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    • Hermes lost parcel.. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/422615-hermes-lost-parcel/
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    • Oven repair. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/427690-oven-repair/&do=findComment&comment=5073391
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    • I came across this discussion recently and just wanted to give my experience of A Shade Greener that may help others regarding their boiler finance agreement.
       
      We had a 10yr  finance contract for a boiler fitted July 2015.
       
      After a summer of discontent with ASG I discovered that if you have paid HALF the agreement or more you can legally return the boiler to them at no cost to yourself. I've just returned mine the feeling is liberating.
       
      It all started mid summer during lockdown when they refused to service our boiler because we didn't have a loft ladder or flooring installed despite the fact AS installed the boiler. and had previosuly serviced it without issue for 4yrs. After consulting with an independent installer I was informed that if this was the case then ASG had breached building regulations,  this was duly reported to Gas Safe to investigate and even then ASG refused to accept blame and repeatedly said it was my problem. Anyway Gas Safe found them in breach of building regs and a compromise was reached.
       
      A month later and ASG attended to service our boiler but in the process left the boiler unusuable as it kept losing pressure not to mention they had damaged the filling loop in the process which they said was my responsibilty not theres and would charge me to repair, so generous of them! Soon after reporting the fault I got a letter stating it was time we arranged a powerflush on our heating system which they make you do after 5 years even though there's nothing in the contract that states this. Coincidence?
       
      After a few heated exchanges with ASG (pardon the pun) I decided to pull the plug and cancel our agreement.
       
      The boiler was removed and replaced by a reputable installer,  and the old boiler was returned to ASG thus ending our contract with them. What's mad is I saved in excess of £1000 in the long run and got a new boiler with a brand new 12yr warranty. 
       
      You only have to look at TrustPilot to get an idea of what this company is like.
       
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    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Hello,

 

We are contemplating the purchase of a static caravan, possibly placed on the Haven/British Holidays site at Berwick (see my last post in this forum).

 

I'd love to hear from anyone who has done this, as we're not sure of the benefits and pitfalls.

 

Jeremy

Jeremy

 

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The Benefits of Having Your Own Caravan are,You Have A Weekend Retreat Whenever You Want,The Downsides Are The Ground Rent Is 3k+ A Year,Certain Sites will Only Allow Vans of A certain Age,Unless you are willing to let it out can be quite expensive.Unless money is no object,Some site owners are a law to themselves,see my post on What happened with my father in laws caravan,at a haven site. Hope this helps.:rolleyes:

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The Benefits of Having Your Own Caravan are,You Have A Weekend Retreat Whenever You Want,The Downsides Are The Ground Rent Is 3k+ A Year,Certain Sites will Only Allow Vans of A certain Age,Unless you are willing to let it out can be quite expensive.Unless money is no object,Some site owners are a law to themselves,see my post on What happened with my father in laws caravan,at a haven site. Hope this helps.:rolleyes:

 

Hi Craig,

 

I read that post - rather put me off the idea. We were looking at a Haven Site as well (Berwick Upon Tweed).

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Jeremy

Jeremy

 

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the negative thing about static caravn ..(well i dont know if its the same in england as it is in N.I) if you want to sell it you have to sell it to the caravan site owner and he gives you rubbish money on it... I bought a 23K caravan three years ago and had to sell it for the matromonial settlement and he offered me 6K for it i was furious!!!! cos no way it is worth 6K but i was not allowed to sell it privately

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Guest 10110001

Been there done that. stay well away. Too many problems to list in a single post. Just rent a van when you want one.

 

It took me 18 months to sort out this mess in the courts. I was fobbed off with more bovene fecal matter from the caravan park than in a lifetime.

