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    • Proportional representation would be a start, but I can't see the Conservatives voting for that now they've redrawn the constituency boundaries to suit themselves. Turkeys, Christmas and all that.
    • Sorry to hear about your problem, it's horrible when people take advantage like that.   I don't want to add to your woes, but road tax is not transferrable to a new owner so when he said 'road tax is paid so I have not to worry', he was wrong. See here:   https://www.gov.uk/sold-bought-vehicle   The last thing you need right now is another problem, so I'd either take the car off the road and make a SORN declaration or tax it as soon as possible. If you are planning on making life difficult for the seller then don't be surprised if he reports you for no tax!   I hope it all works out for you.
    • I recently purchased some wheels on eBay which were located at the other end of the country. The seller was happy for me to arrange a courier to collect them and I paid him for them.   I put a request for some quotes on Shiply and accepted one from a company with plenty of positive feedback, who claimed to be insured and would only take payment once the item was delivered. I paid a deposit of £8 immediately via PayPal.   Shortly after this, I recieved a message from the courier saying that because of Coronavirus they were no longer accepting payment at the door on delivery and would instead require payment by bank transfer two days before delivery. I paid the remaining fee of £44 as requested.   The day before delivery, I get a message from the seller say that he thinks the courier has collected the wrong items. I contact them immediately, and yes, they have collected the wrong items. They tell me that the seller was not present when they collected but had left a message at his works reception directing them to collect those items (the wrong ones). After I point out that they are wrong, they stop texting back.   I then get a message from the seller asking for my phone number so that we can figure out what to do. I send it, but have heard nothing from him since.   Today, while I was out, the courier has delivered the wrong items to my house an hour earlier than expected and my son has accepted them.   So, I wonder how to sort this out...   No doubt the courier will argue that they have done as directed and are not to blame. The seller will argue that he did not leave such a message/the courier misunderstood and he is not to blame either. So I get the sinking feeling that I will end up having to foot the bill for the wrong items to be returned AND the right ones to be delivered - only tripling the delivery cost!   Any suggestions??
    • Hi All, before I start I know there are similar threads of the topic I am raising, and each, of course, has its own unique scenario, which may benefit others. My case is as follows: 1. I saw a gumtree ad on the 16th of Oct 2020 for a Mercedes E220 CDI, priced at 7,500 2. I called the seller and said I will come over on the 17th of Oct 2020 to view. 3. On the 17th of Oct 2020 I went to his place where he is working and viewed the car. He is working for a major car rental company. I checked the car and of course asked the normal things to ask e.g. any insurance write-offs, loans, accidents, etc. The seller said the car is clean etc.no loan, he had a loan but all is paid off etc. and he has the papers. 4. I negotiated the car price to 6,800 because the rims were showing some signs of damage, the rear light had a small burst, cosmetics, etc. I checked all but did not see any sign of damage to the car (it's a black car, the car was a bit dirty, and the sun was already setting in) 5. We agreed on 6,800 and decided to purchase the car. We went into his office, where I paid cash, and also got a Car Sales Invoice with all details of the seller, and a V5C green slip 6. I purchased car insurance and drove off. I asked him about Road Tax and he said Road tax is paid so I have not to worry, just need car insurance. 7. On 18th of Oct 2020 I cleaned the car interior because it was really dirty inside - it took me a few hours so decided to clean the exterior the next day 8. On the 19th of Oct 2020 I went to clean the exterior and after the car was clean I noticed some parts were resprayed. I became a bit suspicious; so on the 19th of Oct 2020 in the eve, I went on the internet and run an HPI check. The outcome from the HPI did not show any accidents, insurance write-off but an outstanding Loan with Moneybarn. At this point, I thought maybe the database is not updated, etc. 9. On the 20th of Oct 2020, morning, things were going through my mind; the seller said the car is clean, no issues, no loan since he settled all etc. but the HPI reports say there is still some outstanding loan. So what I did, I called Moneybarn, and explained the situation, and gave them the contract number as well (since it was displayed on the HPI report). They said they will send me a form by email, but they cannot share any information due to Data Protection (GDPR). fair enough I thought, but what made me boil, they said they OWN the car! So, I took the car and drove to the seller where he is working. I confronted him. He said don't worry, I will handle it, he has no time, he is very busy and bla bla bla. I said what reasons do I have to trust you, you lied, and now you say you still have a debt, etc. So I said I will not leave until he has settled the debt, or repay me my money. I also asked what is outstanding, he said around 7,000. Well, since I confronted him at his workplace he may have felt the heat, he assured he will settle all soon, I said sorry, I need a date, so I said you will settle the debt with Moneybarn by 23 Oct 2020, if not, you will refund me my money. He said Ok he will do it, so I said, since I don't trust you, you will sign a piece of paper, and sign it. On the paper, he wrote "I will clear the debt for the Mercedes by Friday" and signed it. I said I am not happy and added the debt details with contract number, and also a clause that if he fails to settle the debt with Moneybarn by Friday the 23rd of Oct 2020, he will refund me my money, 6,800, and sales of the car Mercedes, license plate, will be void. Also, I said to put an initial on each amendment I made with signature. He did, and I left. 10. On 22 Oct I sent him a message, to remind him to settle the debt by Friday 23 Oct 2020 noontime and also I outlined some legal jargon I had to sent that I received from citizensadvice. 