my driving license cancelled

[jjtech]

Hi,

My driving license was cancelled because I didn't send driving license to DVLA.

 

I've never received any communication from them regarding this problem.

 

I was sentenced in my absence (L530) and paying fines like a good, law abiding citizen.

 

I assumed that they simply applied points to the driving license and that's the end of the story.

But now I've received communication saying that I have to APPLY for a driving license.

 

Is there any way around it?

 

What if the postman dropped letter into the wrong hole and I'm being punished for it?

 

I need my driving license for work.

 

Thanks in advance,

JJ

[Raykay]

Your licence was not cancelled, it was revoked because you did not submit it to the police or court (it doesn't go to the DVLA) at the time you paid the fine, to have the points added.

You just need to apply for a new one, which will have the the points on it.

 

 

You may be able to do it on-line

 

 

https://www.gov.uk/renew-driving-licence

[jjtech]

thanks for a reply and link.

I know I have to apply for a new one. My point was that I never knew that I have to send the old one. Maybe they've sent a letter but I have not received it. I don't know what happened to recorded delivery? There is actually no proof of delivery of ANY communication from them.

 

There are two failures here:

1/ the need to send driving license off as such. This is nonsense - they don't need it

2/ lack of proof of delivery.

 

I believe especially the second point should be explored more. But probably it's for naught. Thanks anyway.

 

Regards,

JJ

[Aretnap]

The court summons should have told you that you needed to send in your driving licence and counterpart. How did you think the points would appear on the counterpart if you didn't?

 

Arguably in this day and age the phsical record of points on your licence isn't really needed, and indeed in the near future the counterpart will be phased out and the record will become purely electronic. However the law dates from from the days when the interweb didn't exist and your driving licence was often the only record of your points which the police/courts had easy access to. The law tends not to move as fast as technology, so the phsical record is still obligatory even if it isn't really necessary. To prevent people from avoiding endorsement by not sending their licence in, the DVLA revoke licences when they've had enough of waiting.

 

Recorded delivery hasn't been used for things like this for years. It makes it much too easy for people who are expecting "bad news" in the post to avoid receiving it by arranging to be "out" when the postman comes. If you didn't get the letter reminding you to send in your licence that's a pain, but it won't undo the revocation.

 

Unfortunately there's not a lot you can do now but get a new licence. If you drive between the revocation of the old one and the issue of the new one you risk having your car seized for driving while unlicensed.

[Raykay]

 

Unfortunately there's not a lot you can do now but get a new licence. If you drive between the revocation of the old one and the issue of the new one you risk having your car seized for driving while unlicensed.

 

It is one of the exceptions , as you have held a licence, you can drive as long as you have applied for a new licence.

 

S.88, Road Traffic Act 1988.

[Aretnap]

It is one of the exceptions , as you have held a licence, you can drive as long as you have applied for a new licence.

 

S.88, Road Traffic Act 1988.

Thanks! So you can drive as soon as the application has been received - either apply online and drive immediately, or send special delivery and drive as soon as it's received.

[Aretnap]

Actually jjtech - to rewind a little bit, are you saying that you didn't receive ANY correspondence until you got notice of the fine? No NIP, no summons, no nothing? If so you might be able to make a statutory declaration and get the conviction set aside if you discovered it less than 3 weeks ago - the procedure it explained here. http://www.pattersonlaw.co.uk/Offences/Court/Making-a-statutory-declaration.php This wouldn't negate the need to get a new licence, but it would mean you might have a chance of getting the fine back. The summons could still be reissued, so whether that would be worth doing depends on what the offence was and whether you could expect a better outcome if you were there to defend yourself.

[Raykay]

The way I read the first post is the complaint that there was no communication regarding sending the licence to the DVLA. Which of course there will not have been as it should have been sent with the payment/paperwork to the police if it was a FPN or the court if it was a summons.

[jjtech]

It is one of the exceptions , as you have held a licence, you can drive as long as you have applied for a new licence.

