Angry Cat v Egg** Egg smashed at last**

[angry cat]

Hi Guys-

Advice please!

I have today sent both the Library preliminary letter plus DPA disclosure request to Egg

Pride Park

Riverside Road

Derby DE99 3GG

 

The reason that I have sent both is that I have had my credit card changed four times by Egg. The most recent account number statements can accessed on their website and as they recently fined me 3 lots of £20 =£60, I decided to send the preliminary letter asking for the £60 to be refunded. The EGG penalties have caused my account to go over limit - resulting in fines

As I have had an Egg card since 2001 but the account type and number has changed three times, I decided to send the DPA request and quoted the relevant account numbers and I know that there were penalties! but not sure how many?

 

Hopefully, I have done the right thing here-

Anyhow, will keep you posted.

angry cat

[Bookworm]

Yes, do.

 

Good stuff.

[angry cat]

No Response from Egg yet? and...

they have just fined me another £20 !

 

An over limit fine, caused by their charges-

 

I will be kind and give them a few more days to respond to the (Library) preliminary letter sent 12 April 2006 plus additional DPA disclosure request because of the Easter Holiday break. However, I have not even received an acknowlegement of my letter and or additional DPA disclosure request?

Under the FSA rules they are required to answer or acknowledge a COMPLAINT! within five working days...

Ummm Egg appear to be above the regulators.

 

angry cat

[jonni2bad]

There is no need to give them any extra time, even if there have been 'bank holidays' etc.

 

Do you think they would give you more time to pay them?

 

If they have not responded to your DPA request inside 40 days, you need to make an official complaint to the Information Commissioner's Office. See FAQs. However,it's only been about 12 days, and I'm afraid we have all made them a little bit busier than normal !!

 

Best of luck

[angry cat]

Hi Jonni2bad-

 

Yes, I agree that Egg would not allow me any extra time to pay and they are not!

 

My claim is slightly complicated, because I sent off the preliminary letter which related to the refund on fines and over limit fees that show on my statements that are accessable on the Egg website. However this has now increased by £20.

 

The DPA disclosure request is for credit card statements from 2001 - 2005 which are not available on the Egg website, plus they have changed my account number several times?

 

I am sure that Egg are busier than usual ! However, they appear to have found time to send me a letter dated 20 April 2006-

 

From-

"Wendy Schratz - Head of Borrowing Management

 

Your balance is currently over your credit limit" "Each month your balance exceeds your credit limit you will be charged a fee of £20"

 

Of course, the reason that I am over the credit limit is because Egg continue to fine me.

 

Thanks

angry cat

[jonni2bad]

...My claim is slightly complicated, because I sent off the preliminary letter which related to the refund on fines and over limit fees that show on my statements that are accessable on the Egg website. However this has now increased by £20....

 

You can alter the amount being claimed as you proceed, having a final figure if it reaches the stage of court action, no worries there.

 

...The DPA disclosure request is for credit card statements from 2001 - 2005 which are not available on the Egg website, plus they have changed my account number several times?...

 

You are able to get all the info relating to your banking business with them, even if it were over several accounts, single and joint etc etc for just the one £10 fee.

 

Don't, however, just ask for statements. You must use the template letter which also includes text relating to manual intervention.

 

Good luck

[angry cat]

Thanks for your response jonni2bad-

 

I actually sent the (Library) Preliminary letter-

plus the (Library) template DPA disclosure request for the statements that are not shown on my Egg account (Egg website)

 

Do you think that I should wait, until I receive the missing statements, before I send the Before Action Letter and or, subsequently make my County Court Claim? and...

please correct me if I am wrong, but I am of the understanding that one does not have to pay the £10 for the DPA disclosure in regard of an internet account, because it is the responsibility of EGG to make ALL the statements available to an internet consumer?

 

Thanks

angry cat

[jonni2bad]

Meoow angry cat (if that's hello?)

