Poor Kitchen Installation Advice

[Fenris]

Hi all,

 

Not sure this is in the right place, so feel free to move it if needs be.

 

Long story short, my Mum bought a new kitchen from B&Q and I found a fitter via MyBuilder. He quoted us an amount to fit but didn't ask for any money up-front. Which is lucky, as it's a shambles. Cupboards are in at odd angles, drawers don't close, doors have been ruined where he's not fitted them properly... the list goes on. He's been back once to "fix" the problems, but he's just made it worse. We've had another two fitters come round to check out the work and it's not good; we have to have it all taken out and re-fitted. This includes the worktops which have been incorrectly cut/fitted.

 

As we've not paid the fitter for this utter disappointment of a job, where do we stand? I'm happy to go into more detail if readers require, but I just wanted to see if we're entitled to hold his money so we can get an actual professional in to put it all right?

 

And I know, I'm a flamin' idiot for getting this chap to even set foot over the threshold! I feel royally cheated.

 

Cheers in advance,

Fen.

[renegadeimp]

You may have to compensate him for materials used, but certainly not for his work as it is nowhere near up to standard.

[Fenris]

You may have to compensate him for materials used, but certainly not for his work as it is nowhere near up to standard.

 

Thanks for the reply

 

That's another bone of contention; he's stating he wants over £400 for materials, but he's only had to buy a couple of extra end-panels, a couple of sheets of plasterboard (we asked him to remove a brick cupboard and erect a stud-wall; once we know how much he's charged for that we will pay him for that work), a few metres of timber, some plaster and about 3 sheets of millboard. We've asked him half a dozen times now for an itemised bill but all he's sent is a word document with what each thing cost, but not how many/how much of each item he's supplied.

 

If we were to go to, say, B&Q and price up based on the new fitters measurements, would that be reasonable?

[renegadeimp]

I would go to a few builders merchants and get the AVERAGE price, just incase he's trying to pull a fast one and claims he went to the higher priced merchant/

[Fenris]

I would go to a few builders merchants and get the AVERAGE price, just incase he's trying to pull a fast one and claims he went to the higher priced merchant/

 

Good idea, we'll do that!

[raydetinu]

Hope you took lots of photos or video of his poor workmanship!

Why are paying for materials? you should be charging him for the inconvenience and the damage to your units and had to be replaced!.

Prepare your cost of what it has cost you in replacement parts and offset that against his list.

[Fenris]

Hope you took lots of photos or video of his poor workmanship!

Why are paying for materials? you should be charging him for the inconvenience and the damage to your units and had to be replaced!.

Prepare your cost of what it has cost you in replacement parts and offset that against his list.

 

Yes we have photo's. We're also going to take measurements where some of the wall units are higher than others and take photo's of us doing so... if that makes sense?

 

We haven't decided what to do regarding his payment; on the one hand I'm tempted to withhold all the money he wants; on the other hand he's already paid the sub-contractors he got in (plumber and electrician), so not sure where we stand on that.Whatever happens he's not getting anywhere near what he wants as we're going to have to pay the new fitters costs, plus replace some doors he's ruined, cornice, pelmet and, the most expensive bit, the worktops. I was going to price up and take the additional pictures today, but we had not one but two pieces of bad news, so I just wasn't up to it.

 

Oh yeah, I got an e-mail from him yesterday (Saturday) asking if it's convenient to come around this week. So now I have to tell him we don't want him back at all. Should be fun!

[Tawnyowl]

Hi

Having worked in construction for over 30 years i am nearly choking reading this story.

How has he got away with this workmanship.

It seems the only person you have not spoken about is the fitter himself.

Information on the My builder website.

I tell people no matter where you hire your workman from check his workmanship out beforehand.

Do not just look at photos,reviews check it out.

Ask to see the work,talk to people they have worked for.Knock on doors.

I knew one rascal who took pictures of other peoples fine work then announced it as his own.Knowing people would just drive by.

I suppose it is ok me saying this in hindsight.

I was a member of the FMB this is the Federation Of Master Builders for some time.

Let us see what My Builder say.About what to do in these circumstances.

Let us look into My Builder see how they operate,i know how the FMB operates.Let us compare.

http://www.mybuilder.com/advice/dealing-with-disputes

 

It seems the fair way to go is put in your email your concerns and see what the response is.

Check if he is a member of any professional body.

http://www.mybuilder.com/advice/tradebodies

If your tradesman is not a member of a trade organisation try contacting Trading Standards who provide help and advice to consumers through a national telephone service and local Trading Standards offices. Search for your local Trading Standards office

 

I hope Fenris i am not appearing to harsh but i am fuming that you have been treated this way.