 

S.88, Road Traffic Act 1988.

 

Thank you for your advice, it's much appreciated. I will apply for a new license online now.

[Aretnap]

If you apply online I'd print off the acknowledgement page and keep it in the car so that you have some proof that you've applied in case you get stopped.

[jjtech]

Arguably in this day and age the phsical record of points on your licence isn't really needed, and indeed in the near future the counterpart will be phased out and the record will become purely electronic. However the law dates from from the days when the interweb didn't exist and your driving licence was often the only record of your points which the police/courts had easy access to.

I get you. But there is only one real reason why they hold on to this piece of paper:

“pay £20 by MasterCard, Visa, Electron, Maestro or Delta debit or credit card”. For over a decade green counterparts are obsolete. Virtually everyone with driving license close to me lost his green counterpart at some point. Public institutions are holding to this antiquated piece of paper exactly because it causes aggravation for people. Most of them lose it. Speaking in marketing terms, they have front end profit from selling new green counterparts (piece of paper worth 10p for 20 quid) and profit on the back-end from people being late with their payments.

 

Recorded delivery hasn't been used for things like this for years. It makes it much too easy for people who are expecting "bad news" in the post to avoid receiving it by arranging to be "out" when the postman comes. If you didn't get the letter reminding you to send in your licence that's a pain, but it won't undo the revocation.

 

I don't know if it's the right place to start philosophical debate, but I think we seamlessly moved from: “public institutions serving people” to “people serving public institutions” in recent years.

People seem to accept this paradigm and actually defend public institutions against their fellow citizens. It's accepted that once an institution has any business to do with me, I have to structure my life around it, until it's solved to the liking of an institution.

Is not sending recorded delivery beneficial for the citizen? No, it's only beneficial for an institution.

In the country I lived for 25 years, they use recorded delivery until today. They probably have some problems with some people, but there are ways around it. I love your assumption of the “mischievous citizen” hiding from mighty institutions. I don't mean to get personal but you sound like you work for DVLA. I don't see anything about mischievous institutions robbing law abiding, tax paying citizens, by maliciously sending letters into the stratosphere and leaving them with their insignificant pain.

Sorry for a rant, but I just can't stand this sort of moralizing.

[jjtech]

Thank you for your advice, it's much appreciated. I will apply for a new license online now.

Thanks a million - at least I know I can still drive

[Raykay]

A licence (currently) comprises two parts - so you will get both a new photo card and counterpart, one is not valid without the other. The details are spread over both documents, some on the photo card, some on the counterpart.

[kernowlife]

A bit of a long shot here, I'm in the same situation. ie my licence has been revoked because I did not send it in. I'm currently unemployed and have just moved to a new address. I'm thinking of sending the licence back to have the change of address done (I can't afford the £20 to re apply)

 

Do you think this might work......(years ago I had some out of date points removed free of charge thanks to a change of address)

 

Yes I know I should have sent it in, but I was working as an agency driver and had to show my licence every shift......I got an extra months work before the licence was revoked. The work would have ended anyway as I now have 7 points and all the agency driving jobs I've seen state "no more than 6 points"

[renegadeimp]

If it was revoked and you never got it back, then it would still be considered revoked, regardless of you changing the address. Youd have to apply for a new one.

[kernowlife]

Thanks for the quick reply, I was just hoping that since it was revoked for not being sent back, sending it back for an address change would be considered enough. I have had my licence well over 2 years so it is not like I have to resit the tests or anything (still have 5 points to play with and 3 coming off in september)

 

Sounds like all I would achieve would be to tell them my new address to send the bailiffs to for my fine. (can't afford that either)

 

I'm not driving at the moment (car returned to the dealer as I could not keep up repayments) I have bought a little motorbike but that needs some work before I can use it (more money) so I think the best option is to sit tight untill my situation improves, then reapply for my licence when I am back working.