 

The reason why we suggest sending a DPA request is so that the bank has an opportunity to respond to the question of manual intervention, as well as a list of charges. Statements, as such, only come into the equation because we allow them to send these as an alternative to a list - we don't actually ask for them.

 

So, in relation to an internet based account, you still need the info that they might hold which is NOT shown on your online accounts, and for this reason you must pay (or at least offer) the £10 fee.

 

These points remain true even if you already have the full history of your account and can calculate charges yourself.

 

If your Initial Letter date for response has expired, then proceed to LBA.

 

If you are still awaiting the DPA response and get close to the stage of court action, then we have a choice of waiting further, or getting more info from our site team. But we'll cross that bridge when we get there.

[angry cat]

Hi Guys !

 

I have been considering the OFT response 5 April 2006-

 

CREDIT CARD DEFAULT CHARGES UNFAIR

 

at the end under Notes 4 there is a reference to EGG-

 

"But for example, where a card issuer has a policy of requiring customers to pay minimum monthly repayments by Direct Debits, such as that operated by Egg, and offers credit cards only to customers that satisfy a relatively higher scoring requirement it may be able to set a fair default fee at a level above the threshhold"

 

I would be grateful to know the Bank Action Groups thought's on this?

 

Incidentally when I first opened my Egg credit card account, it was actually a -

"Boots" Advantage card powered by Egg.

 

Of course, I am in the process of making a claim, but wondered if the above statement, could affect EGG penalty claims.

 

Any thoughts?

 

Thanks

 

angry cat

[angry cat]

Hi Guys-

Sorry to start a new thread but...

I wanted all Egg complainants to see my initial Egg response to the Library preliminary letter plus additional DPA disclosure request !

 

"WE'VE RECEIVED YOUR COMPLAINT

 

Dear xxxxxx

 

Re: Your Egg Account

 

I'm sorry that you have had to complain to us. We will start to work on your case right away and one of our Customer Relations Advisers will be back in touch to advise you of our progress. If you need to contact us in the meantime, don't hesitate to use the contact details at the side of this letter.

 

We will do everything we can to resolve this with you as quickly as possible. Here are the timescales that our regulator, The Financila Services Authority, requires us to work to. In the vast majority of cases we resolve problems a lot quicker than this.

 

1. We must acknowledge receipt of your complaint within five days.

 

2. If we are unable to resolve your complaint within four weeks of receipt, we must contact you and explain why. We must also give you an indication of when we will next be in touch.

 

3. If we are unable to resolve your complaint to your satisfaction within eight weeks of receipt, we must contact you again and explain why. You can then (or sooner if you do not accept our earlier resolution) excercise your right to take your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service. You have six months from the date of our resolution to do this.

 

Thank you for letting us know about the problems you have experienced and for the opportunity to put things right.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Jeanette Hadfield

Customer Relations Office - Egg plc"

 

You will see that the letter make note towards contact details at the side of the letter-

 

Telephone - 08007 834 393

Email - [email protected]

 

Write to us at:

 

Customer Relations Office

Egg

Riverside Road

Pride Park

Derby

DE99 3GG

 

Please note, that Egg failed to respond to my letter with in 5 days and it is very clear that they either, do not understand the letter or simply ignore the implications!

 

Once again I apologise for the new thread, but I didn't want anyone making an Egg claim to miss this letter and...

I realise that the moderators may move this post to my thread - Egg Credit card have sent preliminary letter & DPA request.

 

Thanks

 

angry cat

[angry cat]

Hi Jonni2bad-

 

Thanks for your advice -

 

The postman has just delivered the Egg reply-

 

I have just posted it on a new thread - Response received from Egg.

I realise that I should have posted the letter on this thread, but I was worried that it could have been missed by others who are making a claim against egg.

 

Thanks

 

angry cat

[jonni2bad]

They would still have to show, in court, that they are only recovering their losses, even if these WERE actually above the £12 mentioned by the OFT.

 

If they are prepared to do this in court, they must also be prepared to do so BEFORE you get there.. otherwise the court would not be happy!

