Unplanned overdrafts and statute barred.

[charharp]

After the big discussion on statute barred I think a single thread for overdrafts is needed due to it's complexity and also the need to get real life dealings with the DCA's because no one seems to know if they accept SB on overdrafts 6 years after no payment.

 

It would help a lot of us on here if people who have tried for statute barred on overdrafts with DCA's can tell us about the outcome and wether it was a simple overdraft recall or the account went into unplanned overdraft.

[Peterbard]

After the big discussion on statute barred I think a single thread for overdrafts is needed due to it's complexity and also the need to get real life dealings with the DCA's because no one seems to know if they accept SB on overdrafts 6 years after no payment.

 

It would help a lot of us on here if people who have tried for statute barred on overdrafts with DCA's can tell us about the outcome and wether it was a simple overdraft recall or the account went into unplanned overdraft.

 

My overdraft does not have a repayment schedule, does this mean that the cause of action has already begun ?

 

Also if i just withdrew form it for six years would l it then be statute barred.

 

Whilst your thinking about that, does not there have to be a breach in order for a cause of action to occur ? If I have an overdraft and it is not recalled where is the breach ?

 

[charharp]

Being repayable on demand at any time and no breach being required to do I would say yes limitations begins after every activity. Banks will recall overdrafts after 12 months of inactivity so this will be date of limitations at the latest as it is in terms and conditions.

 

Going off your previous arguments that the overdraft and unplanned overdraft are two separate things how can there ever be a breach on an overdraft? If you go over limit this is an unplanned overdraft and 'separate' so how would it be possible to breach? Taking the word of Brig that SB is always accepted on OD 6 years after last payment I think the OD do not require a breach to start limitations because COA is when the bank first has the option to recall which is whenever they want so limitations is deferred to last activity on account.

[Peterbard]

OK simplifying the matter further.

 

All actions in law require a cause, this is some wrong that has been done to the injured party. This may be an action in tort like theft or it could be a breach of contract like missing payments.

 

You cannot have a cause of action just for making a transaction, there is no wrong done to either party, no reason to take an action.

 

The fact that a loan is re-callable does not make either party liabel for breach of contract(there is none), the breach comes if the demand is made and not paid, this is why the COA in the case of overdrafts is usually ion the recall of the arrangement.

 

 

If a customer tries to overdraw on a current account and the bank does not let him, and places his account in debit for a consideration to apply overdraft fee, this is a cause of action on the current account, and runs from the breach of that contract.

 

If the bank allows the overdraft, they must send notification of the terms of this arrangement to the debtor under section 74 a of the act this will then run until it is recalled, if again this repayment is not made this would be the cause of action.

 

[Peterbard]

trying to understand your difficulty in understanding this.

 

I think you may be under the impression that an overdraft in itself is a breach of contract.

If so you are incorrect, an overdraft is a regulated agreement under the consumer credit act(running account credit section 10 also see section 74)

 

The kinds of overdraft are not my perception they are itemized in section 61a 74a and 74b of the consumer credit act.

 

They are a pre arranged overdraft, a tacit overdraft and an unauthorized overdraft in sequence as above. The latter would present a cause of action upon initiation and the debtor would recieve a notice and recall under section 74b when it was initiated.

 

All these regulations are contained here http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2010/1010/contents/made

 

I do not invent these things , I study, and the information is based on fact not hearsay or just belief, if you wish to check what is said here I suggest you do the same.

 

[charharp]

Unarranged overdraft would be a breach. COA is when creditor can first demand full repayment, they can do this any time with an overdraft so breach not required.

[Peterbard]

Unarranged overdraft would be a breach. COA is when creditor can first demand full repayment, they can do this any time with an overdraft so breach not required.

 

You seem incapable of reading what is written, ther are differnt kinds of overdrawiing on accounts, the tacit overdraft is unplanded but the bank allows it

 

74A. (1) This section applies to a current account agreement where there is the possibility that the account-holder may be allowed to overdraw on the current account without a pre-arranged overdraft or exceed a pre-arranged overdraft limit.

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2010/1010/regulation/21/made

 

Why do you not read the information provided for you.