11. On 23 Oct, morning time, I received a message from the seller, he said he will not/cannot refund me the money, not to visit him at his office or place, and that he feels threatened by me. 12. Now, the dilemma/headache; a). I received the form from Moneybarn on the 20th of Oct 2020 and I have to send it back within 7 days b). the seller send me a message he will not refund the money c). is the seller holding the title with Moneybarn or did he also buy and not knowing there is an outstanding loan on it d). did he sent the V5C to DVLA since I have the green slip? e). Shall I fill in the form and sent it to Moneybarn? f). If Moneybarn has all my details they may send someone to repossess the car? 13. I decided, I will not undertake anything yet, because my mind said, go there, confront him, park the car in front of the company since I purchased it there and signed all paperwork in their office, they will call the police, the police will come and surely will not do anything but will force me to remove the car and park somewhere else, record all on camera, take all evidence, sent to Moneybarn and at the same time to the seller's employer (when I asked him to sign a letter he will settle the debt by Friday 23rd of Oct 2020, he used a paper of the car rental company, and on the back, the logo of the rental company is displayed clearly and he may have acted on behalf of the company to sell me the car, after all, I don't know if he holds the title with Moneybarn - well, this is an excuse for me to even sue the car rental company, or blacklist him with the company he is working for since it seems he is some type of manager there and he may have acted in the capacity as a sales person to sell the car to me on behalf the company....). 14. So on the 23rd of Oct 2020, I didn't do anything like described under 13....it's not my style as such I called AWH solicitors, explained all, and they said one person is specialized in dealing with such cases and will call me back after studying my case and inform me if it is something they can fight or not. So they will call me Monday the 26th of Oct 2020. I also said I want to go now and confront the seller, but she said better wait till Monday, and if they can fight the case, they will tell me the next course of action - but my funds are limited and cannot afford a lengthy battle, because if no case against Moneybarn means I will have to sue the seller to the court which will cost me. The car has comprehensive insurance and with all this saga I added on the 20th of Oct 2020 also legal insurance on top. Lengthy story, but I am trying to be as detailed as I can, and yes I should have done an HPI before buying the car, but I am from Holland and car sales work there a bit different, and this is my first time I buy from a private seller. Well, once I have sent the form to Moneybarn, I will park the car in a garage, and at this stage, I am renting a room in a house (there is one more tenant). Since I am from Holland, I am planning a trip within 2 weeks to visit my family and I will drive down with the car and in the meanwhile wait if the solicitor can be of any help. I need some advice though, I am still planning to drive down to the seller on Tuesday after I talked with the solicitor, park the car in front of the company, and confront the seller, and try to record all. I will also try to make him sign a letter that I purchased the car in good faith from him (regardless if he holds the title with Moneybarn or not but at least I purchased in good faith from him). Evidence that I have: 1. Car sales invoice 2. Paper that I made him sign 3. Gumtree ad; I could retract this from google history, but the original add removed from gumtree. At least I can show it was advertised 4. I tried to create a history of past owners, total owners including me are 5. It seems the car was also posted on gumtree before by a company in Essex (I saw on google). The reason for doing this, it is very likely that the seller purchased the car from someone else with an outstanding loan. Since then I read a lot on the internet, so please any advice is welcome to pursue my case, I paid a lot and at least I want my money back. Also what I read so far, Moneybarn is not easy to deal with...thanks in advance for any advice I can use for my case.
    • Hi   I think you need to check not just the serial number but what Meter Point Reference Number (MPRN) as the MPRN is what is registered and energy supplier go off as well as the serial number.   So you need to see what the MPRN is as well as the energy supplier it is registered with.   If you look at this Ofgem link: https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/consumers/household-gas-and-electricity-guide/connections-and-moving-home/who-my-gas-or-electricity-supplier   In the above link to do this check it gives a link to:   Find My Supplier: https://www.findmysupplier.energy/webapp/index.html (note you may have to complete a captcha, then input your postcode only and click find my address, when the list comes up click on your exact address, you will then see you actual MPRN and the energy supplier linked to your address)   With the above make sure and take the details of the MPRN and the Energy Supplier, better still take a screenshot/pdf the webpage.   Please let use know if on doing the above it matches your current supplier?  
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    • I came across this discussion recently and just wanted to give my experience of A Shade Greener that may help others regarding their boiler finance agreement.
       
