Any one else have problems with the new DLA form ?

[RaeUK]

Just a query, 45002, is it fair to assume that if you did claim when the DWP asks you to then there will be no gap in payments? (Going on your last quote in bold).

Apols if that sounds pedantic but many of us are facing this ...

[mr_mastiff]

Hi, 45002, I understand that I must make a claim for PIP, and there is no automatic transfer over. Where the confusion is as I understand it is as follows.

 

I am told to apply for PIP in Dec 2015. I apply and in Feb 2016 I am awarded PIP at the relevant rate. I would still be payed dla until Feb 2016 and then the PIP rate.

 

It would only stop being payed DLA if I did not apply?

 

Is this correct?

[45002]

Just a query, 45002, is it fair to assume that if you did claim when the DWP asks you to then there will be no gap in payments? (Going on your last quote in bold).

Apols if that sounds pedantic but many of us are facing this ...

 

I have posted this a while back on CAG.

 

Yes,Including me as I been in receipt of the old mobility allowance,then changed to DLA, due to serve very painfully mobility problems over many years....

 

And I was on one of the disabled groups that the government where consulted on the changes from PIP to DLA.

 

Everyone should welcome the changes as DLA had become far too easy to claim...

Edited October 22, 2013 by 45002

[mr_mastiff]

Just a query, 45002, is it fair to assume that if you did claim when the DWP asks you to then there will be no gap in payments? (Going on your last quote in bold).

Apols if that sounds pedantic but many of us are facing this ...

 

 

Everything I have read both on CAB and Gov/uk sites states that if you make a claim for PIP then your DLA will not stop if you do it when they ask.

 

I quote

 

"myth“I have been told that there

will be a break in my benefit

payments if I move from

DLA to Personal

Independence Payment.”

FAQ: Will there be a break

in my benefit payments if I

move from DLA to Personal

Independence Payment?

 

"Fact"

 

If you are awarded Personal

Independence Payment we will

ensure there are no gaps between

benefit payments so long as you send

us the information we need when we

ask for it.

 

I cannot find anywhere that states it will stop when changing over.

 

from the CAB website

 

If you're already getting DLA, PIP is being introduced gradually over several years and will eventually replace DLA. The Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) will write to you at some point between 28 October 2013 and September 2017 asking you to make a new claim for PIP instead of DLA. You don't have to do anything until they contact you.

 

You won't get PIP automatically just because you qualify for DLA. You'll have to make a claim for it. If you don't claim when the DWP asks you to, your DLA payments will stop.

Edited October 21, 2013 by mr_mastiff
more informatin

[RaeUK]

Righty ho, mr_m, that clarifies it. It won't be until 2015 or later for me but I'll be ready for the buggers!

[bedofweeds]

 

Everyone should welcome the changes as DLA has become far too easy to claim...

 

 

Absolutely!!! There are far far too many DLA claims being awarded on the basis of conditions that were never envisaged to be covered when DLA came out. It is almost like a balloon, you keep putting more air into it then find that the thing just pops!

 

Since when was ADHD or ME or CFS ever thought of as an acceptable reason to award DLA back in 1992? It's time they cut it right back to what DLA was originally set up for.

 

Yes I receive DLA, but would be more than happy if I along with 10's of thousands of others lost it when PIP comes about if the money in the budget is paid only to those that are the most vulnerable and disabled amongst us.

[mr_mastiff]

Righty ho, mr_m, that clarifies it. It won't be until 2015 or later for me but I'll be ready for the buggers!

 

same here! Mind you they will change the questions and/or criteria 6 times by then. LOL

[bedofweeds]

same here! Mind you they will change the questions and/or criteria 6 times by then. LOL

 

Quite likely that they will. As it is a new benefit with new and untried criteria it will be appropriate to fine tune it as the pilot study goes along. They certainly don't want the same to happen with PIP as it has with DLA in that the legislation ends up like a sieve with all and sundry claiming that they have a 'disability' and being awarded it. It should be harsh, to weed out those that currently use DLA as another source of income without being tested and retested at regular intervals.