 

signing out

 

[fletch70]

Boys Boys please ( I know you are an old fart really Dodge and it's a long time since you were called a boy)

 

Charharp, from what I can see you place a lot of importance to the statement made by the Brigadier and indeed have used some of his language but have yet (from what I can remember) shown any over riding statute or case law. It seems that you are full of feelings which do not have any legal standpoint.

I think it is important to remember that most cases seen on here or probably in the "real" world are where defaults and terminations/recalls have taken place, the account may well have been subject to a payment plan etc in which case the 6 years from last payment would be correct.

We are talking theoretical here and I can find so many inconsistencies that would make some of your feelings inconsistent.

 

As I mentioned somewhere, what happens if you have money in another account and the bank does not recall your OD or use set off.....do youjust have to wait 6 years and that's yours?

If you go OD on day 1 of your arranged OD but do not exceed the limit , at the end of the 12 months the bank decide to cancel your OD due to lack of use, have they lost a year of limitations...or two years etc

If you do not pay into the account but use the account to make payments, would those payments class as acknowledgement , I would suggest yes they do (either that or theft)

 

Dodge, you have made some very well argued points, as i say try as I might I can not fully get my head around all of them but there does seem to be logic in there. Mike has put some very good links in with huge amount of resources but even they need to be interpreted .

 

Personally I can see no real point in this continuing as we seem to have an immovable object coming up against an unstoppable force:lol:

[Peterbard]

Boys Boys please ( I know you are an old fart really Dodge and it's a long time since you were called a boy)

 

Charharp, from what I can see you place a lot of importance to the statement made by the Brigadier and indeed have used some of his language but have yet (from what I can remember) shown any over riding statute or case law. It seems that you are full of feelings which do not have any legal standpoint.

I think it is important to remember that most cases seen on here or probably in the "real" world are where defaults and terminations/recalls have taken place, the account may well have been subject to a payment plan etc in which case the 6 years from last payment would be correct.

We are talking theoretical here and I can find so many inconsistencies that would make some of your feelings inconsistent.

 

As I mentioned somewhere, what happens if you have money in another account and the bank does not recall your OD or use set off.....do youjust have to wait 6 years and that's yours?

If you go OD on day 1 of your arranged OD but do not exceed the limit , at the end of the 12 months the bank decide to cancel your OD due to lack of use, have they lost a year of limitations...or two years etc

If you do not pay into the account but use the account to make payments, would those payments class as acknowledgement , I would suggest yes they do (either that or theft)

 

Dodge, you have made some very well argued points, as i say try as I might I can not fully get my head around all of them but there does seem to be logic in there. Mike has put some very good links in with huge amount of resources but even they need to be interpreted .

 

Personally I can see no real point in this continuing as we seem to have an immovable object coming up against an unstoppable force:lol:

 

I fletch you are absolutely right, I am an old fart.

 

ch

 

I go out of my way to present authority and legislature to support all my points, the reason I do this is because of the way I was taught to study(being an old fart).

 

I do not start with any preset ideas or beliefs, I try to investigate and then make up my mind based on the relevant authoritative information available, this is why I always quote authority, it is what i base my opinions on.

 

If you were to come up with any authority which contradicts what I have said, I would welcome it, you may not believe me but it is true.

 

I only need to get a subject right, I have no other concern. However you do not produce any, you just repeat a belief which you hold without any real grounding in knowledge.

[silverfox1961]

Thread temporarily closed.

[silverfox1961]

Final warning. If you cannot keep it civil, further moderation will happen

[Peterbard]

Copied this valuable find by Fletch on here as it is entirely relevant to this discussion.

 

Quote Originally Posted by fletch70 View Post

One thing I have found in this

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=w...%20QBD&f=false

 

The cause of action on an overdrafticon is when the overdraft is called in.

 

I will continue my research tomorrow

Hmm

 

This thread has ben busy

 

Good find this Fletch noticed this on page 92

 

“Claims by banks to recover overdrafts usually accrues on a demand I writing (section 6 sol)”

 

Sounds vaguely familiar

 

.

[fletch70]

I would love to say it was my find but it came from one of Mikes posts and links...I just followed various links

[citizenB]

If I recall, current accounts and SB status was covered in the other thread. I am therefore closing this thread as already it has descended into chaos.