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Hadenoughcrap

Jobseekers Allowance Advisor faked? my claimant commitment

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Hi guys,

 

I hope you can help me.

 

I signed on for the first time a few days ago.

 

I should have really signed on, a long time, due to not having enough regular work,

but i remember how the advisors at the job centre,

take pride in intimidation and decided that i would rather be broke than have to deal with their insultive mannerisms.

 

i arrive for my 1st meeting with Advisor 1.

She looked like she was very board to see me, the feeling was mutual.

 

After getting me to sign what i had agreed in my online application form,

she gave me no copy,

she walked me over to the 2nd Advisor.

 

She was colder than the first and didn't even speak to me, she just kept on typing.

when i asked what she was doing, she said delating templates.

If i looked at the screen for too long then, she would switch the screen, to numbers, lots of different numbers.

 

When i asked what was happening,

she said that she had been having problems with the computer.

But only when i was looking at the screen.

 

Typical….. Anyway,

 

after about 15 mins, she gave me my claimant commitment.

 

as soon as i started to read it, amazingly, after 15 mins of only talking when i spoke to her she started to talk to me…

.I WILL USE JOBSITES AND EMPLOYERS WEBSITES

…..I WILL LOG ON TO UNIVERAL JOBMATCH…

..I WILL RESPOND PROMTLY TO CONTACTS/EMPLOYERS AND JOBSITES

 

, after the 5th, I WILL, I asked if this was compulsory

…remember i was trying to read the claimant commitment, she said it was a requirement for JSA.

 

All of this took over 40mins.

I obviously knew that they at the job centre would take advantage of my unemployed status

but i wasn't prepared for what actually really happened.

 

As i said, the 2nd advisor only spoke to respond to my questions and then, the I WILL section, that she fired at me,

whilst i was trying to read the so called agreement.

 

A few days later i decided to read the so called commitment, only to find that i had agreed to,

 

Available for all types of work

Travel 90mins each way to work

Available any time any day for min 40hrs Hrs

 

The only thing i agreed to was all the I WILL section, because of the false info she gave me.

 

Fact is i didn't agree simply because she didn't ask me.

 

What am i gonna do?

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Hi Hadenoughcrap

Welcome to The Consumer Action Group.

 

 

I am just letting you know that as you haven't had any replies to your post yet, it might be better if you post your message again in an appropriate sub-forum. You will get lots of help there.

 

Also take some time to read around the forum and get used to the layout. It is a big forum and takes a lot of getting used to.

 

 

Once you start to find your way, you will soon realise that it is fairly easy to get round and to get the help you need.

 

It can be bit confusing at first.


Please be advised that my time will be limited for the next few weeks.Thanks for your understanding.

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Hi, while it would be nice if the advisors were friendly and relaxed, many of them suffer 'work fatigue' due to the repetativeness of their work and so tend to lose enthusiasm for work that many employees in other types of employment enjoy. The things that you have agreed to do towards seeking work are normal requirements for job seekers. People may decline to agree to a 90 minute commute if they have caring commitments or children to collect from child care, but otherwise 90 minutes is now standard.

 

When you say what are you gonna do, please can you explain what you are asking? Do you not feel that you can complete the steps needed in your job seekers agreement to seek employment?

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.I WILL USE JOBSITES AND EMPLOYERS WEBSITES

…..I WILL LOG ON TO UNIVERAL JOBMATCH…

..I WILL RESPOND PROMTLY TO CONTACTS/EMPLOYERS AND JOBSITES

 

Available for all types of work

Travel 90mins each way to work

Available any time any day for min 40hrs Hrs

 

You're not going to like me for this, so apologies in advance...

 

 

Unfortunately, this is pretty much a standard JSA agreement. It will also state that you will contact X number of employers and apply for Y number of jobs per week - This is the minimum they expect of you and it is strongly advisable to do more than this or risk a sanction.

 

If you are reliant on public transport, you can go back and insist that the hours of availability is changed to reflect the times buses run - for example, if the first bus is at 06:30 and the last bus back is 21:00 Mon-Fri, available hours are 08:30-17:00 mon-Fri. Next, which is easier if you have carer responsibilities (children or elderly relative), available for work given 24 hours notice. Finally, if there is work you are unsuited for (e.g. telesales or working with food) on moral, religious, or health grounds, this must be stated.

 

As the agreement currently stands, you could be required to apply for work as a toilet cleaner or a brain surgeon with immediate start working the night shift up to an hour and a half travel time from home.