      We had a 10yr  finance contract for a boiler fitted July 2015.
       
      After a summer of discontent with ASG I discovered that if you have paid HALF the agreement or more you can legally return the boiler to them at no cost to yourself. I've just returned mine the feeling is liberating.
       
      It all started mid summer during lockdown when they refused to service our boiler because we didn't have a loft ladder or flooring installed despite the fact AS installed the boiler. and had previosuly serviced it without issue for 4yrs. After consulting with an independent installer I was informed that if this was the case then ASG had breached building regulations,  this was duly reported to Gas Safe to investigate and even then ASG refused to accept blame and repeatedly said it was my problem. Anyway Gas Safe found them in breach of building regs and a compromise was reached.
       
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    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Police and Bailiff ‘ANPR Roadside Operations’...response at last from the Metropolitan Police !!!


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Five months ago on 22nd November an important Freedom of Information request was made to the Met Police regarding Police and Bailiff ‘ANPR Roadside Operations’ ( a copy of which is below). As viewers will see from reading below...making the request was simple....but obtaining a response was a whole different matter:

 

22nd November 2013 the FOI request was submitted to the Met Police.

 

6th December Met Police confirmation receipt.

 

24th December Met Police stated that their response 'had been delayed'.

 

30th December Met Police stated that a 'response had been drafted but awaits approval by a Senior Information Manager'.

 

31st December the Met Police responded to advise that the request was not 'within the cost threshold' (£450) and furthermore that the information was not 'centrally located'.

 

6th January the Met Police confirmed receipt of the individuals request for a 'review'.

 

4th February the individual wrote again seeking an update.

 

4th March the individual contacted the Met Police once more to complain and stated that she had copied her complaint to the Police Commissioner, the Information Commissioner's Office and also her MP.

 

14th March the individual sought an 'Internal Review' of the Metropolitan Police's handling of her FOI request.

 

17th April the Metropolitan Police responded to advise that they had decided to overturn their original decision with regards to questions 2 to 5 and that the information request was actually held by the MPS. With regards to questions 1 & 6 they advised that the review had concluded that 'the information was not held'.

