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    • Don't worry, we're getting there bit by bit.   Tomorrow evening I'll try to deal with your questions.   The photos you've taken are superb - they show the signs as tiny and not illuminated.    
    • Good thinking! I only requested the telephone hearing (in the body of the email) and will send the further note tomorrow to cover all bases!
    • @FTMDave i am attaching the photographs of the Alama park please have a look. Checking your previous post where you corrected some line and suggest some but i could not understand. Is it possible if you edit and delete irrelevant lines.    I have edited little bit but not sure what to add and what to look for   Mr XXX, of xxx and I am the Defendant against whom this claim is made. 1.1. I was the registered keeper of the vehicle XXX. 1.2. The facts in this statement come from my personal knowledge. Where they are not within my own knowledge they are true to the best of my information and belief.   INSUFFICIENT & CONFUSING SIGNAGE  This is likely to be one of your aces so will need a lot of work once you get photos.  The fleecers have also shown a plan where they claim there are signs (their WS post 12, PDF page 15 which you need to confront).   2. I confirm that i was the registered Keeper of the vehicle which is in question in this case and the vehicle was parked in Alma leisure centre Chesterfield. The vehicle was parked there because the driver went to McDonald’s for eat in (the bank statement proof exhibit 1).   3. There were no clear signs at the entrance nor in the car park, it was night time and weather was not clear as well.   3.  Even if the driver had seen the signs, they would have been extremely confusing.  A car is normally allowed to be parked for five hours, yet after midnight this is changed to one hour.  This begs the question for how long a motorist entering at 10pm for example is allowed to stay.  Is it for five hours until 3am or until 1am?   3.1. The PCN/NTK states "period of parking 00:02:05".  It is common sense that a couple of minutes was needed to enter the complex, find McDonald's and find a parking space, before the period of parking began, so it was likely the car entered the car park before midnight allowing the driver to park the car there for five hours.   4.  Even if the driver had seen the signage - they did not - the mention of a £100 charge is literally the last word on the last line of a long board of text.   4. I am not liable to the Claimant for the sum claimed, or any amount at all and this is my Witness Statement in support of my defence as already filed.     UNFAIR TERM   4.  In an interview with the local newspaper (exhibit XXX) Ms Ellie Berkeley, HX PCN administration team leader, said: “The five-hour maximum stay prevents workers from close by abusing the land and parking there for free, without using the shops on site" which makes sense.   5.  This therefore begs the question of why this limit is cut by a massive 80% after midnight when the cinema and eateries are still open.  The driver indeed ate at McDonald's.   6.  Ms Berkeley continued: "Five hours is sufficient time to visit the cinema and also eat at a restaurant".  Certainly five hours are sufficient.  One hour is not.    7.  I would maintain this is an unfair term under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 part 2 section 62 (6) ""A notice is unfair if, contrary to the requirement of good faith, it causes a significant imbalance in the parties’ rights and obligations to the detriment of the consumer".  Such a term has absolutely nothing to do with efficient management of a car park and everything to do with trying to catch diners or cinema-goers out and thus have an excuse to issue PCNs.   NO KEEPER LIABILITY   5. The Particulars of Claim do not clarify in what capacity they believe I am liable but state that the Defendant is “liable as the driver or keeper” of the vehicle. This appears to be “fishing” for liability.  Is this really in the PoCs? - you need to look and find out. Where to look on PCN letter?   The rest of your section is about the use of POFA at airports which is completely irrelevant.    Adapt LFI's suggestions re POFA and keeper liability -   First is the fact that they must have a parking period and it is quite clear that entering and leaving the car park does not constitute a parking period since some of the time the motorist is either driving around looking for a parking spot then leaving the spot and driving to the exit. All that takes time so that is one fail.   The other fail is in their wording when they are trying to transfer the liability of the alleged debt from the driver to the keeper. They are supposed to include at Schedule 4 s9 [2][f] this "(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)". That in itself makes it non compliant but the fact that they haven't got a parking period means they haven't met the applicable conditions.   PROHIBITION  This deals with no stopping cases.  