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    • This is the other sign  parking sign 1a.pdf
    • 4 means that they need to name and then tell the people who will be affected that there has been an application made, what the application relates to (specificially "whether it relates to the exercise of the court’s jurisdiction in relation to P’s property and affairs, or P’s personal welfare, or to both) and what this application contains (i.e what order they want made as a result of it) 5 just means that teh court think it is important that the relevant people are notified 7 means that the court need more information to make the application, hence they have then made the order of paragraph 1 which requires the applicant to do more - this means the court can't make a decision with the current information, and need more, hence paragraph one of the order is for the applicant to do more. paragraph 3 of the order gives you the ability to have it set aside, although if it was made in january you are very late. Were you notiifed of the application or not?    
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Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
    • Unless I've got an incorrect copy of the relevant regulation: The PCN is only deemed to have arrived two days after dispatch "unless the contrary is proved" in which case date of delivery does matter (not just date of posting) and I would like clarification of the required standard of proof. It seems perhaps this hasn't been tested. Since post is now barcoded for the Post Office's own tracking purposes perhaps there is some way I can get that evidence from the Post Office...
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Lowells/Cap1 2005 - CCA return - fold App Form + V10 T&C's - enforceable?


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Received a letter from FPC (Fredrickson) for debt collection on behalf of Capital One.

 

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/FPCforCap1.jpg

 

Thats another unlawfull thing done by Capital one as the account is still in Dispute and have appointed a debt collection agent to collect.

 

Cap 1 are getting on my nerves now as they seem to ignor every letter and request sent to them.

 

Mark

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I sent a letter to FPC informing them that Cap 1 are still in dispute.

 

Today I received a letter from Debitas Legal Services informing me they have been instructed to collect the outstanding balance.

 

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/DebitasCap11-2.jpg

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/DebitasCap12-2.jpg

 

who are "Debitas" and what should my reply be?

 

Many thx

 

Mark

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You can try BRW's letter below.

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

This account is in Dispute .

 

On xx/xx/2009 I wrote to your client requesting that xxxxxxx supply me a true copy of the executed credit agreement for this account.

In response to this request I was supplied a mere set of terms and conditions by your client, which does not comply with the requirements of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

The document sent purporting to be a credit agreement does not contain any of the prescribed terms as required by section 60(1) Consumer Credit Act 1974. The Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553) made under the authority of the “1974 Act” sets out what the prescribed terms are, I refer you to Schedule 6 Column 2 of SI 1983/1553 for the definition of what is required. Suffice to say none of the terms are present in the document. In addition, this cannot be a true copy of an agreement, that your client alleges I have signed.

 

Since this document does not contain the required prescribed terms it is rendered unenforceable by s127 (3) consumer Credit Act 1974, which states

 

127(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under section 65(1) if section 61(1)(a)(signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner).

 

This situation is backed by case law from the Lords of Appeal in Ordinary (House of Lords) the highest court in the land. Your attention is drawn to the authority of the House of Lords in Wilson-v- FCT [2003] All ER (D) 187 (Jul) which confirms that where a document does not contain the required terms under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 the agreement cannot be enforced.

 

In addition should your client continue to pursue me for this debt they will be in breach of the OFT guidelines, I draw your attention to the Office of Fair Trading’s guidance on debt collection

The OFT guidance which was issued July 2003 (updated December 2006) relating to debt collections and what the OFT considers unfair, I refer to page 5 of the guidance which states;

 

2.6 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

 

h. Ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment.

 

I am granting your client a further 7 days to produce a compliant copy of my credit agreement to confirm if I am indeed liable to your client or any organisation, which you represent for this alleged debt. If your client cannot do so I require written clarification that this is the case. Should your client ignore this request I will report them to the Office of Fair Trading to consider your clients suitability to hold a credit licence in addition to a complaint to Trading Standards, as your client will be in breach of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40

 

Since the agreement is unenforceable at this time and the default notice is non compliant, it would be in everyone’s interest to consider the matter closed and for your client to write the debt off. I suggest you give serious consideration to this as any attempt of litigation will be vigorously defended and I will counter claim for all quantifiable damages

 

I trust this outlines the situation

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Many thx again vint1954, will send off today.