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Copy of the Freedom of Information request:

 

Dear Metropolitan Police Service (MPS),

 

Can you publish any agreement, policy local or otherwise, service level agreement, a contract or contracts to show :-

 

1. Police and bailiff contracts to execute road side stop checks ANPR operations.

 

2. What agreements are in place to share information between bailiffs and police, that is to say, where a driver refuses to give information to a bailiff, under what section of what law, or any written or verbal agreement would a police constable share, give, volunteer, disclosure the details of a driver given to the police during the course of the police officers normal duties, the information being given to a constable for lawful police related matters.

 

3. What agreements, policy, procedure, standard operating procedure, etc are in place for a bailiff to instruct or command a police constable to stop a vehicle that appears on the bailiff ANPR. Under what section of what law or verbal or written agreement or understanding is the bailiff entitled to command or request or require a constable to stop a moving vehicle.

 

4. What is the full guidance issued to the officers, senior or otherwise at ANPR roadside checks for dealing with or otherwise engaging with drivers and bailiffs, that is to stay what is the remit of the officers in so far as forcing drivers to deal with bailiffs when they refuse to do so.

 

5. What is the guidance policy procedure advice, given to police officers with regards to drivers who do not wish to exit their vehicle, as long as no crime or offence has been commited, again for the purposes of clarity this could mean that the vehicle does not appear on any PNC indices via ANPR but is stopped at the request of the bailiff firm, the driver is not obliged to exit his vehicle, what is the guidance for these types of situation.

 

6. What is the cost to the police for the bailiff and police ONLY check points and how are they organised, under what level of authority, how is it paid for.

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The response from the Met Police is detailed and lengthly and I will be posting a link for viewers to read the entire reply. However, the following extracts are vitally important:

 

Appendix A: Standards Operating Procedures: Introduction.

 

CO15 ANPR Teams working with Court Enforcement Officers / Bailiffs

 

 

The primary purpose of Traffic OCU ANPR operations is denying criminals the use of the road.

 

These Standard Operating Procedures are intended to provide guidance to all police officers and police staff deployed on CO15 Traffic ANPR operations in partnership with Civilian Court Enforcement Officers (CEO) / Bailiffs.

 

These SOPs have been written in conjunction with legal advice provided by MPS Department of Legal Services and police powers in relation to civil debt recovery, magistrates and county court warrants.

 

Application

 

All police officers and police staff, including the extended police family and those working voluntarily or under contract to the Metropolitan Police Service, must be aware of and comply with these SOPs and relevant MPS policies and associated procedures.

 

Additionally, all police officers and staff must make themselves aware of Police Notice 04/2005 and Corporate News Item dated 18th September 2006. Extracts and electronic links have been included at Appendix A.

 

Aim

 

These Standard Operating Procedures is to support the following MPS and Traffic OCU objectives:

 

Make neighbourhoods safer through partnership working to reduce crime.

 

Disrupt criminal networks by denying criminals the use of the road.

 

These operating procedures are intended to provide clarity for both MPS staff and partners regarding police powers in relation to civil debt recovery, county court and magistrates court warrants.

 

These procedures will allow a smooth partnership working between MPS Traffic OCU and Civilian Enforcement Officers / Bailiff companies involved in Traffic ANPR operations, whilst protecting the reputation of the MPS and reduce the risk of civil litigation.

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To keep this thread in order I will be posting full details later today so could viewers wait until then to post comments.

 

In the meantime, what has been revealed in the Metropolitan Police's response is that their reply has confirmed that these 'operations' should be in conjunction with Civilian Enforcement Officers ( who are employees of the Magistrates Court. They are not private sector bailiffs).

 

The response also appears to indicate that the operations (in conjunction with Civilian Enforcement Officers) are to enforce criminal warrants (distress warrants etc).