 

I hear all of the time that it doesn't cover the extra costs that a disability brings with it. I accept that that may well be the case for some, but for the majority I would suggest that the extra costs are no where near the £100+ a week that they receive never minding the extras in the form of premiums given with means tested benefits/Council Tax Support/HB & Tax Credits. No one has ever listed what those extra costs are when challenged - they get all uppity.

[mr_mastiff]

Quite likely that they will. As it is a new benefit with new and untried criteria it will be appropriate to fine tune it as the pilot study goes along. They certainly don't want the same to happen with PIP as it has with DLA in that the legislation ends up like a sieve with all and sundry claiming that they have a 'disability' and being awarded it. It should be harsh, to weed out those that currently use DLA as another source of income without being tested and retested at regular intervals.

 

I hear all of the time that it doesn't cover the extra costs that a disability brings with it. I accept that that may well be the case for some, but for the majority I would suggest that the extra costs are no where near the £100+ a week that they receive never minding the extras in the form of premiums given with means tested benefits/Council Tax Support/HB & Tax Credits. No one has ever listed what those extra costs are when challenged - they get all uppity.

 

Perhaps some of the requirements are very personal and unique to them. The government already uses family members as a free care system and the care given is very cheap at the price. The amount of hours my wife cares for me at times would never be met by the small amount we receive as part of the care component of the DLA.If my wife was to charge the government an hourly rate it may cover two days.

 

As for being tested on a regular basis it is just another money making adventure for the companies involved . If you have a chronic and progressive condition, for example osteoarthritis and your abilities have been tested and found to be within the P.I.P criteria then I would know that condition is not going to improve. The prognosis can only gradually become worse. I am sure that most people would recognise this fact. That the government is going to keep reassessing people who are incurable is a public scandal that only lines the pockets of the companies involved.

[estellyn]

Hi, 45002, I understand that I must make a claim for PIP, and there is no automatic transfer over. Where the confusion is as I understand it is as follows.

 

I am told to apply for PIP in Dec 2015. I apply and in Feb 2016 I am awarded PIP at the relevant rate. I would still be payed dla until Feb 2016 and then the PIP rate.

 

It would only stop being payed DLA if I did not apply?

 

Is this correct?

 

What will happen is that when your DLA award is coming to an end, or when it's been decided you're up for the DLA-PIP changeover (for those of us with indefinite/lifetime awards), you'll be written to 20 weeks beforehand, given the end date of the DLA and details of how to apply for PIP. As long as you apply in time for PIP, then DLA will run on until 4 weeks after you receive a decision on PIP (regardless of the outcome). Then PIP payments start if your claim was successful.

[Nystagmite]

Quite likely that they will. As it is a new benefit with new and untried criteria it will be appropriate to fine tune it as the pilot study goes along. They certainly don't want the same to happen with PIP as it has with DLA in that the legislation ends up like a sieve with all and sundry claiming that they have a 'disability' and being awarded it. It should be harsh, to weed out those that currently use DLA as another source of income without being tested and retested at regular intervals.

 

I hear all of the time that it doesn't cover the extra costs that a disability brings with it. I accept that that may well be the case for some, but for the majority I would suggest that the extra costs are no where near the £100+ a week that they receive never minding the extras in the form of premiums given with means tested benefits/Council Tax Support/HB & Tax Credits. No one has ever listed what those extra costs are when challenged - they get all uppity.

 

Not all of us receive full DLA. And why does it matter what our extra costs are? When I was challenged over this a few years ago, I was told to just buy the cheaper version (supermarkets own brand) of wet wipes. But I've got a scar right at the bottom of my back and the cheaper wipes make this worse.

[mr_mastiff]

What will happen is that when your DLA award is coming to an end, or when it's been decided you're up for the DLA-PIP changeover (for those of us with indefinite/lifetime awards), you'll be written to 20 weeks beforehand, given the end date of the DLA and details of how to apply for PIP. As long as you apply in time for PIP, then DLA will run on until 4 weeks after you receive a decision on PIP (regardless of the outcome). Then PIP payments start if your claim was successful.