 

Its not only Cap 1 who does not have a clue...

 

I received letter today dated 9th Sept, from Debitas stating I have not responded to their previous letter....the funny thing about this is the previous letter was only dated the 8th Sept???..They dont give you much time to respond do they :rolleyes:

 

Also received today is this letter..

 

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/CAP1confirmedresident.jpg

 

But I have responded to the one and only letter from Fredrickson FPC the following day...

 

What a bunch of retards.....

 

I think this joke can be related to Cap 1.

 

"Every year A Billionaire business man asks his son what he would like for xmas, one year his son asked for a Train set so his dad bought him British Rail, the following year he asks for a Toy Plane so his dad got him British Airways...this year his son asked for a Cowboy Outfit so he is going to get him Capital One!!."

 

Mark

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Well, they do not have an obbligation to call you, contact you, yes.

 

You can respond insisting that all communications are in writing, quoting that you require this as an anti identity theft proceedure, but insist that you will not answer their calls.

 

Addapt this letter.

Ref Account xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

Dear xxxxxxxxx,

 

I was somewhat bemused to receive your letter of xxxxxxxxx 2009, the content of which is noted. No debt to your company is acknowledged.

 

I refer you to my letter dated ( Date of last letter sent on this account ). You are fully aware that this alleged account was placed in dispute on the xxxxxxxxx 2009. It should not be necessary to have to remind you that the provisions of s.78(6) now apply. These letters are enclosed.

 

In the circumstances, your threat of continued collection activites would appear to be a breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and the Office of Fair Trading Guidance on Debt Collection and your attention is drawn to this guidance document. I would also draw your attention to SECTION 40 OF THE ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE ACT “S40 Punishment for unlawful harassment of debtors.

 

Your attention is also drawn the ICO on Data protection, as passing details on to a third party while an account is in dispute is contrary to the Data Protection Act. I have previously issued letters to MBNA under s10 of this act. You may wish to refresh yourselves of the implications of ignoring the Data Protection Act.

 

Should you attempt litigation it will be vigorously defended and the failure to supply documentation under the CCA 1974 is a complete defence to any legal action and your actions will be considered vexatious and unlawful. The Court's attention will drawn to the above statutory breaches . Furthermore, I reserve the right to bring the conduct of your client to the Court when the issue of costs is being considered.

 

 

I would remind you that while this alleged account remains in dispute, that MBNA:

  • May not ask for payment against this account.
  • I am not obliged to offer any payment against this account.
  • Cannot register any data with a third party.
  • Cannot take any enforcement action, including registering Defaults.
  • Cannot pass the account on to a third party for collection.
  • Cannot sell the account.

I trust this out lines the situation and that you will take note of my comments, to avoid any further breaches of the Law, being committed by you.

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Also have a look at this below regarding harassment.

 

HARASSMENT

•The relevant section of the Administration of Justice Act • The Office of Fair Trading (OFT) Debt Collection Guidance on harassment • How to deal with harassment by your creditors. SECTION 40 OF THE ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE ACT “S40 Punishment for unlawful harassment of debtors.

A person commits an offence if, with the object of coercing another person to pay money claimed from the other as a debt due under a contract he-

(a) harasses the other with demands for payment which, in respect of their frequency, or the manner or occasion of making any such demand, or of any threat or publicity by which any demand is accompanied, are calculated to subject him or members of his family or household to alarm, distress or humiliation;

(b) falsely represents, in relation to the money claimed, that criminal proceedings lie for failure to pay it;

© falsely represents himself to be authorised in some official capacity to claim or enforce payment; or

(d) utters a document falsely represented by him to have some official character, or purporting to have some official character which he know it has not. (2) A person may be guilty of an offence by virtue of sub-section (1) (a) above if he concerts with others in the taking of such actions as is described in that paragraph, notwithstanding that his own course of conduct does not by itself amount to harassment.”