Yours in not no stopping so it is completely irrelevant.   LOCUS STANDI   You have quoted a different contract in a different place with a different PPC.  You need to read and try to find holes in the contract they produced (post 12, page 15 of the PDF for anyone looking in). What shall i add here   Adapt LFI's suggestions -   Looking at their contract, the names of the signatories and their positions in their respective  companies have been redacted. You do need strict proof of who actually signed. There is no specific authorisation from the Client to allow Court action in pursuit of non payers. In section 11 which is like an addendum it states" the Company shall provide parking control" but doesn't state if that includes legal pursuit as well and it does not appear to be signed.   ILLEGAL SIGNAGE   8. After checking, I have found out that there in NO planning permission granted for said signs, therefore making them illegal as lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under the Road Traffic Acts 1962 and 1991 and no contract can be performed where criminality is concerned.   LFI's suggestion -   They are supposed to comply with the Law and the IPC code of Conduct and they have done neither. The new Private Parking Code of Practice  draws attention to it as well  s14.1 [g]  "g) responsibility for obtaining relevant consents e.g. planning or advertising consents relating to signs."   ABUSE OF PROCESS  I've cut some bits out as the CoP hadn't been published when the fleecers went after you.  Are you sure the Unicorn Food Tax in the PoCs is £60? ( I couldn't understand this)   9. The Claimant seeks recovery of the original £100 parking charge plus an additional £60 described as “contractual costs and interest” or “debt collection costs”. No further justification or breakdown has been provided as required under Civil Procedure Rule 16.4.    9.1. As part of the provisions of the Parking (Code of Practice) Act 2019, on 07/02/2022 a new Code of Practice was published by the government, designed to prevent these “rogue” traders from "ripping people off" (the minister's words) with extra charges, which have been deemed unfair (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/privateparking-code-of-practice/private-parking-code-of-practice).    9.3. Section 9 of the new Code of Practice, regulates the matter of recovery costs: “The parking operator must not levy additional costs over and above the level of a parking charge or parking tariff as originally issued.”   9.2. Even before publication of the government’s Code of Practice, Parliament intended that private parking companies could not invent extra charges. PoFA Schedule 4, paragraph 4(5) states that “The maximum sum which may be recovered from the keeper is the amount specified in the notice to keeper” which in this case is £100.    9.4. Previous parking charge cases have found that the parking charge itself is at a level to include the costs of recovery ie: Parking Eye Ltd vs Beavis (2015) UKSC 67 which is the authority for recovery of the parking charge itself and no more, since that sum (£85) was held to already incorporate the costs of an automated private parking business model and the Supreme Court Judges held that a parking firm not in possession cannot plead any part of their case in damages. It is indisputable that an alleged “parking charge” penalty is a sum which the Supreme Court found is already inflated to more than comfortably cover all costs. The case provides a finding of fact by way of precedent, that the £85 (or up to a Trade Body ceiling of £100 depending on the parking firm) covers the costs of the letters. Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated ‘’Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones-Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates [...] in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared [...] the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.’’    9.5. In Claim numbers F0DP806M and F0DP201T, Britannia vs Crosby the courts went further in a landmark judgement in November 2019 which followed several parking charge claims being struck out in the area overseen by His Honour Judge Iain HamiltonDouglas Hughes GC, the Designated Civil Judge for Dorset, Hampshire, Isle of Wight & Wiltshire. District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ‘’It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverable under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in ParkingEye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''    9.6. The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.     Statement of Truth    Alma Leisure.pdf Alma leisure centre.pdf
    • One thing I forgot to mention is I'm in Scotland, does the process change or is it then same? 
    • A copy of that to transunion should get it fixed in 24 hrs imho.    
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Duncton, Moneybarn, Shoosmiths Claim *** Claim Discontinued***


