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Tribunal 'partial victory' placed in WRAG.


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Hi,

 

Had my tribunal today and was placed in WRAG, so a partial victory....

 

I'm trying to find out exactly what it entails. how often do I have to attend the fake interviews, and basically what do hoops do I have to jump through in order I don't get sanctioned for some trivial misdemeanor?

 

I would prefer facts, and not hearsay, as I am at the point of exploding at the minute :mad2:

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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You will find out on the first Work Focused Interview at JCP. Whats your prognosis? It has a bearing on what action will be taken with regard to the Work Programme.

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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I have severe traumatic brain damage, as a result of a near fatal car accident in 2005.

The prognosis is that I will never work full time again, certainly not paid work, the very best would be part time menial work, but most likely voluntary work, which funnily enough I do now!

 

If I could work, then I would have been able to continue my career in the Army, but even they couldn't fit me into any of their pigeon holes.

 

I'm still trying to get to grips with what this actually means for me, as I have yet to see any expert from the DWP ATOS or Government with any knowledge surrounding Neurological injuries and cognitive disability to date.

 

Many thanks for responding... :thumb:

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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You usually have (unless it's changed) 6 interviews. All you have to do is turn up and don't have to do anything. (ie, if they suggest a course, it's just that - a suggestion and you have no obligation to do the course)

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Once about every 10 weeks was what I had.

No pressure was applied - they were very helpful all in all.

The problems start once you leave the JC and move over onto the work programme.

 

Had I have known then what I know now, about the work programme I would have appealed my WRAG placement.

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The prognosis is that I will never work full time again

Sorry, but that's not what I meant. Prognosis in this case means the amount of time before your next assessment either 3,6,9,18,or 24 months. If it's 18-24 months then the Work Programme is voluntary, less than that means an automatic referral to mandatory WP.

It sounds like you should have been allocated to support group, are you considering appealing?

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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Sorry, my apologies, and thank you all for your time and responses.

 

My prognosis, is a mere 12 (twelve) months......whilst I look and sound perfectly normal, whatever 'normal' means, I am not articulate enough to put into words how my brain injury affects me....

 

I am unsure as to whether I should appeal, accept their decision, or just drop out of society all together, and by that I mean, claim nothing, therefore pay nothing, just live off my Army disability pension, pay my rent, and electric and ignore everything else?

 

I actually cannot believe I served Queen & Country for 18 years,

Edited by Bazooka Boo

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Yes Thank you Rae, I had the RBL there with me, but I am not kidding when we were literally taken in sat down, told I had won, then sent out, the poor sod had come all the way down from London, his day started at 0530!

Besides, it took me another five hours to actually realise what it meant, to be honest, I still don't really know what it all means now, but I am tired with it all now, I have a veterans outreach centre I can go to next week to get someone to explain it to me, in language I understand...

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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You can appeal; but it would be to the upper tier and you'd probably need someone experienced with doing that. If your condition has worsened your original assessment, you can tell DWP that you wish to have your case looked at on the basis of a change in circumstances.

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You can appeal; but it would be to the upper tier and you'd probably need someone experienced with doing that. If your condition has worsened your original assessment, you can tell DWP that you wish to have your case looked at on the basis of a change in circumstances.

 

I am in the process of doing that - believe it could take some time (or so I was told).

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:Bazooka Boo:

Yes, the hoops depend on the recommended interval before reassessment. Is the twelve months from Tatos, or from a specific date on your tribunal decision notice? The hoops also depend on whether your award's based on national insurance contributions or income related. There's no longer a limit to the number of work focused interviews, but recipients of a contributions flavoured award, or credits only, can't be mandated to the work programme.

 

Margaret.

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Once about every 10 weeks was what I had.

No pressure was applied - they were very helpful all in all.

The problems start once you leave the JC and move over onto the work programme.

 

Had I have known then what I know now, about the work programme I would have appealed my WRAG placement.

 

What happened to you on the work programmed whilst on WRAG?

 

There isnt too many reports from people who have been on it whilst on ESA.

 

I had one WFI, and then got moved to the SG, after my single WFI I was told tho I was been moved to phone interviews so I think wasnt going to be put on the WP.

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What is WFI please?

 

And there is absolutely no chance of me doing any phone interviews!

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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Excellent cheers!

I have no idea when I will be summonsed for their Work Focused interrogation, but I'm looking forward to dealings with them,

hope they're a fan of you tube!

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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What happened to you on the work programmed whilst on WRAG?

 

There isnt too many reports from people who have been on it whilst on ESA.

 

I had one WFI, and then got moved to the SG, after my single WFI I was told tho I was been moved to phone interviews so I think wasnt going to be put on the WP.

 

 

With my JC adviser nothing really happened.

Each time I saw her she asked me what if anything had happened in respect of my health,change of medication etc, which she entered into the computer.

Had I had any thoughts of doing volunteer work, was I able to do my craft work, all put into the comp, but she never ever forced me to do anything.

She printed off things for me to look at - asked me at the next meeting how I had got on with it.

But she always made it clear she was not there to force me against my will.

I think I was very lucky all in all with my adviser.

 

But I also did my bit, I was never late, never missed an appointment, always polite and respectful, because there was nothing to be disrespectful over.

 

When she finally signed me off from her and handed me over to the work programme people, I truly felt she was not happy in doing so.