Many activities could count as harassment. It is important to note that “anything done by a person which is reasonable” when trying to recover a debt, is not considered to be harassment. Both the Office of Fair Trading and trade associations (run by the credit industry) have produced guidance on what activities may be considered harassment and should therefore be avoided by creditors. The following list is taken from the new Debt Collection Guidance for holders of consumer credit licences. Creditors are warned by the Office of Fair Trading under the Debt Collection Guidance that the following practices are "considered unfair"

Harassment of people in debt by creditors or their agents is a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970. It is often difficult to know what to do when you feel a creditor is not dealing with your account fairly. In order for you to identify what activities by your creditors may involve harassment and what can be done about the problem, this act sheet outlines:

“IT IS UNFAIR TO COMMUNICATE, IN WHATEVER FORM, WITH CONSUMERS IN AN UNCLEAR, INACCURATE OR MISLEADING MANNER.This includes:

  • Letters that look like court claims
  • Not making it clear who the company is or what their role is
  • Unhelpful legal language
  • Not giving balance statements about the debt when asked
  • Contacting you at unreasonable times even when asked not to
  • Asking you to contact them on premium rate phone numbers.

“THOSE CONTACTING DEBTORS MUST NOT BE DECEITFUL BY MISREPRESENTING THEIR AUTHORITY AND/OR THE CORRECT LEGAL POSITION.This includes:

  • Claiming to work for the court or be a bailiff
  • Implying action can be taken that is not legally possible such as implying they could take your property
  • Using a business name or logo that implies they are a government body
  • Implying that court action has been taken against you when it hasn’t
  • Implying not paying your debt is a criminal offence
  • Threatening to take court action in England if you live in Scotland or the other way round.

“PUTTING PRESSURE ON DEBTORS OR THIRD PARTIES IS CONSIDERED TO BE OPPRESSIVE.” This includes:

  • Contacting you too frequently
  • Pressurising you to sell property or take out more debt
  • Using more than one collection company at the same time or not telling you when your debt has been passed to another company
  • Pressurising you to pay in full or in large instalments you cannot afford
  • Making threatening gestures or statements
  • Ignoring disputes about whether you owe the money
  • Trying to embarrass you in public or threatening to tell a third party about your debts such as a neighbour or your family.

“DEALINGS WITH DEBTORS ARE NOT TO BE DECEITFUL AND/OR UNFAIR.Examples include:

  • Sending letters addressed to “the occupier” or discussing the debt with someone without knowing if they are you
  • Refusing to deal with an adviser acting on your behalf
  • Not accepting reasonable offers or passing on payments you make Refusing to freeze action if you dispute the debt.

“CHARGES SHOULD NOT BE LEVIED UNFAIRLY”. Examples include:

  • Claiming collection costs when the original credit agreement didn’t allow this to happen and making you think you are legally liable for the costs
  • Not putting the specific amounts that can be added for collection costs in the original credit agreement Adding unreasonable charges.

“THOSE VISITING DEBTORS MUST NOT ACT IN AN UNCLEAR OR THREATENING MANNER.”

  • Collectors should explain the reason for any visit and give you notice of the time and date they will call
  • They shouldn’t visit if they know you are ill or vulnerable and if they find you are unwell or distressed they should leave
  • They should not come in if you do not want them to and should leave when you ask them to They shouldn’t visit you at work or somewhere like a hospital

HOW TO DEAL WITH HARASSMENT BY YOUR CREDITORS

The first step is to write to a creditor and outline your concerns about the company’s behaviour. Inform them that you are familiar with the terms of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act and ask that the creditor takes steps to avoid similar occurrences in the future. Tell your creditors how you would prefer to be contacted and ask that they confirm their agreement to this. A letter at this stage may avoid the need to take further action against the company.

Tell them you are aware of the OFT Debt Collection Guidance and that you will consider making a complaint about their behaviour under the guidance.

It is usually difficult to persuade the police to prosecute in cases of harassment unless a more serious offence such as violence, fraud or blackmail is also involved. Normally complaints should be made to the trading standards/consumer protection department at your local council. They should investigate whether an offence has been committed and whether prosecution is appropriate.