Soul Reaver
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Hi Guys

 

Way back on 4th of October 2003 I had a Mitsubishi L200 from Duncton. I paid 10k of a 17k lease but gave the vehicle back after duncton failed to provide me with a tax disc as part of the agreement. They could not provide a tax disc at the time because they could not find the MOT and I suspected I had been driving it illegally.

 

Over the years they have occasionaly sent me letters claiming I owe them 6k of the remaining lease all of which I have ignored.

 

Today I recieved a load of photocopied papers that were sent from Salford County Court Money Claims Centre. If you receive a real county court judgement don't they send you out the papers fom the county court and don't they send originals?

 

The claimants solictors on the forms is Shoosmiths and he is a trainee.

 

Is any of this real? I checked out whois for moneyclaims.co.uk and it was first registered on 20th March 2012. This is the address

 

96, Town Gate

Wyke Bradford

BD12 9JB

United Kingdom

 

Not only that but surely this is statute barred anyway after over 10 years?

 

Cheers for your help

Edited by slick132
removed individual's name - not nec'y
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Did you receive a claim form with the paperwork ? You could always telephone the court to establish if it is genuine. Claims are now issued via the Bulk issuing centres. I thought it was Northampton, but perhaps there is also one in Salford. I will ask others to look in on you.

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Hi Soul,

 

The Salford CCMCC office has been operating for a year or two now and they process all newly started claims, which used to be started at one's local County Court.

 

1. When was the CCJ issued by the court and does it have a court seal on the copy sent to you.

 

2. Has your home address changed since the dispute first started.

 

3. Is your home address shown on the CCJ.

 

4. Who sent you these papers. Did they come from the CCMCC office, or from the solicitors.

 

5. Have you had any contact recently either with the court offices or with the sol'rs.

 

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Hi Soul,

 

The Salford CCMCC office has been operating for a year or two now and they process all newly started claims, which used to be started at one's local County Court.

 

1. When was the CCJ issued by the court and does it have a court seal on the copy sent to you.

 

2. Has your home address changed since the dispute first started.

 

3. Is your home address shown on the CCJ.

 

4. Who sent you these papers. Did they come from the CCMCC office, or from the solicitors.

 

5. Have you had any contact recently either with the court offices or with the sol'rs.

 

:-)

 

 

Hiya Slick

 

 

1. When was the CCJ issued by the court and does it have a court seal on the copy sent to you.

I dont know when it was issued but it has a date of service as Dec6th

There is a Northampton Seal on the paperwork

There is a lable with a bar code on the paperwork

 

2. Has your home address changed since the dispute first started.

Yes many times as i live and work all over the world.

 

3. Is your home address shown on the CCJ.

No the address it was sent to is my mates address

 

4. Who sent you these papers. Did they come from the CCMCC office, or from the solicitors.

The papers came from Salford CCMC

 

5. Have you had any contact recently either with the court offices or with the sol'rs.

None whatsoever

 

Cheers

Soul

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I am advised the court papers are legitimate and you should start acting on them.

 

You say the date of "service" is the 6th December - which makes the Date of Issue, the 1st - is that correct ? But we will work from December 6th for your timeline.

 

Date of service = 6th December + 14 days to acknowledge = 20 December + 14 days to submit defence = 3rd January 2014.

 

Could you please let us know what it says on the claim form.. the reason they have brought this claim against you.

Edited by slick132
changed 2015 to 2014

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

 

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

 

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

 

 

BCOBS

 

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

 

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

 

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Its says

 

Monies due under a Consumer Hire Agreement dated 04/12/2003. The Claimant seeks a Money Judgement for £6915.41 plus costs and interest against the defendant.

 

The Claimant has complied, as far as is necessary, with the pre-action conduct practice direction

 

1. On 8th August 2011 the Claimant chnaged its registered name from Duncton No 1 Ltd to Moneybarn No 1 Limited

 

2. The Claimant let a vehicle to the defendant under a hire purchase agreement

 

3. The defendant failed to pay installments due and repudiated the agreement. The claimant accepted the repudiation and terminated the agreement on 25th August 2005. The claimant subsequently repossesed and sold the vehicle

 

4. The claim is for the balance due under the agreement, alternaticly damages.

 

5. Agreement date 4th October 2003

Total amount payable £17.055.30

Total paid £ 10.139.89

Total claim £6.915.41

 

6. The claimant claims statutory interest at 8% annum from 4th December 2006 to date in sum of £3.865.05 and further £1.52 per day until payment

 

The claimant has complied as far as is necessary with the pre-action conduct practice direction.

 

 

 

Cheers

Soul

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When was your last payment/written ack?

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

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When was your last payment/written ack?

 

God knows. Sometime in 2005 I guess. Certainly not after the repossesion. Never have I ack the debt. They breached contract by not providing a valid tax disc for the vehicle and this is because they could not find the MOT at the time.

 

Cheers..

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If you are 100% sure that it has been more than 6 clear years with no payment or written ack, Then your defence would be that the debt is statute barred. It is a complete defence.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

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Hi Soul,

 

As others have said already, this is a genuine court claim against you and you must adhere to the relevant dates, to acknowledge the claim stating your intention to defend in full, and to file a defence.

 

Your defence as also said is that the matter is Statute Barred under the Limitation Act 1980.