She made a point about them not forcing me to anything that was detrimental to my well being (pity they do not see it like that).

She also said if at the end of the two years with them - you are still not working, then you will come back to us.

All in all just friendly professional meetings with a caring attitude (again something the WP seem to not understand).

 

She even told me she new my CPN nurse, and asked me to say 'hello' to her, for her.

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I'm very confused.

So I have been put in the WRAG group, then am automatically pushed into another group after a set period of time, in order to do work??

 

This is what I am ultimately looking to be answered, as I have absolutely no idea what it all really means.

Who ever heard of someone getting a job at the Jobcentre? The unemployed are sent there as penance for their sins, not to help them find work!

 

 

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I'm very confused.

So I have been put in the WRAG group, then am automatically pushed into another group after a set period of time, in order to do work??

 

This is what I am ultimately looking to be answered, as I have absolutely no idea what it all really means.

 

No. As long as you remain in the ESA WRAG you can't be forced to work or apply for jobs. If memory serves, a 12 month prognosis means you can't be forced to participate in the Work Programme, but I won't swear to that.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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No. As long as you remain in the ESA WRAG you can't be forced to work or apply for jobs. If memory serves, a 12 month prognosis means you can't be forced to participate in the Work Programme, but I won't swear to that.

 

The rules changed December 2012, the only ESA claimants that can opt out from the Work Programme are:

 

ESA (IR) WRAG with either 18-24 month prognosis, ESA © WRAG (these two groups are voluntary at the point of referral to the WP, but become mandatory if the claimant volunteers)

 

 

The next section of groups are wholly voluntary.

 

ESA (IR) or © support group

ESA WRAG (lone parent with a youngest child under five or carers)

ESA credits only

Pension Credit claimants (without a health condition)

IB/SDA claimants (ESF funded England only)

IS claimants (ESF funded England only)

 

A 12 month prognosis will result in a mandatory referral to the Work Programme unfortunately.

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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The rules changed December 2012, the only ESA claimants that can opt out from the Work Programme are:

 

ESA (IR) WRAG with either 18-24 month prognosis, ESA © WRAG (these two groups are voluntary at the point of referral to the WP, but become mandatory if the claimant volunteers)

 

 

The next section of groups are wholly voluntary.

 

ESA (IR) or © support group

ESA WRAG (lone parent with a youngest child under five or carers)

ESA credits only

Pension Credit claimants (without a health condition)

IB/SDA claimants (ESF funded England only)

IS claimants (ESF funded England only)

 

A 12 month prognosis will result in a mandatory referral to the Work Programme unfortunately.

 

Thanks for the correction. Nothing ever gets better, does it?

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING. EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 

The idea that all politicians lie is music to the ears of the most egregious liars.

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Thanks for the correction. Nothing ever gets better, does it?

No it does not. I have posted today on another thread that I've received a 'good cause' letter from JCP because Seetec have raised a sanction doubt regarding me not attending a 'mandatory' initial WP appointment. Seetec know I have a 24 month prognosis and I have gone to great pains to outline this to them on several occasions along with a reminder that I did not volunteer for the WP.

JCP are frankly useless as well, both the ESA advisor and the advisor that deals with the WP for both JSA and ESA claimants have promised to sort this situation out twice now, without avail.

 

I'm now looking at Seetec sending regular appointment letters that I won't attend, only for them to raise a sanction doubt each time, I'm banging my head against a brick wall here.

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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No it does not. I have posted today on another thread that I've received a 'good cause' letter from JCP because Seetec have raised a sanction doubt regarding me not attending a 'mandatory' initial WP appointment. Seetec know I have a 24 month prognosis and I have gone to great pains to outline this to them on several occasions along with a reminder that I did not volunteer for the WP.

JCP are frankly useless as well, both the ESA advisor and the advisor that deals with the WP for both JSA and ESA claimants have promised to sort this situation out twice now, without avail.

 

I'm now looking at Seetec sending regular appointment letters that I won't attend, only for them to raise a sanction doubt each time, I'm banging my head against a brick wall here.

 

I am not with Seetec and only have a 12 month placement in WRAG so I know I have to attend but all of these WP believe they make the rules.

 

I had a badly worded letter from them which I rang the DWP to get some clarification on.

The WP had made it read as if they were responsible for me still being allowed to claim ESA under the WRAG stipulations.

They had even highlighted that part of the letter - scare tactics maybe.

 

Bottom line (as I already knew) no they are not - they can propose sanctions - but not as they were trying to make out.

I have been with my WP 6 weeks and have a list of complaints already.

It worrying, and it is banging head against a brick wall.

If we continue to make waves, they do have the authority to make life really painful for us.

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If we continue to make waves, they do have the authority to make life really painful for us.

And vice versa, I'm not about to fall over faced with Seetec's shenanigans. They are being vindictive in my case because I'm escalating a serious complaint against the manager via my MP and not using their own complaints procedure which I know will go nowhere. The manager got one of his subordinates to phone me and ask if I would attend their offices for a face-to-face apology which I declined.

I've also sent off a subject access request to the DWP for all clerical and digital records pertaining to my ESA case file, I believe Seetec were aware of my voluntary status from the initial introductory interview because they have access to JCP's records.

 

Corruptissima re publica plurimae leges

 

Being poor is like being a Pelican. No matter where you look, all you see is a large bill.

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