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my mother in laws just tried to sell her static bought it a year and a half ago on a ideal caravans site near seahouses paid 8000 quid didnt read the small print went to sell it this year had to sell it back to them man came out ill give u 3000 best offer so basiclly lost 5000 quid on it and also had to pay site fees of 1000 quid a year on top off it so personally i think you are mad to buy a static anywhere

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welcome to the world of caravan owners we have owned a static van for over 10 years and we could tell a few storys i wouldnt advise anyone to buy one now the owners of these parks are a law unto themselves we used to love our van but over the years the greed and the dos and donts on these sites have taken all the pleasure out of caravanning every week there are new rules or they want more money out of you we used to go every weekend to relax and enjoy now its a worry :(

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premium sites only allow the age of the van not to exceed 10 years, some parks allow higher age vans. always check the terms of the pitch agreement and make sure the park does not unlilaterally change terms of the agreement after you have signed it. When unexcpected fees and charges start being added on, NEVER get roped into renting your van out to recoup them, this will be a one way trip so prepare to lose lots of money.

Professional property investor and conveyancer

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We own a static caravan and couldn't be happier.

 

We originally had it on one site, Golden Sands, Rhyl and it was great, however, new site owners came in and changed all the rules (to suit them) and increased site fees despite saying there would be no changes! As a consequence the Park has rapidly gone downhill and the current Caravan Owners Group are in the middle of a second court case against the Park! There is a thread on here somewhere which was blantantly hi-jacked by the Staff and so it meant that the thread got closed!

 

Anyhow, we were fortunate to find a fantastic Park which was willing to take us (and our caravan) so we moved there - it's a bit of a well kept secret so PM me know if you want to know where it is!

 

One thing I would say is *before* you buy a caravan on *any* Park don't get drawn in by the sales patter, they will use phrases like "living the dream" etc to try and entice you in. In fact if they have sales staff I'd instantly be suspicious of *why* they need them - so beware.

 

Also, ask if they have an Park Caravan Owners Group - if the Park says they haven't, then they are probably lying and trying to hide this fact from you. They use the old "divide and conquer" so that they can do what they want regarding Park Rules and Regulations - there are some unscrupulous Site Owners out there and whilst some of their actions, policies, procedures etc may or may not be illegal, that is a matter for the courts, some of their actions are certainly morally questionable.

 

Finally, make sure you speak to *genuine* owners on the site - they will give you an insight into what to expect and what the Park is *really* like.

 

Caveat emptor is never more applicable than when buying a static caravan!

 

If you need any help/advice - just ask!

 

B.

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Guest Amberloz

Make sure that they are members of the British Holiday and Home Parks Association and also ask for a copy of the agreement that you would have to sign. Make sure you read all the small print.

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Make sure that they are members of the British Holiday and Home Parks Association

 

From my experience, membership of the BHHPA is irrelevant as they are there to look out for the Site Owners rather than the caravanners.

 

and also ask for a copy of the agreement that you would have to sign. Make sure you read all the small print.

 

This, however, is a good idea.

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Guest murpheus

You are absolutely correct Badwanger, the BH&HPA did try and help me with there dispute resolution scheme but it has turned into total farce. There is a loophole that says both parties must agree to arbitration.

The snakes just simply decline to take part and thats the end of it.

So all these code of practice rules are farcical also, that is what I relied on and paid the price. I have been to trading standards who contacted the FSA.

They want nothing to do with it, as they say not enough are complaining.

 

This consumer issue is massive and it's going to get a lot worse. I know of others who have consulted solicitors, only to come up against a brick wall and lost more money. I thought my case was bad, until I read other posts on this website and what has happened to my good friends on the same park. Some of the stories i have heard border close to criminal.

The majority of caravan parks I believe are decent and in my opinion, if they let you lease out your property then they can't be all that bad.

 

Its the vermin that need eradicating, and what happened to the banks should apply to bullying Holiday Parks.

 

 

A campaign needs starting with two main aims.

 

1. Recover losses, just as the banks have had to pay up

2. Change the law, to protect those that have static caravans now.

Edited by murpheus
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I thought my case was bad, until I read other posts on this website and what has happened to my good friends on the same park. Some of the stories i have heard border close to criminal.