The penalty is a fine of up to £5,000 in the Magistrates Court. Also a conviction is likely to provide evidence that the creditor is no longer a ‘fit and proper person’ to hold a consumer credit licence.

If Trading Standards will not act it may be worth contacting the Office of Fair Trading directly. The address is at the end of the sheet. The OFT does not usually take up individual complaints but their Debt Collection Enforcement Team collects information that can be used to take action against creditors who can lose their consumer credit licence.

The creditor may be a member of a trade association with a code of practice. You could find out if your creditor is a member of a trade association and write to them with your complaint. A code of practice is not legally enforceable but the association may take some action against their members. Details of the main trade associations are at the end of the sheet under “Useful Addresses”

OTHER OPTIONS

Another alternative is for you to pursue your own prosecution in the Magistrates Court. This could involve considerable cost so you need to obtain proper legal advice first. BT have a new service called "Choose to Refuse" which might help if you are getting a lot of calls from an unpleasant creditor. You have to key in a pin number after a call. The caller will then get an automated message if you don’t wish to take their call when they ring.

If you receive a telephone service from another provider, contact them and ask if they have a similar service. You could refer to the Malicious Communications Act 1988. This deals with the sending of letters or articles for the purpose of causing “distress or anxiety”. A person found guilty can be fined in the Magistrates Court. To prosecute successfully, the letter or article sent would have to convey:

  • A message which is indecent or grossly offensive
  • A threat; or Information which is false and known or believed to be false by the sender.

The Criminal Justice Act & Public Order Act 1994 Section 4a makes it a criminal offence to cause “Harassment, alarm or distress” with intent by using “threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour”. This can only be an offence if it happens in a public place not in your own home. The police would need to be contacted and prosecute for this offence.

The Protection from Harassment Act 1997 makes it a criminal offence to harass people and put “people in fear of violence. The harassment must happen on at least 2 separate occasions. The police would have to agree to prosecute for this offence.

USEFUL ADDRESSES

The Finance & Leasing Association (FLA) 2nd Floor, Imperial House 15-19 Kingsway London WC2B 6UN Tel No: 020 7836 6511 www.fla.org.uk

The Consumer Credit Trade Association (CCTA) Suite 8, The Wool Exchange 10 Hustlergate Bradford BD1 1RE Tel: 01274 390 380 www.ccta.co.uk

Credit Services Association Ltd (CSA) (For Debt Collection Agencies) Wingrove House 2nd Floor East Ponteland Road Newcastle upon Tyne NE5 3DP Tel: 0191 286 5656 www.csa-uk.com

Consumer Credit Association (CCAUK) Queens House Queens Road Chester CH1 3BQ Tel No: 01244 312 044 Promoting business and consumer relations in the credit industry – Consumer Credit Association – United Kingdom Mail Order Traders’ Association (MOTA) 7 Floor 100 Old Hall Street Liverpool L3 9TD Tel: 0151 227 9456 (No website)

Office of Fair Trading Fleetbank House 2 – 6 Salisbury Square London EC4Y 8JX Tel No: 08457 224 499 www.oft.gov.uk

If your complaint is against a solicitors firm acting for a creditor, a complaint can be made to: Consumer Complaints Service The Law Society Victoria Court 8 Dormer Place Leamington Spa CV32 5AE Tel No: 0845 608 6565 www.lawsociety.org.uk

Trading standards departments are local to your area.

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I also got this letter today off a company called "Power 2 Contact" acting on behalf of Debitas asking me to get in contact with Debitas or they will send someone to my home to resolve the matter!.

 

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/Power2Contact1.jpg

 

My god Cap 1 dont get the message do they!

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They ignore it all, so have some fun with them.

 

Karen Hillyer

Power to Contact

Westmere Court

Westmere Drive

Crewe Business Park

CW1 6ZG

 

xxxxxx 2009.

 

Dear Ms Hillyer,

 

Ref xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

This account is in serious dispute with xxxxxxxxx, the details of which are none of your concern. You must however read and digest the contents of this letter.