 

I hope that helps, but if you need further clarification and no-one else has responded, feel free to PM the Administrators after a day or so.

 

John

[angry cat]

Hi Guys-

Just an update-

 

I have received this morning a letter from Egg relating to my "DPA disclosure request" and...I did send them the (Library) DPA disclosure request template letter.

 

However, I have received a letter from Egg this morning Friday 5 May 2006-

 

"Re Your Data Subject Information Request (DSIR)"

 

After looking at some of the other EGG posts in the forum, I expected EGG to request ID, which I think is crazy bearing in mind that I have a credit card with them, therfore they already have all my details on file, having said that, I realise that proof of ID is probaly required under the DPA rules. However, I had anticipated a request for a scan of my passport or Driving license, which would have made sense but it would appear that the ID that EGG require is only related to my financial details, I quote-

"please provide us with one of the identifiication documents listed below-

A bank, building society or credit card statement

A store card or catalogue statement

A utility bill"

 

Please note, that the above all relates to my financial status/ID, it seems very odd that neither passport nor driving license are mentioned? which of course would be irrefutable confirmation of my identification.

 

The letter was signed - Jenny Gordon, Data Protection Manager

 

Curious !!! - Any thoughts?

 

angry cat

[Movingon]

This is the paragraph regarding identity which I used in my DPA request:

 

If there is specific information which you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity, please let me know by return. However please note that the above address is the one which you normally use to communicate my private business to me and which you have hitherto found to be acceptable, and my signature, hitherto accepted by you as an identifying mark, appears below.

 

Note the red portion; they simply don't need any further information. Write to them telling them this, reminding them that all the information they need about your request is in your initial letter, and reminding them also that the 40 day clock is ticking and will expire on . On that very evening, initiate a complaint to the Information Comissioner and write to them telling them you've done that as your deadline has expired.

 

The signature you use is stored and analysed in their "systems" and is used to authorise spending from your account - the b*ggers can accept it on a letter as proof of identity.

[angry cat]

Hi StoneLaughter !

 

I greatly appreciate your reply - Thanks

 

I believe that Egg are just being difficult and their request didn't make sense-

 

You are so right, they had my signature on the DPA disclosure request and they have replied to my unchanged address that has not changed since I opened the account.

 

I try to apply 'Common Sense' to things and the egg request didn't make any!

 

I will write the letter today, following your guidelines.

 

Thanks

angry cat

[angry cat]

Hi Guys !

 

I have received a reply from EGG!

 

PLEASE NOTE THE FOLLOWING, TAKEN FROM THE OFT STATEMENT REGARDING PENALTY CHARGES, WHICH I HAVE PRECIOUSLY POSTED AND THEN READ THE LETTER FROM EGG RECEIVED THIS MORNING 9 MAY 2006

 

I have been considering the OFT response 5 April 2006-

 

CREDIT CARD DEFAULT CHARGES UNFAIR

 

at the end under Notes 4 there is a reference to EGG-

 

"But for example, where a card issuer has a policy of requiring customers to pay minimum monthly repayments by Direct Debits, such as that operated by Egg, and offers credit cards only to customers that satisfy a relatively higher scoring requirement it may be able to set a fair default fee at a level above the threshhold"

 

Letter from EGG

 

"COMPLAINT

 

Re Account

 

Thank you for your recent letter regarding the problems you have experienced. I have taken personal responsibility for resolving this for you.

 

Firstly, please accept my apologies for any inconvenience this matter has caused.

 

I have investigated the situation and set out the summary of my findings for you below.

 

WHAT I UNDERSTAND YOUR COMPLAINT TO BE ABOUT

 

You consider the charges made to your account in respect to over limit fees and unpaid direct debit fees to be unlawful and as such you would like these to be refunded in full.

 

WHAT MY FINDINGS ARE AFTER INVESTIGATING IT

 

The charges made to your account are correct and in line with the Terms and conditions to which you agreed when you applied for your Egg Card account.