 

Just out of interest was the Park in question Golden Sands, Rhyl?

 

The majority of caravan parks I believe are decent and in my opinion, if they let you lease out your property then they can't be all that bad.

 

Agreed. Our Park in particular is fantastic and were we so lucky to be able to move our caravan there!

 

Its the vermin that need eradicating, and what happened to the banks should apply to bullying Holiday Parks.

 

A campaign needs starting with two main aims.

 

1. Recover losses, just as the banks have had to pay up

2. Change the law, to protect those that have static caravans now.

 

Without a doubt. I too tried to get Trading Standards, the Police, BBC Watchdog and even a solicitor involved - all it served was to cost time and money with no benefit. Our weekend retreat became a nightmare and rather than going back to work on Monday refreshed and de-stressed, the opposite happened! I was more relaxed at work than I was "at play" on that Park!

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If you buy a caravan, you will love it for the first few months, then the annual pitch fee go up 30% after year 1 (or pay £350+VAT to move to a cheaper pitch), unexpected charges are added, and you start having to make back your losses by sub-letting, then it gets worse, the maintenance costs go up, things go missing and more unexpected fees (business rates - subletting is considered a business - and their compulsory insurance premiums etc) are added. You are billed for 10 gas bottles a month at £45 a go because the heating is on 24/7. You cant afford to pay your account on time because its now too high, so for each time you pay late, the park moves your van off its pitch or disconnects it from utilities at £285 a go. Your deam holiday home ends up a nightmare £30,000 debt.

 

Best advice, rent it, no commitments. You walk away at the end of the rental and you get a brand new van and a different park each time.

 

Fortunately I didnt lose, I recovered all my money by dragging it through the courts. My sympathy is with those less-informed and dont have the means to litigate a caravan park. Solicitors dont want this kind of work so its £500 on account and £500 per volley of correspondence. Police say fraud is a civil matter and trading standards quote chunks out of the Unfair terms in consumer contracts regulations.

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The site I was on is in the North East of England. I don't want to name and shame them just yet, as i have recently contacted the BH&HPA and asked them to look again at my case. [ I will update once I get a reply ]

The dispute resolution service BH&HPA use are called ICAS [independant Consumer Arbitration Service] now this is where it gets complicated!

In 2007 BH&HPA dispute resolution arbitrators were called IDRS who I have blasted in a previous post for lack of correspondence and time wasting.

IDRS informed me finally in 2009 that BH&HPA do not use there services anymore, so in July 2009 the ball started rolling again with ICAS.

The confusing bit is that ICAS has the same office as IDRS and all there paperwork has IDRS stamped all over???

Anyway that aside, the BH&HPA have relied on clause 4:2 in ICAS 2007 guidelines.

Qoute...

"Any party may initiate the use of ICAS but all parties to the dispute must agree to use ICAS in writing, by completing the application form,before the arbitration can commence."

 

Now here is my argument since I have looked more closely into the case,

the Respondant or Leisure company, HAVE SIGNED THE APPLICATION FORM IN 2007 WITH IDRS. Not only that ICAS have revised their guidelines in 2008 and a Conciliator has been introduced to negotiate with the parties first. In July 2009 I received no contact at all from any such Conciliator.

 

Looking closely at other clauses in ICAS and IDRS guidelines, in both there is a clause which mentions the "Power of the Arbitrator."

Qoute.....

"Proceed with the arbitration if either party fails to comply with these rules or with the arbitrators directions, or if either party fails to attend any meeting ordered by the arbitrator but only after giving that party written notice."

 

I am no Lawyer, but that is what I wrote recently to the BH&HPA and I await their reply.

 

On another note ,thanks Badwanger for your reply. looking at fork-it's post I have to add this.

I recommend NACO to insure your caravan they are quite reasonable if you tell them you let it out. Now here's the ironic bit, they have a good legal team which is free when you insure through them.