 

TAKE URGENT NOTE:

 

I DO NOT WISH TO RECEIVE ANY REPRESENTATIVE OF YOUR ORGANISATION, OR INDEED AN AGENT OR REPRESENTATIVE EMPLOYED BY ANY ORGANISATION THAT YOU ISSUE INSTRUCTIONS TO.

 

There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.)

 

THEREFORE TAKE NOTE THAT I REVOKE LICENSE UNDER COMMON LAW FOR YOU, OR YOUR REPRESENTATIVES TO VISIT ME AT MY PROPERTY AND IF YOU DO SO, THEN YOU WILL BE LIABLE FOR DAMAGES FOR A TORT OF TRESSPASS AND ACTION WILL BE TAKEN, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO , POLICE ATTENDANCE.

 

I also caution you here that should you ignore my request on this point, the actions of your representative(s) will happily be recorded either by CCTV or by telephone recording equipment – whichever is applicable. Accordingly I reserve the right to use any evidence of you or your representatives’ ignoring this request in connection with any actions that I choose to pursue, including media exposure.

 

Should it be your intention to disregard my wishes, and break your obligations, please be advised that the following rules also apply, as laid down by the OFT in respect of debt collection, and that you, as a holder of a consumer credit license, are obliged to follow:

 

The areas of the OFT guidance which applies to you in this instance are:

 

 

Debt collection visits

2.12 Examples of unfair practices are:

 

a. not making the purpose of any proposed visit clear, for example, merely stating that collectors or field agents will call is not sufficient

 

f. visiting or threatening to visit debtors without prior agreement when the debt is deadlocked or disputed

 

Deceptive and/or unfair methods

 

2.8 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

 

k. not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt.

 

Please note you may also consider this letter as a statutory notice under section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect. This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any third parties and credit reference agencies.

 

Please confirm that you have read and understood these two legal notices and have complied with my requests.

 

If Power 2 Contact choose to ignore this letter and continue to process my information, then you will be complicit in the current breaches under the Data protection act. I am sure that Power 2 Contact will be aware of the penalties and fines involved, which are cociderable.

 

I do believe this makes my position clear and unambiguous.

 

 

Yours faithfully

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That should do it... that's a fab letter vint1954

 

Debitas are relentless... then eventually (after what seems a million phone calls at all hours of the day) when they finally realise you are not going to converse on the phone with them, crap one then get 'Power 2 Contact' on the case.

 

I sent a similar letter to 'Power 2 Contact'... and they replied on a photocopied template letter with my details written in with what looked suspiciously like school girl fat writing (you know they type, lol) saying they have forwarded my letter to crap 1 and that all future correspondences should be made to the client directly.

 

If they are relentless with you... then you be relentless with them... send letter after letter... explaining (in a sophisticated way of course) that they obviously can not understand plain english or have the skills to action your letters.

 

Don't let them phase you or worry you... you are in good hands here.

 

:-)

Moodle

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The usual tripe with P2C is a letter stating that they are visiting you as you have lost contact with your creditor. That in 99.9% of cases is an obvious fabrication.

 

Once you have pointed out that you are in contact with your creditor, refused permission for them to visit you, any visit must be classed as harassment. If this happens, complain to TS, copy P2C and the creditor in on the complaint.

 

The time is long past when we should be all pressing home these operators modus operandi, to the authorities.

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HARASSMENT

•The relevant section of the Administration of Justice Act • The Office of Fair Trading (OFT) Debt Collection Guidance on harassment • How to deal with harassment by your creditors. SECTION 40 OF THE ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE ACT “S40 Punishment for unlawful harassment of debtors.

A person commits an offence if, with the object of coercing another person to pay money claimed from the other as a debt due under a contract he-

(a) harasses the other with demands for payment which, in respect of their frequency, or the manner or occasion of making any such demand, or of any threat or publicity by which any demand is accompanied, are calculated to subject him or members of his family or household to alarm, distress or humiliation;

(b) falsely represents, in relation to the money claimed, that criminal proceedings lie for failure to pay it;

© falsely represents himself to be authorised in some official capacity to claim or enforce payment; or

(d) utters a document falsely represented by him to have some official character, or purporting to have some official character which he know it has not. (2) A person may be guilty of an offence by virtue of sub-section (1) (a) above if he concerts with others in the taking of such actions as is described in that paragraph, notwithstanding that his own course of conduct does not by itself amount to harassment.”

