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    • if you wish to put up everything like    your defence claimants WS defendants WS   then im sure those here now and future victims will find it of value   if you read upload carefully you'll see its best to upload each as a separate multipage PDF but ofcourse you'll have to redact each page as a jpg picture 1st before merging each to the relevant multipage pdf .   dx  
    • Thanks I’m happy to put something back ! I didn’t have the courage of my convictions to counter claim even though I was really quite proud of the thoroughness of my court bundle ! i really wanted the opportunity to get into the detail with the judge and felt quite cheated when it ended, but of course I realised that they had just moved on to their next victim  will watch this space 👍  
    • I have created your own topic for this as its import to have it own one but placed a link on the thread you posted on.   you should never counterclaim that exposes you to further cost and rarely succeeds esp if they disc' the claim always best to state in a sep letter you will be seeking costs esp loss of days wages at £90 which most judges allow.   as for an sar, its p'haps always better to issue a cpr 31:14 too or in replacement of, an sar.   well done on your important win
    • My wife has directed me to post on this thread as I have just successfully won against these charlatans   My hearing date was all set at my local court for 31st October 2019 all defence papers were filed and served and frankly I was really looking forward to it! This morning I received a letter from BW legal stating in a one line response that I was to take this letter as a notice of discontinuance whereby the claimant KBT (armtrac) discontinues all of the claim. I am beyond disappointed that I didn’t get my chance to see these idiots across a desk! And that’s it I don’t appear to be able to take this further? I now realise I should of had the courage of my convictions and faith in the advice of others to issue a counterclaim! What I have now in my possession is a file of information which would be Gold-dust to the next person in my position! I feel like I would be able to get some sort of closure if I could pass some of this wisdom on but there are many posters here already and every case is different in its own way The key points in my defence were as follows and useful to anyone ‘caught’ at Sandy Acres. Keep the original parking ticket you purchased and send a copy to KBT with a covering letter ASAP do not identify the driver at any stage of the process!!!!  The blue sign uses the word penalty which is contrary to the IPC codes of practice  The red and white sign has a café open sign in front of it  which obscures it from the drivers view both available to download via Google maps Check the date you receive NTK mine was 71 days Do an SAR and you will get back the pictures of the alleged offence in my case they were of such poor quality you could not tell which way up the ticket was in the photo and in no image they held was there a picture showing the ticket and the vehicle numberplate. They offered no other evidence. Pretty soon you will see the money is being sought escalate until they no longer match the figure on the NTK even if it is sent within 56 days When you see a breakdown of costs for the money being sought it will ultimately include legal costs, typically £60 that the solicitor knows cannot be recovered in Small Claims Court. Personally I am now considering reporting BW legal to the law society or solicitors ombudsman for being party to a process which is fundamentally dishonest, an abuse of process, and a complete waste of court resources?   i am happy to help anyone who needs assistance but rest assured that their case against you relies on you caving in and paying, they have no plan B but will try and make you doubt your ability to defend yourself.   Dont worry about small claims Court, it isn’t crown court, just an office with 3 desks and certainly less stressful than a job interview or meeting with the bank and less at stake.   I got to one week from my court date and they gave up!
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I would be grateful for some advice on this, as I have been reading around UKPC Parking charges and seem to be getting a mixed message as how to proceed.

 

 

Yesterday I parked in a multi-storey shopping centre, in what I thought was a free space. I paid the ticket in a machine and returned to find a Parking Charge notice stuck to the windscreen.

 

 

I realised, having read the notice that I was parked in a permit only space. There was a sign which I had not seen, on the wall behind saying that it was a permit space but with a car full of children, I had not noticed.

 

 

The penalty is £100, reduced to £60 within 14 days.

 

 

Surely if they don't want to catch you out, they should make these spaces look more clearly different from the rest??

 

 

Should I contest, on the grounds of inadequate signage, or completely ignore this?

 

 

Please help - I do not have a spare £100 or even £60 and paid my parking fee in good faith!

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Hi don't ignore. Can you give more detail. Was the notice put onthe car while you went to buy the ticket?

Can you get photos of the signs?

Keep the ticket you purchased ... That is proof.

Do NOT write or ring them.

They will write to you as the KEEPER, they do not know who was driving and that is the way we need it at the moment.

 

Other CAGGERS will advise and form you defence.

Don't worry. Keep all letters and make a note of the day they arrive

Good Luck

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Thank you for replying.

 

 

It was a multi-storey - you collect a ticket at the barrier as you drive in. I then paid the ticket before returning to the car. You cannot get out of the car park without putting the ticket in to lift the barrier.

 

 

I didn't photograph the sign. It is possible that I could do this but I live 30 odd miles away so is it worth the petrol?

 

 

Having read some posts, I was wondering whether I should write to the Customer Service department of the shopping centre and say that it is unreasonable. As a visitor to the town I wasn't used to the car park etc etc which is after all the truth! It is the main shopping centre in the town -I'm not sure that they will care?