 

 

Estellyn you are a star? I knew it would not stop but could not find the full details. Thankyou, May I ask a favour and ask what your source is? I belong to a self help group and if possible I would like to pass details on

[bedofweeds]

Perhaps some of the requirements are very personal and unique to them. The government already uses family members as a free care system and the care given is very cheap at the price. The amount of hours my wife cares for me at times would never be met by the small amount we receive as part of the care component of the DLA.If my wife was to charge the government an hourly rate it may cover two days.

 

As for being tested on a regular basis it is just another money making adventure for the companies involved . If you have a chronic and progressive condition, for example osteoarthritis and your abilities have been tested and found to be within the P.I.P criteria then I would know that condition is not going to improve. The prognosis can only gradually become worse. I am sure that most people would recognise this fact. That the government is going to keep reassessing people who are incurable is a public scandal that only lines the pockets of the companies involved.

 

Maybe that is the reason why no one wants to justify what they spend their DLA money on.

 

As for caring, My wife cares for me, has done since we were married 33 years ago. Since I became ill in 2004 she has continued to care for me. Yes she does receive the Carers premium and it isn't a lot of money, but why should the caring role of a wife or husband be valued in monetary terms?

 

As for having a chronic and progressive condition, I know only too well what that means. I am personally living on borrowed time - literally. But even so, any chronic condition can become stable at any time. I suffered 7 years of it being progressive, spending more time in hospital than at home. Yet over the past 2 years it has stabilised and touch wood, have not had to go into hospital and have managed to reduce the level of medication that I take. However, tomorrow maybe different, it may all start up again - who knows.

 

In my case I receive HRM & MRC because my condition is so unpredictable. However, if I had been re-assessed two years ago I would have lost all of the DLA because of the remission. If and when it starts up again, then I would re-apply. Is that not a better and fairer way to award this type of benefit?

[estellyn]

Estellyn you are a star? I knew it would not stop but could not find the full details. Thankyou, May I ask a favour and ask what your source is? I belong to a self help group and if possible I would like to pass details on

 

No problem, here it is:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/240491/pip-toolkit-factsheet-006-reassessment.pdf

[Nystagmite]

Thank you I've read some of the stuff Estellyn has said; but I can never remember where!

[mr_mastiff]

No problem, here it is:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/240491/pip-toolkit-factsheet-006-reassessment.pdf

 

As I said you are a star.

[mr_mastiff]

Maybe that is the reason why no one wants to justify what they spend their DLA money on.

 

As for caring, My wife cares for me, has done since we were married 33 years ago. Since I became ill in 2004 she has continued to care for me. Yes she does receive the Carers premium and it isn't a lot of money, but why should the caring role of a wife or husband be valued in monetary terms?

 

As for having a chronic and progressive condition, I know only too well what that means. I am personally living on borrowed time - literally. But even so, any chronic condition can become stable at any time. I suffered 7 years of it being progressive, spending more time in hospital than at home. Yet over the past 2 years it has stabilised and touch wood, have not had to go into hospital and have managed to reduce the level of medication that I take. However, tomorrow maybe different, it may all start up again - who knows.

 

In my case I receive HRM & MRC because my condition is so unpredictable. However, if I had been re-assessed two years ago I would have lost all of the DLA because of the remission. If and when it starts up again, then I would re-apply. Is that not a better and fairer way to award this type of benefit?

 

 

When I was assessed for DLA and ESA I produced a diary noting my chronic periods and my acute on chronic periods. My condition does not go into remission I have periods when it is less painful and I have a greater range of movement but it never goes away. I was totally honest because its the easiest to remember. I would welcome a reassessment every six months but what would be the point of wasting vast amounts of money when my local village idiot could they them I am not going to get better.

[bedofweeds]

When I was assessed for DLA and ESA I produced a diary noting my chronic periods and my acute on chronic periods. My condition does not go into remission I have periods when it is less painful and I have a greater range of movement but it never goes away. I was totally honest because its the easiest to remember. I would welcome a reassessment every six months but what would be the point of wasting vast amounts of money when my local village idiot could they them I am not going to get better.

