Can I be sanctioned for NOT getting an interview?

[Sekhmet79]

Hey all. Just had an appointment with my lovely WP (Sarina Russo) adviser who totally lives in the real world. While he was pleased with my updated CV/cover and spec letter, he now wants me to get an interview by the time I see him again on the 10th of Feb. How on earth am I supposed to make this happen exactly? My last interview was around 5 months ago and even when I am 100% suitable and qualified for the position I apply for, I still dont hear back. He also wants me to take in a min of 10 employers to send CVs/spec letters to when I see him next.

 

What if I don't manage to get myself an interview? What can happen to me? My adviser never said to try and see if I get an interview - I must get one. This is asking a bit much of me as I cant make employers want to invite me for interviews.

[antone]

No, you can't be sanctioned simply for not getting an interview. JCP DMs may be strict, but you can't be mandated to force someone else to do something.

[Beatrice Bee]

In case your WP adviser thinks he is God and refers you to the DM for compliance doubt: be ready to be able to print out cover letters for job applications in which you state: you meet the requirements listed in the ad; you would be very happy to work for them and the reason why; you are available to start work ASAP and to attend an interview any day; please see my CV attached, With regards,..

 

This may get you a job interview if you are overqualified for the job and have the experience needed. Got me an interview 2 weeks ago. Not that the adviser is bothered about it. Kept asking me in December when my last interview was [sept].

 

If you get a letter from a DM asking for evidence, you attach the printouts and provide evidence to cover the "steps" and every single task in your Jobseekers Agreement and in the relevant written Action Plans [WP].

 

It is unrealistic to expect a jobseeker to get a job interview within the next two weeks. If it was that easy, we would not be signing on and put up with all the rubbish they giving us.

 

Email this adviser to ask him to help you to achieve this "task". They getting paid for it so might as well help. So if you can not get a job interview, it is because the WP adviser did not help. Spec letters are a waste of time. Applying for jobs that exist for sure makes more sense.

[Mr.P]

[...] he now wants me to get an interview by the time I see him again on the 10th of Feb. How on earth am I supposed to make this happen exactly?

 

Was this "directive" put in writing as a "mandatory activity" ?

If not, you can simply ignore it as wishful thinking on his part.

 

If it is in writing and correctly worded as a "mandatory activity", then I challenge it on the grounds of being unreasonable - You can't be expected to magic one out of thin air just because he wants you to.

 

Perhaps time to up the anti and ask what he is actually doing to "help" rather than sitting on his backside setting unrealistic targets.

[Beatrice Bee]

Advisers get a bonus [or the company] if they find you sustainable employment [ie it lasts at least 6 months].

Same applies if you find the job for yourself while on the WP.

 

Why don't you say to them you will make extra effort and get a job no matter what if you split the profit 50:50.

We talking thousands of pounds. No wonder adviser has wishful thinking. They are all low paid and supposed to get top up upon performance

which never happens so they change quickly: you never see an adviser more than 3 times because they get a new job ASAP.

Just finished the Work Programme. They did not make me do much. Nor pushed me to get interviews.

 

Got a signed copy of my monthly Action Plans with all the threats of the sanctions if I do not do it. Make sure they sign your copy.

Adviser can not pay rent and wants a bonus.

[Sekhmet79]

Was this "directive" put in writing as a "mandatory activity" ?

If not, you can simply ignore it as wishful thinking on his part.

 

If it is in writing and correctly worded as a "mandatory activity", then I challenge it on the grounds of being unreasonable - You can't be expected to magic one out of thin air just because he wants you to.

 

Perhaps time to up the anti and ask what he is actually doing to "help" rather than sitting on his backside setting unrealistic targets.

 

Well, on the "Action Plan" that he printed out for me says "Steps to Success and Progress: Target agreed is 1 job interview before this meeting". If I could push people into giving me interviews, Im sure Id be in employment by now.

 

Yes, we (the jobseeker) do all the hard work trying to get a job while they (the adviser) get all the credit for it. Ridiculous!

[Beatrice Bee]

Does this Steps to Success and Progress printout contain at the end the list of periods of possible sanctions? My monthly Action Plan print outs did, both me and the adviser signed it so guess it was mandated. However, the tasks were negotiable, most of them [eg apply for 20 jobs for week downgraded to 10 per week].

 

Target means you aim for it [but do not necessarily achieve it]. If you start complaining to the manager, the adviser may want to sanction you with underhand techniques, eg claiming he gave you a job [print out] to apply for and you did not apply. Do not be suprized that the alleged job will be on your file in your action plan. So email your adviser weekly to remind you via email [and not via phone] about the tasks and any print outs given.