 

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1 The Claimant's claim was issued on (date).

 

2 The Defendant contends that the Claimant's claim so issued is a claim in contract and is statute barred pursuant to the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980. If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of 6 yearslink3.gif have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

 

3 The Claimant's claim to be entitled to payment of £x or any other sum, or relief of any kind is denied.

 

I BELIEVE THAT THE CONTENTS OF THIS DEFENCE ARE TRUE.

 

Signed:

 

Dated:

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1 The Claimant's claim was issued on (date).

 

2 The Defendant contends that the Claimant's claim so issued is a claim in contract and is statute barred pursuant to the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980. If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of 6 yearslink3.gif have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

 

3 The Claimant's claim to be entitled to payment of £x or any other sum, or relief of any kind is denied.

 

I BELIEVE THAT THE CONTENTS OF THIS DEFENCE ARE TRUE.

 

Signed:

 

Dated:

 

 

Hi Guys

 

Thanks for your help. Questions.

 

1. Do I write the above on asheet of paper and sign it and send to the court or do I fill out the whole court papers and write that in the box provided?

 

2. Do I bother to explain that they were in breach with me or not bother?

 

Cheers

Soul

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You write it in the box where your defence goes. Im not sure, but if it doesnt fit in the box, you may be able to attach a sheet of paper.

 

2. Nope. A statute barred defence is a complete and total defence. No need to ramble on about silly stuff.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

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You write it in the box where your defence goes. Im not sure, but if it doesnt fit in the box, you may be able to attach a sheet of paper.

 

2. Nope. A statute barred defence is a complete and total defence. No need to ramble on about silly stuff.

 

Ok cool thanks but I dont udnerstand how this is written?

 

 

1 The Claimant's claim was issued on (date).

 

2 The Defendant contends that the Claimant's claim so issued is a claim in contract and is statute barred pursuant to the provisions of section 5 of the Limitation Act 1980. If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of yearslink3.gif have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

 

3 The Claimant's claim to be entitled to payment of £x or any other sum, or relief of any kind is denied.

 

I BELIEVE THAT THE CONTENTS OF THIS DEFENCE ARE TRUE.

 

Signed:

 

Dated:

 

That sentance does nto make sense to me. Do I insert years into there as in 6 or something?

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Assuming you have paid nothing to the lender since 2005, I'd say :-

 

If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract, in excess of 8 years have elapsed since the date on which any cause of action for breach accrued for the benefit of the Claimant.

 

Use the rest of the defence as listed by Havinastella.

 

No need to rush this - just get the Acknowledgement of Service into the court first. I think the AoS has to be filled in and sent back to CCMCC, Salford. You can't do it online, as would be the case with a claim filed through the MCOL service.

 

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Assuming you have paid nothing to the lender since 2005, I'd say :-

 

 

 

Use the rest of the defence as listed by Havinastella.

 

No need to rush this - just get the Acknowledgement of Service into the court first. I think the AoS has to be filled in and sent back to CCMCC, Salford. You can't do it online, as would be the case with a claim filed through the MCOL service.

 

:-)

 

I have filled it all out and will send it by post. Still dont understand that language though

 

If which is denied. Why or what would the claimant deny?

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Dont worry yourself about the terminology. Just follow the advice given and youll be ok.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Hi Soul,

 

If, which is denied, the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract ........

 

The commas make the sentence sensible. Put another way, it says :-

 

If the claimant contends that the Defendant is in breach of the alleged contract (although the defendant denies this) .........

 

We always encourage users to try and understand what they are doing or saying but, for now, send what we've said.

 

:-)

Edited by slick132

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Hi Soul,

 

 

 

The commas make the sentence sensible. Put another way, it says :-

 

 

 

We always encourage users to try and understand what they are doing or saying but, for now, send what we've said.

 

:-)

 

Hi Guys

 

Thanks for all your help. I have written it as you said and posted it today. Sent it recorded and took pictures of all the docs too.

 

Cheers

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  • 2 weeks later...

So I have an update. Today I recieved a letter from Shoosmiths stating

 

For commercial reasons we have been instructed to discontinue our clients claim against you.

We therefore enclose by way of service on you a notice of discontinuance which we have today lodged with county court claims centre CCMCC

 

:)

Nice

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Hi and well done.

 

As soon as they saw you knew what you were doing, off they scuttled.

 

That should be the last you see of this

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