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who owns the car park? Is it a single store or a retail development. The former are better to deal with in getting ridiculous tickets cancelled as the likes of British Land and similar developers cant be bothered and cause upset to their tenants by hiring these people.

Basically, has you parking caused anyone a loss? The answer is most likely no and certainly UKPC havent been caused a loss as they are just agents of the owner, who likewise has your money for parking so the only person who could possibly claim a loss is the person who rents the space and if they were denied the opportunity to park there I'm sure they would have told you in no uncertain terms.

Wait for a notice to keeper to come through the post. this has to be between 28 and 56 days after the placing of the ticket on the screen, any other time and it is not compliant with the law and damages any claim made against you. IF you get that letter (not all parking co's bother) come back here for the wording of an appeal against the charge, the company has to consider it and if they reject your appeal (they almost always will) they are obliged to give you a POPLA reference code so you may appeal to an independent adjudicator.

Dont worry about it, it is not anything official.

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As to who owns the land, I'm not sure. It is the Eden Shopping centre, High Wycombe. I think it's an old car park that has been modernised as it was built for Sainsbury's in the 70's and then changed purpose when shopping centre built. If you look on the website it says they're managed by Savills commercial.

 

 

Is it better to wait for the notice, than to contest immediately?

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Is it better to wait for the notice, than to contest immediately?

 

Yes.

As ericsbrother says , wait for the notice to keeper.

Which may not come...

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Will trust the advice and wait! Have to admit the impulse is to act straight away but that's probably what they rely upon to for people to blame themselves and hand over the money, relieved to be paying £60 instead of £100.

 

 

The Eden centre indeed. Big misnomer.

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I bet that the original planning permission doesnt allow for such claims from estate agents. Sit it out for the present ans see what any letter says.

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Hello hope you can advise me as to what to do now,

 

 

I have received a request for payment and now a final reminder. The Final Reminder says that the vehicle was "recorded on private property, as follows:

Parked in a permit space without displaying a valid permit. "

 

 

There is a photo of the car which I have not accessed.

 

 

I have a couple of days left - should I contest the charge? And on what grounds?

Edited by elsiecon

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OK, so they didnt send a notice to keeper to you, as this letter is within the time allowed then you should write to the parking co with an appeal. The appeal should be on the basis of inadequate signage so therefore no contract can be foremed. If they reject this then they should give you a POPLA code so you can appeal their decision to an independent adjudicator. Dont go into any detail and dont say you were the dirver,

simply say you are "appealing as the keeper of the vehicle against the charge notice dated the 18th feb (use any reference number on the original charge notice) and that your appeal is on the basis of inadequate and confusing signage meant that no contract could be offered for consideration by the motorist. If you do not accept my appeal then please frovide a POPLA code".

They will undoubtedly reject your appeal otherwise they dont earn a bean out of this parking lark but you should get the code. No code means they cannot pursue you any further and a complaint to their trade asssociation would then be in order.

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When you get your next correspondedne complain to the BPA anyway about the failure to follow the protocls of the PoFA. Help with that willbe forthcoming when necessary.

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Hello again,

 

 

I have been informed that as I had not provided "more information" the appeals process is complete and that their view is that the Parking Charge has been correctly issued and will not be waived. They then offer payment at "reduced rate" of 60 pounds, or appeal to POPLA.

 

 

There is a POPLA ref. no. at the top of the letter.

 

 

I had followed your previous advise , with wording as above.

 

 

What do I do next, please?

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Easy. You appeal to popla with a specific defence. Sit tight and someone will be around asap to give you the advice you need. just so you know, the PPC's will always reject your appeal. Otherwise theyd never make any money. They are simply cowboy clampers operating under a different guise.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Will trust the advice and wait! Have to admit the impulse is to act straight away but that's probably what they rely upon to for people to blame themselves and hand over the money, relieved to be paying £60 instead of £100.

 

 

The Eden centre indeed. Big misnomer.

relieved to be paying £60!,no chance if caggers can help you your paying nowt!.

trust us .

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Have you written to the boss of the BPA and complained that his members are deliberately ignoring the legislation and their code of practice by repeated REFUSING to supply the POPLA code upon rejection of your appeal. Point out that you are aware that UKPC are habitual offenders in this manner and demand to know what the BPA intends to do to sanction it errant members. you can also complain to the DVLA (copy to your MP) that UKPC are obtaining vehicle keeper details for fraudulent purposes as they have no intention of using the information for the purpose it has been obtained by their continual failure to adhere to indusrty codes of practice and the regulations of the PoFA 2012 and ask the DVLA what they are going to to to ensure compliance with the DPA and their regulations in this matter.

All a bit long-winded but if enough people get writing the DVLA and parliament will get fed up and withdraw the consent of parking co's to chase the owner of a vehicle for the driver's debt.

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