 

Crucially, under Part 3 the Metropolitan Police outline the legal position and it is here that they 'drop their bombshell' by stating as follows:

 

 

Relevant Legislation & Police Powers

 

The following pieces of legislation appear most relevant in relation to police and civilian enforcement officers powers in relation to warrants and are provided as a guidance:

 

Section 125 of the Magistrates Court Act 1980

 

This provides for the issue and execution of warrants and provides constables with a power to execute warrants acting within their own police area. It also provides powers under Section 125A(1) for Civilian Enforcement Officers.

 

The warrants referred to will generally be Non-Payment of Fines warrants issued by magistrate’s courts.

 

By virtue of S.125D(1) and S.125D(2) there is no longer a requirement to be in possession of the warrant. However by virtue of S.125D(4) the warrant must be produced on demand of the person arrested or as soon as practicable

 

This section therefore provides police officers with a power to execute these warrants but would not necessarily allow for the person to be detained by police in order that CEOs execute the warrant.

 

 

Section 85 County Courts Act 1984

 

This relates to the execution of judgements or orders for payment of money.

 

It has been often quoted that police officers have a duty to assist officers of the court executing these warrants by virtue of Section 85(4), which states “It shall be the duty of every constable within his jurisdiction to assist in the execution of every such warrant”

 

However this section has been restricted by virtue of Statutory Instrument 1993/2073 - The Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts Order 1993 (article 6)

 

This section does not afford police officers with a power to execute the warrant and there is no power for police officers to detain a person in order for CEOs to execute the warrant.

 

Police officers powers in relation to these warrants would be limited to the common law power to prevent a breach of the peace.

 

Note:

 

This is where they then try to explain their reason for relying upon their 'get out of jail' card of using the 'old chestnut': Section 163 of the Road Traffic Act !!!

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it may be an illustration of Common Purpose in action, the police are "Leading Beyond Authority" as an aside Cressida Dick a very high profile high ranking officer is a Common Purpose graduate, who knows how many more police are Common Purpose trained?

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Thanks for the postings TT.

 

Review decision in regards to question 5. What is the guidance policy

procedure advice, given to police officers with regards to drivers who do

not wish to exit their vehicle, as long as no crime or offence has been

commited, again for the purposes of clarity this could mean that the

vehicle does not appear on any PNC indices via ANPR but is stopped at the

request of the bailiff firm, the driver is not obliged to exit his

vehicle, what is the guidance for these types of situation.

 

The attached Standard Operating Procedure states at 2.4.15. ‘The officer

dealing with the vehicle will:

o Explain clearly to the occupants that police enquiries are complete.

o Explain clearly to the occupants the role of the CEO who would like

to speak to them.

o Explain clearly to the occupants that if necessary, officers may use

power of arrest for 'breach of the peace' and detain those who are

obstructing the bailiff. However, officers are advised to avoid using this

power by making it plain what the position is, and what will happen if the

bailiff is resisted.

o Explain clearly that police involvement, unless other criminal

offences come to light will be to prevent a breach of the peace.

o Police will withdraw unless required to deal with a Breach of the

Peace or other criminal offences that come to light.’

 

 

The important parts are in bold. Anyone stopped can advise a Police Officer that they do not wish to speak to a bailiff and will simply drive on not wishing to cause any breach of the peace. A Police Officer could not stop the person driving on.

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The important parts are in bold. Anyone stopped can advise a Police Officer that they do not wish to speak to a bailiff and will simply drive on not wishing to cause any breach of the peace. A Police Officer could not stop the person driving on.

 

I would agree with that summary UB, unfortunately the police would likely arrest the driver or initate a pursuit, going off how the police are so cosy with the bailiffs on these operations.

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I would agree with that summary UB, unfortunately the police would likely arrest the driver or initate a pursuit, going off how the police are so cosy with the bailiffs on these operations.

 

The Police could not arrest the driver unless an offence had been committed and they could not pursue them unless they had good reason.

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The Police could not arrest the driver unless an offence had been committed and they could not pursue them unless they had good reason.