 

The hard part us getting this agreement changed to suit you. Try discussing it with the adviser next time you sign on.


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

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No... you can't eat my brain just yet. I need it a little while longer.

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Hi i don't have any issues with what I should be doing to find work. The problem is that i was not asked, what type of work I'm looking for, how far i am willing to travel.

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Hi i don't have any issues with what I should be doing to find work. The problem is that i was not asked, what type of work I'm looking for, how far i am willing to travel.

 

You don't, unfortunately, get to decide these things. I can't remember the rules regarding type of work (it used to be that you could restrict your search to your "usual occupation" for a short time, but that may have changed recently) but you are expected to travel 90 mins by your usual method of transport and unless you can show good reason for restrictions on this, you're stuck with it.


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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If I am reading the first post correctly.

The JSA was signed, but then a second adviser came along and changed the agreement. Is that common practice these days?

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If I am reading the first post correctly.

The JSA was signed, but then a second adviser came along and changed the agreement. Is that common practice these days?

 

I think you are reading the first post correctly, but that OP is not interpreting the situation correctly. When a person claims JSA, the first adviser really just processes the details of the claim, then passes on to another adviser who is supposed to set up the Labour Market details. The first adviser asked OP to sign the claim document, which isn't a JSAg, it's just asking them to confirm the details they provided over the phone or online. The second adviser asked them to sign an JSAg.

 

I mean, I just don't see what's unusual about this.


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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As the agreement currently stands, you could be required to apply for work as a toilet cleaner or a brain surgeon with immediate start working the night shift up to an hour and a half travel time from home.

 

 

 

 

I'm amazed that the JC can demand this.

 

 

Based on that (if I was claiming JSA, which I did for 24 hours once and saw the light and went the ESA route instead) I could easily be approaching the outskirts of Paris to the South, halfway to Devon to the West, somewhere mid channel to Belgium to the East and Cambridge to the North!!!

 

 

All of this for up to 40 hours at £6.20 an hour? Who the blazes is going to pay for the diesel and the obvious wear and tear on my vehicle? 90 minutes would equate to a minimum of 120 miles radius, costing £50 a day round trip in fuel alone?

 

 

Come on, this has to be a wind up. Would I be expected to work 6 hours a day for 6 days and 4 hours on a Sunday on varying shifts for £250 a week before deductions.

 

 

I have to use my car as it is more convenient owing to where I live and due to health reasons have difficulties using public transport. My vehicle is tax exempt due to HRM of DLA and have a Blue Badge so that I can park close to where I need to be.

Being disabled isn't the same as being sick or too sick for work although and thankfully I did manage to convince the DWP that I was entitled to ESA simply because of the descriptor choice, but given that I am still able to work full time.

Edited by solbert

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90 minutes would equate to a minimum of 120 miles radius, costing £50 a day round trip in fuel alone?

 

Unless you are sitting on top of a high speed rail link or have access to a private jet, 120 miles in 90 minutes is way out. Using a private car, this would equate to an average of 80MPH. Average speed during the daytime is typically around 40-45mph, less during rush hour or in urban areas. With the use of a private car, this would limit the commute to around 60-70 miles. If you are reliant on public transport, this distance could be as little as 10 miles or as much as 50.

 

Sure, I could look for work in Amsterdam (10min walk to the airport, 60min flight time, and 20min train to the centre), but not for anything less than £500,000p.a. - Fortunately, even the JCP is not daft enough to compel a claimant to seek employment overseas.


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

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No... you can't eat my brain just yet. I need it a little while longer.

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I'm amazed that the JC can demand this.

 

 

Based on that (if I was claiming JSA, which I did for 24 hours once and saw the light and went the ESA route instead) I could easily be approaching the outskirts of Paris to the South, halfway to Devon to the West, somewhere mid channel to Belgium to the East and Cambridge to the North!!!

 

 

 

(In another thread)Thank you. It really annoys me to see people trying to circumvent the system for an easier life.

 

 

Unable to work due to sickness - claim ESA

Out of work/working under 16 hours a week - claim JSA

 

 

I heard recently of a guy aged 56 who was originally claiming JSA (income based) and didn't like the way he was being told by the JC+ over his looking for work activities. His wife being some years older became entitled to claim Pension Credit. As soon as that was possible he cancelled his JSA claim and made a joint claim for Guaranteed Pension Credit. When asked why, he was quite honest and said that he could now please himself what he does and doesn't have to answer to the JC any longer.