 

But you might - you may well go into remission. I thought my future life would be like it was for those 7 years. Yet, with the excellent care, surgery and medication they have been able to hold it back for a while. I'm thankful for these past 2 years. I am never pain free, but after those 7 years I now feel that I could take on the world.

 

Diary? I never did that, my GP & OT simply told the DWP that what and how I have described my situation is entirely truthful even to the point of me under stating quite a fair chunk of it. As for why the DWP would think that giving me money from my HRM & MRC award would help my health problems I don't know. Like everyone else, I just claimed it because I could.

Edited October 22, 2013 by bedofweeds

[Nystagmite]

What is the point of reassessing people again and again? My parents were told when I was 4, (1993) that there's no cure. And there's still no cure.

 

If anything, (especially going by the last month) I will just get worse.

[bedofweeds]

What is the point of reassessing people again and again? My parents were told when I was 4, (1993) that there's no cure. And there's still no cure.

 

If anything, (especially going by the last month) I will just get worse.

 

I accept what you are saying, but should there be one rule for you and another different rule for someone else?

 

Besides which, the government has to appease the general population who are of the opinion that those that claim benefits are nothing short of being scroungers and parasites on those that go to work.

 

By the general public seeing that something is being done will help to reinforce public opinion that the government are cracking down hard on ALL benefit claimants.

 

Maybe when the Welfare Reforms are complete the benefit claimants of tomorrow will have a much easier ride away from public distaste.

[antone]

I accept what you are saying, but should there be one rule for you and another different rule for someone else?

 

Besides which, the government has to appease the general population who are of the opinion that those that claim benefits are nothing short of being scroungers and parasites on those that go to work.

 

By the general public seeing that something is being done will help to reinforce public opinion that the government are cracking down hard on ALL benefit claimants.

 

Maybe when the Welfare Reforms are complete the benefit claimants of tomorrow will have a much easier ride away from public distaste.

 

If I thought you believed any of this, I'd be very worried about you.

[Nystagmite]

Can someone please explain what good it is to constantly re-assess someone with incurable medical conditions? I am only like to either get worse or a very low chance of stabilising.

[worried33]

Absolutely!!! There are far far too many DLA claims being awarded on the basis of conditions that were never envisaged to be covered when DLA came out. It is almost like a balloon, you keep putting more air into it then find that the thing just pops!

 

Since when was ADHD or ME or CFS ever thought of as an acceptable reason to award DLA back in 1992? It's time they cut it right back to what DLA was originally set up for.

 

Yes I receive DLA, but would be more than happy if I along with 10's of thousands of others lost it when PIP comes about if the money in the budget is paid only to those that are the most vulnerable and disabled amongst us.

 

Wow DLA easy to claim?

 

thats news to me.

 

I have my 3rd tribunal for a 3rd failed attempt to claim it in november.

 

My view is DLA relies too much on diagnosis and if people have existing support etc.

 

eg. if someone has a condition that "typically" causes immobility they likely get HRM possibly even without an assessment. Whilst someone else who has a condition that normally doesnt cause mobility issues or they have no diagnosis at all then claiming DLA is like drawing blood from a stone.

 

So I wouldnt say DLA is a generic too easy to claim but rather the existing methods they use to determine eligiblity is wrong.

 

DLA is supposed to be for certian disabilities, but the DWP at some point started been lazy and started rewarding it for diagnosis instead, I still remember that time a confidential DWP page was put on the internet by mistake, it had a list of conditions which were put in one of 4 categories.

 

Categories were.

 

1 - Reward benefit with no medical.

2 - Reward benefit if medical confirms diagnosis.

3 - Carry out medical to confirm denial of benefit.

4 - Deny benefit with no medical.

 

A medical diagnosis is not meant to be a passport to benefits, as not everyone one is the same, 2 people with the same diagnosis can have very different capability.

[bedofweeds]

Wow DLA easy to claim?

 

thats news to me.

 

I have my 3rd tribunal for a 3rd failed attempt to claim it in november.

 

My view is DLA relies too much on diagnosis and if people have existing support etc.