You are correct UB they couldn't but seeing how they think the bailiff is on the same side, even thoigh they have used a tenuous connection with Section 163 of the Road Traffic Act to do the pull at the behest of a bailiff for a Civil debt, they are likely to regard the driving off as a crime of itself and use that as the excuse to pursue. Not saying they absolutely would, but some coppers are so stupid that they might.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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You are correct UB they couldn't but seeing how they think the bailiff is on the same side, even thoigh they have used a tenuous connection with Section 163 of the Road Traffic Act to do the pull at the behest of a bailiff for a Civil debt, they are likely to regard the driving off as a crime of itself and use that as the excuse to pursue. Not saying they absolutely would, but some coppers are so stupid that they might.

 

By driving off and not speaking to a bailiff, you are not committing any offence. If it were the case, any householder who refused to open their door to speak to a bailiff, would face being arrested.

 

The Police cannot use breach of the peace in these circumstances. The Police could actually commit a breach of the peace themselves by their actions.

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By driving off and not speaking to a bailiff, you are not committing any offence. If it were the case, any householder who refused to open their door to speak to a bailiff, would face being arrested.

 

The Police cannot use breach of the peace in these circumstances. The Police could actually commit a breach of the peace themselves by their actions.

That is the point the police are making it up as they go along, what they are allowed to do and what they actually do are not always one and the same.

We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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an obvious question for the MPS and for the Mags courts for the boroughs

How many roadside stop operations have been attended by Court CEOs.

Plus quite how S.125 of the MCA 1980 applies to 'warrants' issued by Local Authorities is beyond me.

Especially as under CPE the bailiff attends in the capacity of a private bailiff.

It took them months and they came up with utter rubbish

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Something good that could come out of it, and I would love to see real, honest stats on this, is how many real criminals were caught using these operations. It's fair to assume common criminals don't pay their fines and if only one burglar, robber etc was caught that otherwise might not be (even if by luck), is that not good for the population as a whole? It does say if other offences come to light, then further action could be taken. Maybe this is why the police are involved.

 

You may call me naive, and this is probably about getting people to pay their parking penalties, but if it has the side effect of catching real criminals then I'm for it. If the people stopped have a genuine belief that the ticket wasn't given to them for good reason, then they can drive off. As I said in the other thread, if it's fair cop and they just avoided paying thinking it would go away and the price got hiked up as a result then that's their fault.

 

Just my two cents worth.

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Uncle Bulgaria, the Police do often ask drivers to step out of their car when they have been stopped. Under those circumstances, no doubt Old Bill will correct me if I am wrong,

but I don't think you can refuse such a request by the Police. Once out the car, it is more difficult then not to be confronted by the bailiff. I don't think that the Police would allow you to record on your phone their actions during the stop and once again I am unsure as to the legality of that Police request.

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an obvious question for the MPS and for the Mags courts for the boroughs

How many roadside stop operations have been attended by Court CEOs.

Plus quite how S.125 of the MCA 1980 applies to 'warrants' issued by Local Authorities is beyond me.

Especially as under CPE the bailiff attends in the capacity of a private bailiff.

It took them months and they came up with utter rubbish

 

Don't see how it can apply lamma, as that provision is for Criminal, the bailiff ANPR is logging purely Civil debt.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Uncle Bulgaria, the Police do often ask drivers to step out of their car when they have been stopped. Under those circumstances, no doubt Old Bill will correct me if I am wrong,

but I don't think you can refuse such a request by the Police. Once out the car, it is more difficult then not to be confronted by the bailiff. I don't think that the Police would allow you to record on your phone their actions during the stop and once again I am unsure as to the legality of that Police request.

 

You could ask the Police Officer why they are asking you step out of the car. You only have to cooperate with the Police in regard to the section 163 stop, where the Police may ask for copy of driving licence, certificate of insurance etc. There may be other reasons for the stop, which the Police have to explain. I have been stopped before on one of those drink driving check points and gave a clear breath test.