 

 

Totally immoral and shameful.

 

Hi Solbert, are you able to tell us more about the light you saw? It may help others to circumvent the system for an easier life.

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i found the advisors at the jobcentre more polite than the ones at ingeus where i go for the WP.

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Hi Solbert, are you able to tell us more about the light you saw? It may help others to circumvent the system for an easier life.

 

 

 

The 'light' appeared within just a few minutes of arriving at the JC. I have never been to a more depressing place in my life (and that was just the building!) As for the 'claimants' most seem to have just dropped out of bed and hadn't changed their clothes for a week or made any effort at all as regards cleanliness.

 

 

I had my first and only interview and within a few hours told them where to file the claim!!!!

 

 

I shouldn't have to put up with that environment unemployed/sick or whatever.

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Unless you are sitting on top of a high speed rail link or have access to a private jet, 120 miles in 90 minutes is way out. Using a private car, this would equate to an average of 80MPH. Average speed during the daytime is typically around 40-45mph, less during rush hour or in urban areas. With the use of a private car, this would limit the commute to around 60-70 miles. If you are reliant on public transport, this distance could be as little as 10 miles or as much as 50.

 

Sure, I could look for work in Amsterdam (10min walk to the airport, 60min flight time, and 20min train to the centre), but not for anything less than £500,000p.a. - Fortunately, even the JCP is not daft enough to compel a claimant to seek employment overseas.

 

 

Yes I do live within 1 mile of the High speed link to London (53 mins to London) and 1 mile from the Eurostar station as well as the channel tunnel rail link and 2 miles from the port of Dover.

In 90 mins, depending on traffic of course, 120/140 miles is not that difficult. Grief I can get to Manchester from the South East in well under 4 hours on average with a distance of just over 300 miles.

 

 

My argument is that by car using motorways, in 90 mins, my vehicle will use 4 galls of diesel - £25 each way!!

Would the JC expect me to do that?

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The 'light' appeared within just a few minutes of arriving at the JC. I have never been to a more depressing place in my life (and that was just the building!) As for the 'claimants' most seem to have just dropped out of bed and hadn't changed their clothes for a week or made any effort at all as regards cleanliness.

 

 

I had my first and only interview and within a few hours told them where to file the claim!!!!

 

 

I shouldn't have to put up with that environment unemployed/sick or whatever.

 

Well, there are plenty of unemployed and sick people on ESA who have to endure it. Did the light point this out?

 

Is Pension Credit available to you yet? If it wasn't so immoral and shameful, you could circumvent the local jobcentre completely.

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Well, there are plenty of unemployed and sick people on ESA who have to endure it. Did the light point this out?

 

Is Pension Credit available to you yet? If it wasn't so immoral and shameful, you could circumvent the local jobcentre completely.

 

That is as may be. But it doesn't excuse the inability to smarten oneself up when attending or maybe have a wash/bath.

Tell me is it normal for the JC to accept that outside their building there were 7 young people with what looked like cider cans in their hands at 10am?

 

As a matter of interest Pension Credit has been available to us for the past 9 years if we wanted to claim it (my wife is 69)!!! However as I am too sick to work, I believe that it is only right that I make a claim for the relevant benefit - ESA instead of opting for the easier option of Pension Credit. However my ESA will cease in June when I turn 65 when I will be forced to claim Pension Credit instead.

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Maybe they can't afford to wash themselves or to wash or buy more clothes. Maybe they have no hot water.

 

There is no crime about drinking cider at whatever time of day, who is to say who bought it anyway but I make no judgement and jump to no conclusions.

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My local jobcentre maybe had one or two people standing outside, usually waiting for a friend or partner who has an appointment. I guess they go outside because they want to smoke, or because the office itself is stuff, claustrophobic and has no place to wait in any case.

 

They don't drink cider (JCP wouldn't put up with that and in that area it's against the law) but I do sometimes see folks with cans of those energy drink things that are inexplicably popular with young folks. From a distance, the cans look like beer or cider cans I suppose. But really, the idea that ne'e'r do wells would choose the freakin' Jobcentre, of all places, to hang out and booze is absurd on its face.


PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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That is as may be. But it doesn't excuse the inability to smarten oneself up when attending or maybe have a wash/bath.

Tell me is it normal for the JC to accept that outside their building there were 7 young people with what looked like cider cans in their hands at 10am?