 

eg. if someone has a condition that "typically" causes immobility they likely get HRM possibly even without an assessment. Whilst someone else who has a condition that normally doesnt cause mobility issues or they have no diagnosis at all then claiming DLA is like drawing blood from a stone.

 

So I wouldnt say DLA is a generic too easy to claim but rather the existing methods they use to determine eligiblity is wrong.

 

DLA is supposed to be for certian disabilities, but the DWP at some point started been lazy and started rewarding it for diagnosis instead, I still remember that time a confidential DWP page was put on the internet by mistake, it had a list of conditions which were put in one of 4 categories.

 

Categories were.

 

1 - Reward benefit with no medical.

2 - Reward benefit if medical confirms diagnosis.

3 - Carry out medical to confirm denial of benefit.

4 - Deny benefit with no medical.

 

A medical diagnosis is not meant to be a passport to benefits, as not everyone one is the same, 2 people with the same diagnosis can have very different capability.

 

Where did I say that it was easy to claim DLA??

 

It isn't. What I did say was that far too many conditions that needs arise out of have become acceptable for DLA purposes. If you go back to when DLA first started out in 1992, it was designed for those conditions that were already covered under the Mobility Allowance regulations. As for granting DLA on the basis of a diagnosis, governments over time have allowed this to happen. Their own data is set up in such a way that conditions are listed in accordance with the volume of claims being awarded. The highest being arthritis. Now I have no objection to that condition applying, but what has happened is that every arthritis sufferer now believes that it warrants a DLA award. Every claimant swears blind that their circumstances are the worst that can be imagined.

 

Then we have the ME & CFS brigade. How on earth was that envisaged in 1992? Then we have ADHD.

 

If you move slightly away from diagnosis towards assessing what the needs are - I am all for that. Diagnosis is important and has a place in claiming a disability benefit.

Surely the answer is that ALL claimants should be assessed fully on a regular basis backed up with medical evidence. Isn't that where DLA has failed and PIP is rectifying?

 

Shouldn't a disability based benefit be all about providing financial help to the MOST disabled and MOST vulnerable in society? If that is the case we should start at the top and draw a line and say that those above that line are entitled and those below are not. How can it be right to award HRM to someone that is so disabled that they cannot walk 5 metres without suffering extreme pain and at the same time give it to those that can walk up to 50 metres?

 

I think that the most important aspect of this is having regular assessments backed up with indisputable evidence allied to a diagnosis that the DWP can refer to to confirm the facts.

 

PIP will do all of those.

 

As for that list, it wasn't confidential at all - I have a copy myself. It was a list that signified that depending on what the diagnosis was, it determined if you had to have a face to face assessment.

 

Finally, if you argue that two people with the same diagnosis can have totally different levels of needs, then you are right back into my camp.

I have been slated for what I said this month about what people can do AND still be entitled to DLA & ESA.

 

As I have said I receive HRM & MRC, yet can function as good as a fit person in many respects. I am able to climb a 30' ladder, cut a hedge up to 10' high and 120' long, but still be entitled to my DLA. I could work full time if I wanted too albeit from home. yet I am entitled to ESA - Support Group.

 

The mockery of the DLA system comes alive when you look at Carers Allowance and DLA (Care element).

 

To qualify for either MRC you only have to prove that your needs would indicate that you need help at least twice a day throughout the day and that that help should total more than 1 hour.

So for a MRC award to be made you would have to prove day needs of say 10mins in the morning, 15mins at lunch time and 40 minutes in the afternoon. Yet with Carers Allowance you have to show (well you don't actually, the DWP take it on trust) that you provide care of say 5 hours a day. Shouldn't the DLA regulations be changed from 'at least one hour a day' to 'at least 5 hours a day'?

 

The whole DLA benefit needs to be binned. Far too many people are being awarded it for far too many reasons.

Let's get back to basics - PIP is to redefine what constitutes a disability and what needs actually arise out of it.

[Nystagmite]

To qualify for either MRC you only have to prove that your needs would indicate that you need help at least twice a day throughout the day and that that help should total more than 1 hour.

 

You sure? DLA have agreed I need help many times a day (which total over an hour) and still only give me LRC.