He is responsible for the subcontractors and the job.

I would not pay at the moment.

The other fitters are they members of any organisations.Has the original fitter got insurance,i suppose people do not check this.

How do they compare on price.

This must seem a nightmare to you.Keep cool.

Just starting to look at the My Builder website.7am Sunday.

 

For anyone else who may venture this way.Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

http://www.mybuilder.com/advice/advice-on-hiring-a-builder

 

.

Edited October 27, 2013 by tawnyowl

[Fenris]

Hi again,

 

I need a bit more advice if possible. The kitchen fitter decided he wanted to take us to the SCC. We've done everything our end, stuck to all the rules etc. for filing a defence. Then, lo and behold, we've just got a letter from Lincoln CC saying,

 

"It is ordered that

 

1. The defendant's defence is struck out pursuant to the order dated 17th February 2014.

 

2. Judgement for the claimant for £xxxx.xx plus court fees and costs of £xxx.xx.

 

Dated 7th March 2014"

 

I don't understand what's going on!

 

The only thing I can think of is that we were sent an incorrectly worded General Form of Judgement Order dated 17th February 2014, which said we had to file a completed "Pre-Trial Check-List" before 26th February 2014 but we didn't have one. I found one online and, to double check, I phoned the Court to make sure that was the right form. Turns out it wasn't; what I actually had to file was an "Allocation Questionnaire". The lady said she'd send one out to us and the deadline was extended by a week to the 5th March 2014. The form arrived the next day. I filled it in and it was posted the day after, so it would have gotten there in plenty of time for the deadline!

 

We've had another kitchen installer in to repair all the shoddy work and damage done by this cowboy and there's no bloody way we're paying him a penny! Is there some way I can appeal this judgement as it seems someone's dropped the ball at the court and we're now paying for that!

 

Cheers!

Fen.

[maroondevo52]

Thread moved to General Legal Issues.

[raydetinu]

you can apply to get the judgement set aside; you need another form from the court and it will be up to the judge if he will let that happen and go for a second trial.

all you can do is try your best.

do this soonest before he applies for the judgement to be enforced.

[Fenris]

Thanks for the reply raydetinu. Having read the document in the link provided, I have some further questions:

 

Obviously matey boy isn't going to agree to this, so I don't have to write to him asking for his consent do I? I'd rather go straight to the court as I'd like as little contact with this cowboy as possible. I know it says I can do either, I just want to be 100% sure I'm not going to have this Set Aside rejected on some minor technicality!

 

The document linked goes on to say: "Either way, you will have needed to have prepared your proposed defence." Does this mean my entire defence? Including things like witness statements etc.? I've been to court a couple of times before, but in those cases (against the likes of Barclays Bank) I've been the claimant! I know there's a point where each side has to prepare a court bundle, so is that essentially what I need to send with the N244 form? Or is it just the initial defence I filed before? I don't know what form number that would have been but it says "Defence and Counterclaim (specified amount)" at the top and was what I got in the Response Pack from Northampton (CCBC) before it was transferred to Lincoln. If that makes sense?!

 

I think that's all I needed to ask.

 

Thanks again!

[raydetinu]

I am no expert, but suggest you speak to the court, local one will do and they can send you he right forms.

[steampowered]

You have already filed your Defence with the court, presumably. You don't need a bundle with the N244. You do need to attach a witness statement which fully explains the circumstances.

[Fenris]

OK, little update here: we've been back and forth with the Court and it seems the Cowboy has now given in; we got a letter from the Court saying if he didn't pay his fee before 17th May his claim would be struck out. He didn't pay, so that's what happened.

 

But I wonder if I could pick some brains a bit more? We put in a Counter Claim for the money we had to pay for all the replacements we had to buy to get the kitchen up to scratch. Now that Cowboy has pulled out, do we still pursue the Counter Claim, or is the whole thing now ended? Not sure where we go from here and Google isn't helping!

 

Ta!

[Ganymede]

OK, little update here: we've been back and forth with the Court and it seems the Cowboy has now given in; we got a letter from the Court saying if he didn't pay his fee before 17th May his claim would be struck out. He didn't pay, so that's what happened.

 

But I wonder if I could pick some brains a bit more? We put in a Counter Claim for the money we had to pay for all the replacements we had to buy to get the kitchen up to scratch. Now that Cowboy has pulled out, do we still pursue the Counter Claim, or is the whole thing now ended? Not sure where we go from here and Google isn't helping!

 

Ta!

 

Hi,

 

When did you submit your counter claim and what exactly does the Court Order say about striking out the claim please?