 

Don't know if it is normal. but I don't think that even jobcentre staff have the authority to move people on from a public area.

 

How young were they? Perhaps they were just holding their cans for their mums and dads while they signed on.

 

As a matter of interest Pension Credit has been available to us for the past 9 years if we wanted to claim it (my wife is 69)!!! However as I am too sick to work, I believe that it is only right that I make a claim for the relevant benefit - ESA instead of opting for the easier option of Pension Credit. However my ESA will cease in June when I turn 65 when I will be forced to claim Pension Credit instead.

 

Ah! So this light you saw made you so ill you claimed ESA instead of JSA, is that right? Or was ESA an easier option to avoid the cider swilling riff raff at the jobcentre?

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Don't know if it is normal. but I don't think that even jobcentre staff have the authority to move people on from a public area.

 

How young were they? Perhaps they were just holding their cans for their mums and dads while they signed on.

Even worse!!

 

 

 

Ah! So this light you saw made you so ill you claimed ESA instead of JSA, is that right? Or was ESA an easier option to avoid the cider swilling riff raff at the jobcentre?

 

Nope. I was unemployed and at the same time had a medical condition that would see me put into the Support Group of ESA.

 

 

ESA does not relate to being too sick to work, it relates entirely to being able to 'pass' the relevant descriptor.

 

 

So I had the choice, JSA or ESA. I tried JSA as that seemed to me to be the right thing to do. I quickly decided otherwise and claimed ESA and was put in the SG for 3 years. I'm not too sick to work, just able to pass the relevant descriptor due to a disability.

 

 

'Cannot repeatedly mobilise 50 metres within a reasonable timescale because of significant discomfort'.

 

Yes I could have claimed PC instead and had an easier life (no medicals/no signing on) but that was the wrong thing to do morally.

Edited by solbert

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Nope. I was unemployed and at the same time had a medical condition that would see me put into the Support Group of ESA.

 

 

ESA does not relate to being too sick to work, it relates entirely to being able to 'pass' the relevant descriptor.

 

 

So I had the choice, JSA or ESA. I tried JSA as that seemed to me to be the right thing to do. I quickly decided otherwise and claimed ESA and was put in the SG for 3 years. I'm not too sick to work, just able to pass the relevant descriptor due to a disability.

 

 

'Cannot repeatedly mobilise 50 metres within a reasonable timescale because of significant discomfort'.

 

Yes I could have claimed PC instead and had an easier life (no medicals/no signing on) but that was the wrong thing to do morally.

 

I see. You're just fed up and old.

 

BTW you pass the descriptor for Pension Credit. Claiming a Sickness Benefit while fit for work, is both immoral and illegal.

 

Both the above assume you are not trolling, of course.

Edited by Minibits
Just realised who this guy is.

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I think it's ok to claim whatever you are legally entitled to if you are truthful and honest in your claim. However if we were considering trying to keep costs down so with the huge cuts being made and the budget restraints it might be better to claim pension credit, one assessment then no more admin fees than claim ESA with regular assessments and admin processes costing time and money. Money that is being needlessly spent when something cheaper to administer is available? jmo though and it's not wrong to choose something else out of pride or stubboness or for whatever reason if it's legal.

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Interesting points

Of course if someone can not walk 50m they also can claim higher rate mobility and possibly care, if DLA care is involved then there is carers allowance.

 

Claim what you are entitled to but lets make sure those that are entitled to it can get it and those conning the system get stopped.

 

The only thing that gets me is that you can noy use a mobile in the job centre and by that I mean txt, play games, read ...it has to be away. They claim its for privacy but thats not what I think


Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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Nope. I was unemployed and at the same time had a medical condition that would see me put into the Support Group of ESA.

 

 

ESA does not relate to being too sick to work, it relates entirely to being able to 'pass' the relevant descriptor.

 

 

So I had the choice, JSA or ESA. I tried JSA as that seemed to me to be the right thing to do. I quickly decided otherwise and claimed ESA and was put in the SG for 3 years. I'm not too sick to work, just able to pass the relevant descriptor due to a disability.

 

 

'Cannot repeatedly mobilise 50 metres within a reasonable timescale because of significant discomfort'.

 

Yes I could have claimed PC instead and had an easier life (no medicals/no signing on) but that was the wrong thing to do morally.

Have you checked your gutters this year yet Andy? Don't forget to fix the fascia boards and soffits while you're up there.


 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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