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    • To turn out to the action that you should take. You should not stand for any nonsense. You should decide absolutely that you are going to return the car. Of course you made a big mistake by paying for it by debit card. Although slightly better than paying by cash or paying by bank transfer. Is the vehicle currently stored off-road? The first thing you must do is you must get an independent report. You must write to big motoring world immediately. You still are within your 30 days. Write a letter of rejection. Tell them that you are rejecting the vehicle for a full refund. It is defective. Give them a list of the defects which have occurred so far and explain to BMW that as they apparently refuse to accept your own account of the defects on the vehicle even though they are supported by photographic evidence, you are now booking in for an independent inspection by an authorised VW dealer. This inspection will cost £XXX and you will be seeking to recover that sum from them when the vehicle is returned. Tell them that your decision to reject the vehicle's absolute. You're not interested in any repair offers. You have read sufficiently about them on the Internet to understand that they are not to be trusted. Tell them that as soon as you have had the independent inspection which you fully expect will confirm the faults, you provide them with a copy of the report together with a bill for the inspection and if they will not make immediate arrangements to recover the vehicle, to refund you the cost of the vehicle and the cost of the inspection – together with any other expenses reasonably incurred [list out any expenses such as insurance, road fund tax – et cetera et cetera], then you will start an action against them and without any further notice. Tell them that you are currently storing the vehicle off-road and unless they make immediate arrangements to collect it at their expense will also start adding a daily storage charge of £10 per day and this will be added to the court claim which you will be making against them. If you're happy with this approach then book the inspection immediately. Come back here when you have a date for it and we will then complete this draft letter and send it to them and the draft letter will also contain a deadline after which you will begin a legal action. Let me tell you now that if you aren't prepared to go this route, then you may as well give up because we are all wasting your time and you better accept the slap and be more careful in future. I see that you are griping a bit about £240 cost of an independent report. As I have said, you will in all likelihood recover this although it will take a court action. However, I'm afraid that this is the kind of thing that you will have to accept when you buy a vehicle without first researching the dealer and also you buy it at a considerable distance from your own home. Although you are well within the 30 days, today we are pretty well at the end of 26 February. I suggest you get a move on  
    • Thanks Dave and JK.   So I need to get an email off to the court ASAP?  This has been assigned to Cardiff County Court now so I'm guessing this will need to go them now rather than to the Northampton bulk processing centre? Is there a template for this email I can use?  I just want to make sure I'm including all the right things. Thanks CD
    • Firstly, in response to your questions: If you are rejecting the vehicle for defects then it is certainly the responsibility to cover all of the expenses incurred in returning the car to them and frankly they should be responsible for the collection. The consumer rights act does not refer to this and so we have to resort to the common law of contract in respect of which, the seller will be responsible for all of the losses/expenses incurred as a direct result of their breach of contract. In terms of recovering a rate per mile for the use of the vehicle which you have had in the first 30 days – the wisdom seems to be that no they can't. After 30 days it's a different matter. However, once again the consumer rights act is silent on this but the motoring ombudsman seems to say that they are not entitled to recover anything for the usage of the vehicle during the first 30 days if it has been rejected for defects during that period. Once again the consumer rights act is silent. However, it will be prudent for you to provide your own inspection. If you haven't understood yet, Big Motoring World is a car dealership which is self-serving in its interests and is not customer facing and is turning out in respect of customers who buy defective vehicles, to be pretty untrustworthy and very defensive. I have no doubt that lots of customers by vehicles very successfully and are happy but what we are seeing here and also on the Facebook complaints page is that when things go wrong – Big Motoring World are totally unsupportive. You could try to back if you want – but referring to the above point, you should get your own independent inspection from a reputable source. A VW specialist dealer. The information we have is that if you simply return it to BMW, they may carry out some kind of inspection and they may then report back to you that there was no such fault or else they will say that they have discovered a fault but they repaired it and that you are not obliged to take the car back. It would not be a good idea to take this vehicle back. You absolutely need to get rid of it and give your business a some other company which is apparently more reliable – although you need to do some solid research. To add to this – and I suppose you won't be happy with this criticism – I never understand anybody who buys a vehicle a hundred miles away or so. It is asking for trouble. So many people do this and a lot of them come a cropper simply because of the mileages involved in returning the car even for a minor repair. Here is a video for you to watch. It may be too late for you but others will visit this thread – hopefully before they buy their vehicles – and they will learn something about how to survive the trauma of a used car purchase. also, make sure that you have read and understood our used car guide. You won't really enjoy what you read, very much that you can consider that they are lessons for the future – and of course anybody else who visits this thread should benefit from your unfortunate experience.
    • Yes, if she outs you it should take her out of the loop. However I don't know for sure, because I understand there's a time limit to do this and don't know if its a statutory thing under POFA or just someting the they make up. Maybe LFI could comment?
    • Thread moved to Debt Collection Agencies Forum. I'm pretty sure a PP Credit debt of that age is under PayPal EU and is out of jurisdiction but I've flagged this for my site colleagues to advise further.   .  
  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.