I should have consulted them when I had my dispute, but instead put full faith in the arbitration process provided by the BH&HPA.

 

Now here's the big warning and potential downside about hiring out your caravan.

Greedy park owners may laugh at and ignore the Code of Practice, but there is one clause they will use gleefully if they want you off or try to force upgrading.

Qoute......

"A new caravan will be allowed a minimum 10 year guarantee on the park before the owner will be invited to upgrade. However if the caravan is to be leased during the 10 year period then it will lose a year for each week it is hired.

In theory you can pay 50k for a new unit, let it out for ten weeks and be booted off after one season. The government body that made the Code of Practice were very quick to add that little clause in!

Edited by murpheus
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does anyone know of any sites that will allow you to site your own caravan on as ive been offered a ex display static caravan that heaven would sell for over 40k i can have it for less than 10k just need to find a site to take it within approx 100miles of cardiff

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does anyone know of any sites that will allow you to site your own caravan on as ive been offered a ex display static caravan that heaven would sell for over 40k i can have it for less than 10k just need to find a site to take it within approx 100miles of cardiff

 

From my experience, most sites won't accept a "Bring On", as they are missing out on a sale but given the current financial climate, you could drop lucky! Those that do, tend to only allow caravan less than five years old and will charge you a siting fee - which is roughly equivalent to a years full site fees.

 

My advice would be to trawl the 'net and ring round Parks of interest, giving them the exact make, model and age of the caravan. Then draw up a shortlist of those who will, in principal, allow a "bring on" and go around each site in person making sure you take photographs of your caravan with you - so they can see it's condition.

 

Please make sure you are happy with *everything* before you move and the very best of luck!

 

B.

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Bourne Leisure and Evergreen Finance.

 

 

Please note the comments below are my point of view and my personal experience with these companies.

 

ANYONE WHO HAS HAD A BAD OR SIMILAR EXPERIENCE WITH THESE TWO COMPANIES AND THEIR” OWNERS EXCLUSIVE” PLEASE CONTACT ME AS WE ARE GOING TO COURT THIS YEAR.

 

THESE TWO COMPANIES ARE OWNED BY THE SAME DIRECTORS CHECK OUT COMPANIES HOUSE FOR PROOF. I HAVE FOUR DISABLED CHILDREN WITH AUTISM THOUGHT BUYING A CARAVAN FOR SUMMER HOLIDAYS WOULD BE GREAT BUT IN TURN HAS LOST US ALL THE SAVINGS WE HAD AND NO MORE HOLIDAYS FOR OUR CHILDREN READ OUR SITUATION BELOW.

 

 

THEY HAVE THREATENED ME WITH LEGAL ACTION AND CLAIM DEFORMATION. THEY HAVE TOLD ME TO TAKE DOWN ALL LISTINGS IN FORUMS WHY ARE THEY SO CONCERNED?

 

 

 

We decided to purchase a caravan for summer holidays as our 4 children suffer with Autism. It would make going on holiday easier as a family and we could try and get away some weekends for a bit of respite.

 

 

I purchased a used Willoughby Richmond 2006 caravan in May 2008 from Bourne Leisure and paid cash £29357.00 I was told it had heating. This money was from a remortage on our family home.

 

When we stayed we found that the heating did not work as it was freezing cold in the mornings.

 

I complained and was told was what I needed was one with central heating as this one only had warm air heating which was not any good. Great thanks for telling me now!

 

I was not told this when I purchased the caravan from the sales man.

 

It took five months for the agent to find us an improved van which would cost us more.

 

I had to fund this by finance as I had used all of our funds to purchase the first van.

 

We only used the first van for a total of three weeks as the children found it too cold.

 

When I signed for the finance it was agreed that I would be given the full exchange price I paid against the new caravan less the site fees. This would have been around 24 k. This was agreed by the manager .

