primark for their name, they will give you their first name as on their badge. (security is different)

2) Report any problems to a manager, depending on the case (you said you was called names) means that a primark manager will have to write a report on the primark system. This report is then view able by the head office. Any complaints write a letter or contact head office and they will pull up the report (if any was done).

3) If you were going to leave the store, all exits are covered by CCTV (can see the monitors as you leave above you) if you feel they used unnecessary force to stop you just complain. They should just ask you to come to one side if you have not left the store. If you leave the store then they can stop you.

[renegadeimp]

If you leave the store and you have shoplifted, they CAN stop you. They can chase you down the street and use reasonable force to restrain you until the police arrive.

[caledfwlch]

Renegade, only if they have witnessed and can back up that witnessing ie by cctv - an any persons arrest on suspicion alone is assault and unlawful detention.

 

OP how long did the PCSO's themselves hold you? Afaik a PCSO can only detain you 30 mins until a real policeman arrives.

 

It is time schools taught children their legal rights in a wide range of issues - most people for example a Security Guards have some sort of special powers or rights when in reality they have no more power than the drunken tramp sleeping in the street outside.

 

Plenty of idiots who attempt to use Any Persons Arrest without understanding its limitations and the responsibilities of using it have ended up with criminal records, fines and compensation orders even though the "victim" was it turns out guilty.

 

I think the famous one was the employer who believed an employee had stolen money - employer and co workers jumped on him, tied him up stuck on a sign saying Theif and marched him through the busy town centre to the cop shop.

I believe the criminal charges were assault, unlawful restraint/detention and possibly kidnap, the civil case cost the employer a shedload iirc to use the legal term

 

If you leave the store and you have shoplifted, they CAN stop you. They can chase you down the street and use reasonable force to restrain you until the police arrive.

[ericsbrother]

the case you quote the bloke was caught red-handed but that didnt matter, the restraint and humiliation was enough to get the businessman done for assault and sued for the parading of the bloke down the street.

It is all down to what is reasonable and since the person was known to the accuser he should have just reported the crime and the police could then arrest for an indictable offence.

[Bandit127]

the case you quote the bloke was caught red-handed but that didnt matter, the restraint and humiliation was enough to get the businessman done for assault and sued for the parading of the bloke down the street.

It is all down to what is reasonable and since the person was known to the accuser he should have just reported the crime and the police could then arrest for an indictable offence.

For anyone else interested but doesn't know.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-12473446

The "thief" got a caution, the employer and his "accomplices" had charges dropped. But the employer paid £13,000 in an out of civil court settlement.