Many activities could count as harassment. It is important to note that “anything done by a person which is reasonable” when trying to recover a debt, is not considered to be harassment. Both the Office of Fair Trading and trade associations (run by the credit industry) have produced guidance on what activities may be considered harassment and should therefore be avoided by creditors. The following list is taken from the new Debt Collection Guidance for holders of consumer credit licences. Creditors are warned by the Office of Fair Trading under the Debt Collection Guidance that the following practices are "considered unfair"

Harassment of people in debt by creditors or their agents is a criminal offence under the Administration of Justice Act 1970. It is often difficult to know what to do when you feel a creditor is not dealing with your account fairly. In order for you to identify what activities by your creditors may involve harassment and what can be done about the problem, this act sheet outlines:

“IT IS UNFAIR TO COMMUNICATE, IN WHATEVER FORM, WITH CONSUMERS IN AN UNCLEAR, INACCURATE OR MISLEADING MANNER.This includes:

  • Letters that look like court claims
  • Not making it clear who the company is or what their role is
  • Unhelpful legal language
  • Not giving balance statements about the debt when asked
  • Contacting you at unreasonable times even when asked not to
  • Asking you to contact them on premium rate phone numbers.

“THOSE CONTACTING DEBTORS MUST NOT BE DECEITFUL BY MISREPRESENTING THEIR AUTHORITY AND/OR THE CORRECT LEGAL POSITION.This includes:

  • Claiming to work for the court or be a bailiff
  • Implying action can be taken that is not legally possible such as implying they could take your property
  • Using a business name or logo that implies they are a government body
  • Implying that court action has been taken against you when it hasn’t
  • Implying not paying your debt is a criminal offence
  • Threatening to take court action in England if you live in Scotland or the other way round.

“PUTTING PRESSURE ON DEBTORS OR THIRD PARTIES IS CONSIDERED TO BE OPPRESSIVE.” This includes:

  • Contacting you too frequently
  • Pressurising you to sell property or take out more debt
  • Using more than one collection company at the same time or not telling you when your debt has been passed to another company
  • Pressurising you to pay in full or in large instalments you cannot afford
  • Making threatening gestures or statements
  • Ignoring disputes about whether you owe the money
  • Trying to embarrass you in public or threatening to tell a third party about your debts such as a neighbour or your family.

“DEALINGS WITH DEBTORS ARE NOT TO BE DECEITFUL AND/OR UNFAIR.Examples include:

  • Sending letters addressed to “the occupier” or discussing the debt with someone without knowing if they are you
  • Refusing to deal with an adviser acting on your behalf
  • Not accepting reasonable offers or passing on payments you make Refusing to freeze action if you dispute the debt.

“CHARGES SHOULD NOT BE LEVIED UNFAIRLY”. Examples include:

  • Claiming collection costs when the original credit agreement didn’t allow this to happen and making you think you are legally liable for the costs
  • Not putting the specific amounts that can be added for collection costs in the original credit agreement
  • Adding unreasonable charges.

“THOSE VISITING DEBTORS MUST NOT ACT IN AN UNCLEAR OR THREATENING MANNER.”

  • Collectors should explain the reason for any visit and give you notice of the time and date they will call
  • They shouldn’t visit if they know you are ill or vulnerable and if they find you are unwell or distressed they should leave
  • They should not come in if you do not want them to and should leave when you ask them to They shouldn’t visit you at work or somewhere like a hospital

HOW TO DEAL WITH HARASSMENT BY YOUR CREDITORS

The first step is to write to a creditor and outline your concerns about the company’s behaviour. Inform them that you are familiar with the terms of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act and ask that the creditor takes steps to avoid similar occurrences in the future. Tell your creditors how you would prefer to be contacted and ask that they confirm their agreement to this. A letter at this stage may avoid the need to take further action against the company.