      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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ATOS home visit? Supporting evidence?

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Hello, I am new to this forum and would like some help of what to expect in a home visit and how to plan on if i fail it.. I have been claiming ESA since November last year due to social anxiety/agoraphobia and depression. My doctor who is very supportive made me a support letter to request a home visit as I have not left the house since late last year. The support letter was accepted by ATOS to my surprise and they granted me a home visit which I am yet to receive a date for yet.


Regarding my mental health issues my GP has referred me to the hospital mental team, which I have attended with the help of a friend. They clearly said to me I am in no fit state to work and are thinking of sending me for counseling. I just want to know what support evidence could I get hold of and where to send it too? I am worried about failing my medical assessment and going even more downhill in terms of my condition what can i do if i fail my assessment???

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Hi and welcome to the forum,


First off, do your best not to worry about this too much. Chances are that it's not going to happen quickly. In some areas there are huge delays for ATOS assessments and they are generally even longer for home visits. The simple fact of the support from your GP and ATOS granting a home visit should go hugely in your favour.


The descriptors for ESA are in schedules 2 and 3 of these regulations http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/a13-4701.pdf. I suggest that first you go through them and work out where you might score points - you need 15 in total to be awarded ESA with the work related component or to meet one of the schedule 3 descriptors for the support group. If you can then get any of the mental health team to write a supporting letter, that would help. You can send it to the address on any letters you have had from ATOS, but remember to put your name and national insurance number on everything and only send copies.


You can ask for your assessment to be audio recorded. This is likely to delay things even further as they don't have nearly enough machines, but it can also provide some reassurance that the report will be more accurate.


On the subject of the actual assessment, I had mine last week (after a huge delay!). Unlike in the offices, there's no computer so everything is hand-written. The doctor just asked questions about how my condition affects me and was actually really pleasant. It took about 10 minutes to get enough info to confirm I should be in the support group, and that was it.


"If you want my parking space, please take my disability" Common car park sign in France.

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I barely leave my bedroom, only if to use the toilet and my curtains are shut 24/7.. I struggle to even find any motivation to shower and get dressed etc... Was your appearance asked about? or day to day life? And can i really request the assessment to be recorded as I have heard some reports are totally inaccurate

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There's a template letter to ask for supportive evidence from your doctor/mental health team on Rethink's site;



(Search for 'work capability assessment factsheet')




But it's a contentious issue at the moment cos many doctors refuse to get involved with benefit claims. Plan B is to subject access your doctor for a copy of your medical records, which may include a report from the mental health team. A tenner gets you everything that's on the computer. Clerical records cost up to £50, but you can make an appointment to view them first. Praps with help from your friend?


CAG has a guide to coping with an Atos assessment at;




Many of the assessor's questions will be about your day to day life from which s/he may make assumptions concerning the descriptors. For example, 'do you cook?' Without giving you the chance to explain that you live on pre delivered ready meals.




Best wishes, Margaret. :panda:

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If you've access to a printer, simply download and print a copy from Rethink's site. Complete the first page, then ask your doctor to complete the rest. After you've sounded out his approach to supportive evidence for benefit claims.

No printer? Copy the template onto A4. Runs to three sides, but it's not solid walls of text.



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If you've access to a printer, simply download and print a copy from Rethink's site. Complete the first page, then ask your doctor to complete the rest. After you've sounded out his approach to supportive evidence for benefit claims.


No printer? Copy the template onto A4. Runs to three sides, but it's not solid walls of text.






So worried this morning, asked my doctor to ring me for some more medication and I'm so scared about asking for a support letter

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