 

However when I signed the documents the sales man had to take them away to be finalised. I was not given any copies of anything. He just asked me to sign a bunch of papers not pointing out what anything was. He confirmed when I was at the park and we checked in to the new van we would do a check list and go through all the documents this never happened.

 

The hire purchase agreement it is on two pages. The page with all the figures and part ex are on sheet 1 not on the sheet that I signed sheet 2 so when I signed I was led to believe I would get the full rebate and was paying the monthly amount for 3 years.

 

I was not given a copy of any paperwork to take away and only got my first copy after 12 months. I understand now that I should have received the agreement within 7 days and had a cooling off period.

 

When I got my annual statement it showed the agreement was over 84 months when I was told it would be over 36 months by the agent. I demanded a copy of the agreement be faxed over by Evergreen finance and saw the figures on sheet 1 were not as agreed with the agent from Bourne Leisure. They had only given me a exchange for £14k when we never agreed to part ex it should have been an exchange as the first vans heating did not work properly. We only had 3 weeks use of it and according to the documents we have lost 50% of the value not due to any fault of ours.

 

The second caravan we received I was made to sign the documents before seeing the finished goods as it was the end of the season. When we went in the following March they were not as described they were with faulty windows that were screwed shut. Doors that did not close, stained carpet and chairs the decking was collapsing and the heater in the lounge had two bare light sockets exposed which were live!. Not ideal with Autistic children. Also the main door does not lock and close it is warped so again unsafe for security or the children could open it themselves and run off to the road or cliff. When I viewed the caravan I was told it would all be in as new condition with new carpet and chairs. I complained immediately the day we viewed it so did my wife but they never repaired these faults. They then tried to say we never complained to them until I found proof we did.. I have said that I do not accept this now and reject the goods.

The thing was dangerous with numerous faults. I have taken pictures of the various faults. This is not only a nuisance it is dangerous and a fire hazard. they still to this day have not repaired the faults and I have photographic evidence.

I have stopped paying the finance agreement and the ground rent and have rejected the goods as they are not as described on the price or due to the caravan not being fit for its purpose.

As we have paid almost 50% of the cost the finance company need to get a court order to repossess however they have removed the caravan and will not tell me where it is. I am waiting for them to attempt to enforce their agreement and I am confident with the evidence I have they will not be able to enforce it

 

UPDATE 25TH OF MAY 2010 Return of goods order hearing.

 

They tried to get a return of goods order for the caravan but failed it is now going for a full hearing and I am able to submit my evidence and do a counter claim for the whole amount I paid. I am confident we are going to win over this GOLIAOTH!!

 

 

 

If anyone is considering purchasing from Bourne Leisure or evergreen finance please contact me first and I will send you copies of the emails I have received from their solicitors. I think you will find it shocking how a family with disabled kids has been treated!

 

The media are tracking this case and I am also now submitting a complaint to the OFT.

Edited by dvdeez
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Just read through all the posts on this thread. I have posted a thread on a consumer forum about a site that will not refund my site fee after I sold the static. They charged the new owner pro rata fees so they are in effect receiving 2 payments for 1 pitch.

 

I know this happens a lot, the agreements are mostly in breech of the OFT regulations as the retention of the advance payment is considered a penalty. I would like to know if anyone has ever taken these sites on. They are a law unto themselves and, in my case, try to intimidate owners/consumers into just accepting what they want.

 

If more people come forward then we have more chance of getting refunds and not being penalised.

 

Please, please, please if you have been affected by not having a refund of pitch fees after you have sold your unit, post on here.

 

If you have taken a site to court to get a refund please please let me know. The more people speak out the quicker the problem will be solved. Just because you sign an agreement does not mean that it is compliant with rules and regs neither does it give the site the right to penalise the consumer when they themselves are profiteering

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The problem is they can get away with it as few people will take it all the way. I for one am nearly at the finalo hearing and look forward to exposing this to a judge!

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