With regard to the Data Protection Act disclosure request you made in your letter, I can confirm that this has been passed to the relevant department.

 

Egg has noted the announcement by the Office of Fair Trading regarding credit card default charges. We are pleased that the OFT has recognised that Egg has prectices in place to make it as easy as possible for customers to pay their monthly credit card bill, which includes requiring them to set up a direct debit prior to receiving the card.

 

We have worked closely with the OFT throughout its enquiry and now intend to study closely the key principles set out in the statement.

 

In view of the above, I am sorry to inform you that I do not accept your complaint. Even though we do not accept your complaint, I still need to ensure that you are aware of your rights in relation to a complaint against us.

 

You now have six months from the date of this letter to take your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

I am sorry that we were unable to agree to your request on this occasion.

 

Yours sincerely

 

Cliff Housley

Customer Relations Advisor - Egg"

 

GRRRRrrrr!!

 

This is exactly the kind of response that I had expected to my (Library) template preliminary letter, in which I had enclosed a separate DPA disclosure request.

I felt sure that Egg would use the OFT statement wording to their advantage.

 

Therefore, although I know what the recent Charges are, I will now have to wait for the Results of the DPA disclosure request to ascertain what other fines were levied on my Egg account before I can make my Court claim. Presumably I will not receive these until after May 31 2006, which is when the banks are due to respond to the OFT statement.

 

I really am an Angry Cat today because the failed direct debits Egg refer to were only 12 hours late, because Egg collect their money at 12 midnight preceeding the day payment is required and then the system will not attempt to collect the monies for another 10 days - Result - Fines and... then more Fines!

 

One thing is for sure, I wil NOT be taking this complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service, who are shambolic, incompetant and take forever just to look at a complaint.

 

Anyhow, I would be very interested to find out, what your thoughts are on the Egg reponse?

 

Thanks

Angry Cat

[Movingon]

Standard response as usual but they've cut out the middle man (i.e. the preliminary letter you would normally send having counted up your money). Personally I would still send the prelim letter once you have received your DPA data, and counted your lolly. They will probably not respond this time as they have given you their final response and referred you to the FOS. 14 days later send your LBA letter and 14 days after that put in your claim the court.

[angry cat]

Hi again StoneLaughter !

 

Fair comment-

However, I feel that it is important to remember that the OFT statement about default credit card charges does actually specifically refer to Egg... and rather than seeing myself ending up as a scrambled Egg. I would be extremely pleased to see 'Humpty Dumpty' 'Have a Great Fall' Therefore, It is important to take note of the words that the OFT have used in relation to EGG, in order that we can ALL be able to defend our claims.

 

I will re-send a preliminary letter, as soon as I receive all of my DPA requested statements.

 

Thanks again StoneLaughter for your advice and I apologise if I sound Angry.....!

but I am sooooo stressed out with these banks:(

 

Thanks

angry cat

[pixxy]

Hi there. You might be waiting a while for the request as Egg took 49 days to send me my request from the date they got my cheque. I sent them a copy of a bank statement as identification. Would suggest you do the same.

 

I sent them a cheque for £10. When they added this to my account, they charged me £2 (!!!!!!!!!!) for paying by cheque. They then took £10 form my account the DPA request. Therefore my DPA request cost me £12. Keep an eye on your statements and make sure they've not take £2.

 

They send you a form to fill in about your DPA. You can fill this in if you want (some people on the forum advise that you don't). I did, and enclosed the following letter:

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

In addition to the data requested in the enclosed form, please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to my credit card since opening the account. Alternatively a complete set of bank statements for that period will be acceptable. Omitting the previous twelve months of transactions and charges is not acceptable and must be included.

 

Additionally where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my banking business with you.

 

If you are unable to supply data relating to manual intervention because there has been no such manual intervention then please be kind as to confirm this in your response to this request.