Tell them you are aware of the OFT Debt Collection Guidance and that you will consider making a complaint about their behaviour under the guidance.

It is usually difficult to persuade the police to prosecute in cases of harassment unless a more serious offence such as violence, fraud or blackmail is also involved. Normally complaints should be made to the trading standards/consumer protection department at your local council. They should investigate whether an offence has been committed and whether prosecution is appropriate.

The penalty is a fine of up to £5,000 in the Magistrates Court. Also a conviction is likely to provide evidence that the creditor is no longer a ‘fit and proper person’ to hold a consumer credit licence.

If Trading Standards will not act it may be worth contacting the Office of Fair Trading directly. The address is at the end of the sheet. The OFT does not usually take up individual complaints but their Debt Collection Enforcement Team collects information that can be used to take action against creditors who can lose their consumer credit licence.

The creditor may be a member of a trade association with a code of practice. You could find out if your creditor is a member of a trade association and write to them with your complaint. A code of practice is not legally enforceable but the association may take some action against their members. Details of the main trade associations are at the end of the sheet under “Useful Addresses”

OTHER OPTIONS

Another alternative is for you to pursue your own prosecution in the Magistrates Court. This could involve considerable cost so you need to obtain proper legal advice first. BT have a new service called "Choose to Refuse" which might help if you are getting a lot of calls from an unpleasant creditor. You have to key in a pin number after a call. The caller will then get an automated message if you don’t wish to take their call when they ring.

If you receive a telephone service from another provider, contact them and ask if they have a similar service. You could refer to the Malicious Communications Act 1988. This deals with the sending of letters or articles for the purpose of causing “distress or anxiety”. A person found guilty can be fined in the Magistrates Court. To prosecute successfully, the letter or article sent would have to convey:

  • A message which is indecent or grossly offensive
  • A threat; or Information which is false and known or believed to be false by the sender.

The Criminal Justice Act & Public Order Act 1994 Section 4a makes it a criminal offence to cause “Harassment, alarm or distress” with intent by using “threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour”. This can only be an offence if it happens in a public place not in your own home. The police would need to be contacted and prosecute for this offence.

The Protection from Harassment Act 1997 makes it a criminal offence to harass people and put “people in fear of violence. The harassment must happen on at least 2 separate occasions. The police would have to agree to prosecute for this offence.

USEFUL ADDRESSES

The Finance & Leasing Association (FLA) 2nd Floor, Imperial House 15-19 Kingsway London WC2B 6UN Tel No: 020 7836 6511 www.fla.org.uk

The Consumer Credit Trade Association (CCTA) Suite 8, The Wool Exchange 10 Hustlergate Bradford BD1 1RE Tel: 01274 390 380 www.ccta.co.uk

Credit Services Association Ltd (CSA) (For Debt Collection Agencies) Wingrove House 2nd Floor East Ponteland Road Newcastle upon Tyne NE5 3DP Tel: 0191 286 5656 www.csa-uk.com

Consumer Credit Association (CCAUK) Queens House Queens Road Chester CH1 3BQ Tel No: 01244 312 044 Promoting business and consumer relations in the credit industry – Consumer Credit Association – United Kingdom Mail Order Traders’ Association (MOTA) 7 Floor 100 Old Hall Street Liverpool L3 9TD Tel: 0151 227 9456 (No website)

Office of Fair Trading Fleetbank House 2 – 6 Salisbury Square London EC4Y 8JX Tel No: 08457 224 499 www.oft.gov.uk

If your complaint is against a solicitors firm acting for a creditor, a complaint can be made to: Consumer Complaints Service The Law Society Victoria Court 8 Dormer Place Leamington Spa CV32 5AE Tel No: 0845 608 6565 www.lawsociety.org.uk

Trading standards departments are local to your area.

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Just received a letter from Debitas requesting I call them immediatly or we will consider taking action....

 

Debitas now seem to ignor every letter I send to them..I have previously informed them on 2 occasions that Cap 1 are still in dispute, but they never seem to acknowledge my letters.