 

The Police cannot make anyone speak to a bailff and there are no grounds for any arrest for breach of peace for failing to do so.

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it may be an illustration of Common Purpose in action, the police are "Leading Beyond Authority" as an aside Cressida Dick a very high profile high ranking officer is a Common Purpose graduate, who knows how many more police are Common Purpose trained?

 

The Police could not arrest the driver unless an offence had been committed and they could not pursue them unless they had good reason.

 

Cressida Dick, wasnt she the Commander in charge of the killing of Jean Charles de Menezes?

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/majornews/3151204/Jean-Charles-de-Menezes-Cressida-Dick-admits-an-innocent-man-could-be-killed-again.html

 

 

Ms Dick admitted that the first hour of the day was "appalling" because there was "no structure" but added that it was common for police operations to be chaotic in their early stages as commanders attempted to pull together thousands of officers.

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Yes indeed Citizen B it was she!

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This scenario was featured on a TV prof recently and I was very confused as to why police officers were stopping people for civil debts, one rather stroppy bailiff was certain she could claim a guys can despite the debt being his but the van belonging to his son, she eventually had to let him go after much huffing and puffing.

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Cressida Dick, wasnt she the Commander in charge of the killing of Jean Charles de Menezes?

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/majornews/3151204/Jean-Charles-de-Menezes-Cressida-Dick-admits-an-innocent-man-could-be-killed-again.html

 

She was indeed, Cressida Dick is the Common Purpose senior police officer who authorised the "Shoot to kill" policy without reference to Parliament, the law or the British Constitution.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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She was indeed, Cressida Dick is the Common Purpose senior police officer who authorised the "Shoot to kill" policy without reference to Parliament, the law or the British Constitution.

 

She was truly following the Common Purpose mantra, "Lead Beyond Authority"

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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The Metropolitan Police's response to this FOI request is very significant indeed for so many reasons.

 

Firstly, the Met Police attempted to evade disclosing the information on the basis it would cost more than £450. They ONLY agreed to set the previous decision aside as they were subject to an internal review and were also aware that an MP and the Information Commissioner's Office were being copied into the correspondence.

 

Secondly, it is clear to me that when compiling the information that the 'penny had dropped' with the Metropolitan Police that these 'ANPR Roadside Operations' should NOT be taking place with private sector bailiffs and instead, should only be in partnership with Civilian Enforcement Officers

 

What is the difference?

Civilian Enforcement Officers (CEOs) are employed in the magistrates’ court by HM Courts

& Tribunals Service and are responsible for enforcing certain magistrates’ court and Crown Court orders. They execute warrants of arrest, committal, detention and distress. Under a change of regs, in 2006 HM Courts entered into Contracts with three private sector companies (Drakes, Philips, Swift) to permit them to enforce these criminal warrants on their behalf. The Contracts were subject to re-tendering a couple of years ago and there are now 4 companies (Marston Group, Collectica Ltd, Swift Credit Services and Excel Enforcement). Under these Contracts the officers (enforcing these warrants are known as Approved Enforcement Officers.

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I particularly like the following comment from the Metropolitan Police:

 

"I have decided to provide you with the relevant information in full which can be found at Appendix A. I can also advise you that during the course of this FoIA review it became apparent that the MPS were in the process of reviewing this guidance".

 

I cannot wait to read the new Guidance. Will it be restricted to operations only involving Civilian Enforcement Agents and Approved Enforcement Officers enforcing Magistrate Court warrants ????

 

I would think that many local authorities and private sector bailiff companies are VERY worried today at the disclosure of this information from the Metropolitan Police !!!!

 

PS: A 'little birdie" has told me that requests have already been made to all 33 local authorities in the London area for copies of their contracts with the police regarding these Operations. There are some interesting times ahead.

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The legality of these operations is tenuous at best, where a civilian bailiff is involved. Ever likely the Met were anxious NOT to answer that FOI. No doubt the ConDems will change the law to allow the private bailiffs free rein.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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