 

You attach the print out of your email for the decision maker to see that you asked via email to be advised via email. If no reply, adviser failed to do her job.

[Sekhmet79]

This is the actual printout if that helps?

 

There is no specific job to apply for, I have to find that myself to get the interview.

[Beatrice Bee]

Yeah, but where is the bits that set out the possible sanctions if you don't do these actions?

It is ticked that the 14.30pm meeting is mandatory on 10/02/2014 with Mo.

The MAN Mandatory Activity Notice has to list the possible sanction periods for the various "sins" for non-compliance, otherwise the MAN is not valid.

No decision maker in their right mind will sanction you for not being able to secure a job interview within 10 days notice of your adviser asking to get one.

Do not panic if your JSA is not paid. They suspend it while decision maker looks at your response and reinstate it within a week or two of you posting all your evidence of trying to secure this one interview. In the letter say you keep a copy and proof of posting.

[Sekhmet79]

I see, so this is not a "must" even though he made it sound like it was. Sneaky! I will just feel silly going to the appointment in 10 days if I fail to get an interview because no doubt he will say its my fault.

[antone]

I see, so this is not a "must" even though he made it sound like it was. Sneaky! I will just feel silly going to the appointment in 10 days if I fail to get an interview because no doubt he will say its my fault.

 

Beatrice is right - there's no way in hell a DWP DM would apply a sanction under these circumstances. As to having to show up at the appointment without having found an interview, there's no reason to feel silly. The person who should feel silly is the person who made this ridiculous request.

[Sekhmet79]

lol yes, I did think it was a desperate attempt at making himself look useful.Thanks everyone!

[antone]

lol yes, I did think it was a desperate attempt at making himself look useful.Thanks everyone!

 

Well, good luck. Hope it goes OK.

[Mr.P]

I see, so this is not a "must" even though he made it sound like it was. Sneaky! I will just feel silly going to the appointment in 10 days if I fail to get an interview because no doubt he will say its my fault.

 

If Mo tries to make you feel silly, ask him what concrete help he has provided in order for you to meet this "target". I'm guessing that there has been no real assistance provided.

 

It would be interesting to see this "action plan" in its entirety (minus any identifying information) just to see if it conforms to the requirements of the DWP published guidance. (See https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/264163/wp-pg-chapter-3a-22-october-2012.pdf for details). If it lacks specific wording and/or the ESF & JCP logos, then it can be treated as an advisory, although it would take a brave man/woman to challenge it all the way.

[Sekhmet79]

I think he would class his "guidance" as improving my CV, cover and spec letter as help maybe? He hasnt done anything else as I have only had 2 appointments with him.

 

The action plan is exactly as I posted, I hadnt cropped anything out but here it is minus identity info..[ATTACH=CONFIG]48986[/ATTACH]

[Beatrice Bee]

If advisers hand you the print out of a job opportunity asking you to apply for it, DWP policy calls it a Notified Vacancy and you have to apply for it, otherwise it is RE, Refusal of Employment which can result in a 26 weeks sanction.

 

When your adviser asks you to apply for a job, the periods of possible sanctions for non compliance are not listed yet you are done if you do not apply for it.

 

On this basis, you are to sort yourself a job interview within 10 days, whether possible sanctions are listed or not. However, decision makers I assume to be more knowledgeable and more wise than WP advisers. Hence they can make decisions over WP / JCP adviser referrals.

 

Would Mo make a laughing stock of himself and refer you to DM for you not being able to fix a job interview within 10 calendar days upon his written notice?

 

Keep us posted and try not to worry about it. He gets a bonus if you find a job so no wonder he is pushing you, even in an unrealistic manner.

[Mr.P]

The action plan is exactly as I posted, I hadnt cropped anything out but here it is minus identity info..

 

Well, if that is the letter in its entirety, it is non-compliant with DWP guidance on Mandatory Activity Notices - In other words, getting a sanction upheld would be difficult. The adviser could raise a benefit doubt which generally gets converted in to a sanction by the DWP, but it would most likely get overturned on reconsideration. See the annexes in Chapter 3a in post #14 above.

 

If advisers hand you the print out of a job opportunity asking you to apply for it, DWP policy calls it a Notified Vacancy and you have to apply for it, otherwise it is RE, Refusal of Employment which can result in a 26 weeks sanction.

 

I had a couple of those posted to me - One was rejected as it didn't arrive until after the closing date (posted 2nd class). Another, I had applied for, and passed the primary selection process before the "adviser" even saw the vacancy. Didn't tell him that I had already applied.... Never heard anything more about it.