 

I also wish to be advised of the logic involved in any automated decisions taken by you about me pursuant to section 7(1)(d) of the Data Protection Act 1998. Of particular interest is the logic involved in deciding the APR of both my Egg Card and Egg Money Card. I wish to know how you use the data from the credit reference agencies (and other related data) to determine my APR.

 

Furthermore, in the past I have been late in paying the minimum amount due in a particular month and subsequently charged a penalty. This is an automated decision and I wish to be informed of the logic involved in this charge.

 

You have 40 days in which to comply.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

This was customised to my particular needs. Would suggest, if you do fill the form in, that the data mentioned in the form is in addition to the data requsted.

[angry cat]

Hi Pixxy-

 

Thanks for your message-

You were right I did have to provide ID, which is ridiculous! as Egg had my signature on the DPA request and that Egg had written to my unchanged address Anyhow, I just sent them a Building Society statement that I do not use very much, which they have returned to me

Incidentally, I did not have to fill out a form and I paid them with a postal order, because I thought that might be faster than waiting for clearance on a cheque

 

So, now I play the waiting game- it would appear that the forty days started when they had confirmation of my ID:(

 

 

angry cat

[angry cat]

Hi Guys !

 

Oh My God ! The post has just been delivered at 6pm !!! and....

There was a big brown Recorded Delivery padded envelope marked 'Private & Confidential for me.

 

I can't believe it!

because it is from Humpty Dumpty...!!!

 

I am just getting over the shockkk, because as you probably know from my thread-

that I initially made my DPA Disclosure request on 12 April 2006, but then 'Humpty Dumpty' started to get difficult and wanted confirmation of my ID, even though I had written to Humpty Dumpty and signed the letter and Humpty Dumty had responded to me! Therfore they had sufficient ID from me.

 

However, I sent off the requested ID document = a building society statement to validate my identity-

 

I am amazed that my Humpty Dumpty statements have been sent so quickly, because I thought that the 40 days would run from the date that I sent my building society statement to confirm my identity.

 

I have not even looked at them yet, as I am in shock from receiving them so quickly - Okay, so now I will go through the laborious job of going through all the missing statements-

 

Anyhow, I just wanted to let you guys know!!

 

Such Excitement!

 

angry cat

[angry cat]

Hi Guys!

 

Can anyone help please !

 

I have received my DPA disclsure request from Humpty Dumpty-

although there are two statements missing and half the statements have been so badly printed, that I will have to request another set. On the face of it Humpty Dumpty appears to owe me £280 in fines, instead of £60.

 

However, I am somewhat confused because I know that I am supposed to be looking for 'data relating to manual intervention'. Where do I look for this?

I have been sent 34 pages of computer 'contact history'. As you probably know Egg are an internet Credit Card and they have secure messaging etc., so all the messages that I have sent and received are listed, there are references on the print out to my PPI claim.

 

I someone could explain what I should be looking for that would refer to whether there has been any manual intervention re the 12 £20 fines.

 

Thanks

angry cat

[natalie]

You are not looking for manual intervention. You ask that question just in case they use it in court, its for them to prove not you and they wont be able to.

 

I would write to them again stating that the information is incomplete and unreadable and therefore not in compliance with the dpa, tell them how many days they have left to comply or you will report them to the Information Commissioner.

 

I hope this helps.

[angry cat]

Hi Natalie !

 

Oh thank you so much for your response, because this morning I have been going through all the Egg internet documents for hours trying to link up the fines with their confusing computer notes looking for manual intervention???

 

Anyhow, I am very glad that I don't have to continue the search LOL !!

 

I will write to Egg on Tuesday and request the missing statements, plus a new set or readable statements. You know when you print something off the interenet and there is no printer friendly option, the statements came like that all over to one side and with all the dates missing-

Crazy ! How could they send them out like that, or maybe its a delaying tactic Hmmm.

 

Kind regards to you & thanks:)

 

angry cat

[natalie]

Dont allow them to use it as a delaying tactic, they still have to stick to the 40 days.

 

Natalie