 

Here is their letter:

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/DebitasCap1L3.jpg

 

Is it worth replying again informing them that Cap 1 are still in dispute?

 

Many thx in advance

 

Mark

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I would say it's one of there scare tactics to get you to call them.

 

If you can be bothered, I would respond in writing stating something like:

 

Dear Debitas

 

With regards to your letter, dated XX/XX/XXXX. I am somewhat bemused that Debitas feel I have 'failed to take any action regarding my debt' considering the amount of written correspondence that I have sent to Debitas regarding this account.

 

I am still waiting for letters dated XX/XX/XX and XX/XX/XX to be addressed.

 

I would also like to remind you that I require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only and that harassing me by telephone will put you in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127.

 

In addition, passing the debt onto on an external debt collection agency while the account is in dispute would be not only be in breach of the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 in line with the Office Of Fair Trading's debt collection guidelines, but also in breach of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Data Protection Act 1998.

 

Yours truly,

debtuptomyeyeballs

Moodle

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Just received a letter from Debitas requesting I call them immediatly or we will consider taking action....

 

Debitas now seem to ignor every letter I send to them..I have previously informed them on 2 occasions that Cap 1 are still in dispute, but they never seem to acknowledge my letters.

 

Here is their letter:

http://i1019.photobucket.com/albums/af319/Ukmark319/DebitasCap1L3.jpg

 

Is it worth replying again informing them that Cap 1 are still in dispute?

 

Many thx in advance

Ref Account xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx In dispute with xxxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear xxxxxxxxx,

 

I was somewhat bemused to receive your letter of xxxxxxxxx 2009, the content of which is noted. No debt to your company or client is acknowledged.

 

On xxxxxxxxxx 2009 I made a formal request to your client pursuant to s.78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. xxxxx have failed to comply within the statutory time limit, supplying only a reconstituted copy of terms and conditions. In addition, this alleged account was placed in dispute on the xxxxxxxxx 2009. It should not be necessary to have to remind you that the provisions of s.78(6) now apply. These letters are enclosed.

 

In the circumstances, your threat of legal action would appear to be a breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and the Office of Fair Trading Guidance on Debt Collection and your attention is drawn to this guidance document.

Your attention is also drawn the ICO on Data protection, as passing details on to a third party while an account is in dispute is contrary to the Data Protection Act. I have previously issued letters to xxxxxxxxxx under s10 of this act. You may wish to refresh yourselves of the implications of ignoring the Data Protection Act.

Should you attempt litigation it will be vigorously defended and the failure to supply documentation under the CCA 1974 is a complete defence to any legal action and your actions will be considered vexatious and unlawful. The Court's attention will drawn to the above statutory breaches . Furthermore, I reserve the right to bring the conduct of your client to the Court when the issue of costs is being considered.

I would remind you that while this alleged account remains in dispute, that xxxxxxxxxx:

  • May not ask for payment against this account.
  • I am not obliged to offer any payment against this account.
  • Cannot register any data with a third party.
  • Cannot take any enforcement action, including registering Defaults.
  • Cannot pass the account on to a third party for collection.
  • Cannot sell the account.

I trust this out lines the situation and that you will take note of my comments, to avoid any further breaches of the Law, being committed by you.

 

 

 

 

Mark

Vint

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I know what you mean GTP, but having dealt with commercial contracts for a large part of my working life, I know it is important to have the last letter in the file.

 

 

I do see your point Vint and I am thinking it might be a good idea if we could get EVERYONE with a Crap One agreement or not to write in the next month to Crap One.

 

Why you may ask?

 

Well Christmas is coming and I could do with a nice few weeks temporary work up till then - get the pressies sorted and the Christmas Cheer, allow me to go to Cagmeet and cause mayhem. As I live within walking distance of their ofices and have considerable debt experience (not only as a consumer lol, I consider myself to be an ideal candidate.

 

Oh Nearly forgotI also have a degree in colouring and bullships from primary scholl. Spelling not too hot though.

 

 

GK

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