BullyBoys Brought my Business Debt after CCJ - Help

[Ukman2007]

To cut a long story short and precise.

 

Me and a former friend were going to set up a business.

We found an office which we thought was suitable and made contact with the landlord.

The landlord had informed me by phone that if we were to do the lease through the solicitors it would cost

and that we would have to pay for his solicitors cost,

but to avoid all that, he could download an online lease.

 

as a small business every little helps.

I agreed to go down his route with the downloading of the lease and I would have to pay the cost of it.

He then arrange to come show us the property on a chosen date and said he had many interest but would like us to sign in the day.

 

On the said day, when we were to meet up with him and have a formal look of the building due to kids, stay at home dad,

I could not make that date but my ex business partner would be there, that became a problem to the landlord as he was coming from Cambridge.

Eventually he said he would need us both to sign, I apologied and said we would have to do it another day, but he was half way to our city.

 

Moving on, my ex business partner then told me that things went well and we had the premises,

I asked him, how so, to which he told me that the landlord had allowed him to sign the contract himself,

being he was a major investor in the business, thought nothing of it.

 

after a few months of trading all things going swimmingly well, I started receiving complaints from customers,

on how my ex business partner was abusing his position.

 

Spoke to him, he thought nothing wrong if it.

 

It became the final straw when I had complaints from family member whom he didn't know was related to me and good friends.

 

I left the business with what I came into it with minus all my financial investment,

removed my name of the directorship and advised all business we had contact with of me no longer being part of the business.

Even informed the landlord that I was no longer involved and would have no reason for contact with him.

That was that, or at least I thought.

 

A few month later, I found out the business was doing really bad since I left and that he was owing the landlord money

and then being contacted by the landlord for money, to which you would imagine being surprise,

 

I ask the landlord why am I being contacted for rent being I'm not involved and he is aware of that,

to which he informed me that my ex partner had signed my signature.

Told him that was wrong and he said he would sort it out with my ex partner and there was a few back and forth.

 

Thought everything was resolved, and also I was going through a few health issues, needing a aortic valve replacement, spent quite a few weeks in hospital.

 

Moving on upon coming out of hospital I got a letter from the court about a judgment being passed against me without my presence.

The landlord had gone and taken me to court making me joint and several on a lease which I'd not signed

and knowing that I was in hospital and wouldn't be able to challenge.

 

The iron ice thing is he took me to court for the full amount and making all responsible, while my ex business partner wasn't chased for a single penny

and was allowed to still trade from the office.

 

On the challenge, I immediately appealed against it but the judge not once allowed me to plead my case or say much,

to which he ask me one question, is that your name on the lease, to which I replied no but it looks very similar.

He ask landlord did I sign it which obviously the landlord would say yes and the judge threw my appeal out and I lost again.

 

after a few days of not believing what had happen and knowing I had nowhere that I could go or do,

called the landlord and made an arrangement to pay in the new year of 2014, once I've comeback to full health,

as since my heart op, I've also had a hip replacement. The landlord agreed to the arrangement and thought nothing of it.

 

Fast forward Tuesday 8/10 at about 13:30, one average man and one big burley/mascular man turn up at my wife address, I'd moved into her house.

 

One asked me if I was such and such,

to which I said yes

and tried to just come in,

 

I quickly closed the door and walked to them outside.

 

One of the guys said to me they where there to collect this amount of money, as I owe them as they have bought the debt from my former landlord.

I asked them can I see ID which they didn't have but had a copy of an email printout with my name and new the landlords name.

I told him that I could not pay that and needed more time, to which he responded I'll give you till the 21/10, you better have my money or else there will be trouble,

to which the other guy recognised the uniform I was wearing and the company vehicle and said if I have got the money they will take the company vehicle when they return.

 

Being so shocked, scared and threatened I went to the police and report them

but there wasn't much they could do, but thought something wasn't right with the guys and gave me a crime reference number

and gave me an appointment on Thursday to return and talk to another police, which I did and was directed to CAB and told to call 999 if they return and feel scared.

 

I then contacted the landlord, who informed me that he has assigned my debt for payment to this individual,

but that individual on the Tuesday had informed me that he had bought the debt from the landlord.

 

By the Friday I get a few calls by the office informing me that one of the guys was calling my work place and being very rude and wanting me to call them urgently,

even discussing my situation with work.

 

That Friday I felt like someone was following me everywhere, even to my kids school, noticed a particular car colour and part of the license.

 

Later during that day I went to the magistrate court and ask them about the case,

and had informed them of what happened and they looked onto the system and told them what had happen and of me offering and arranging a payment settlement

with the landlord for the new year, to which they said I could fill in an application for suspension of warrant and/or variation of an order

and would have to pay £40 and inform guys if they turn up again that it's with the court.

 

Today Saturday about to take the kids to the activities and getting them in the car, I heard my name being shouted across the street

and then the average built man, and this time another big burley man coming towards me, with not the best of intentions,

my kids and wife which I later found out in the car was scared and not happy with their presence around me and them.

 

I showed him the form which he wanted to take off me, which I didn't let him and wanted my number and said I would call the police.

 

Yet again he had no ID or documents.

They then left and a few minutes I had a threatening call from him, saying I will get trouble.

 

I then send him a text asking him if he could send me the name of the company he represents or the company registration number

or if self employed a copy of the transaction of him buying the debt, so I could check details with HMRC and any relevant bodies.

 

As I'm sure he wouldn't be happy if I was to turn up on his door demanding a sum of money with no ID.

 

To which he tried calling me and I didn't pickup and sent a text saying from now on, I want to correspond via test or email or if it has to be by calls I am going to record it.

 

To which he responded, "if you don't answer my calls I will just turn up at your house".

 

He is still adamant that he bought the debt from the landlord, landlord is adamant he just assigned it to him.

 

The last text I receive in the pass minutes is "Call the police, you owe me me money and stop trying to rip people off you con man you ****ing me off"

 

Thanks for reading and appreciate any advice and help....

[kirkbyinfurnesslad]

You need to invovle the police forthwith and don't be fobbed off

[Conniff]

As above, you must involve the police. You should make a complaint of Fraud by your ex business partner and the landlord and intimidation and harassment from unknown persons who are making threats against you and your family.

 

Do it tomorrow.

[kirkbyinfurnesslad]

Go to the station. Don't let some civie put you off. Wait until u have see a uniformed officer

[king12345]

Then request a copy of the lease with your fake signature and go to the police.

They will give you a ref number which you will produce in court suing the landlord and your ex partner.

Actually, forget about the first line, instead go to a&e and tell them that because this man was threatening you, you felt a sharp pain in your chest and your weak heart is suffering.

Then go to the police with the hospital certificate and report this thug.

They must do something at that point.

Edited October 12, 2013 by ploddertom
No need for offering violence

[ploddertom]

How much was the CCJ for? Do you have a company name or similar of who is chasing you?

[Ukman2007]

The cost of rent owed is over £2500.

 

What find strange is if you tenant in a commercial property isn't paying their rent at £300 per month

why would you let it amount to that amount, which equates to about 8 months.

 

What landlord would allowed 8 months and allow that person to trade.

 

I also don't know the name of company as he won't tell me,

but he first said his name was Trevor Howell and in a text to put Rudolph, so not sure what it is.

[stu007]

Hi

 

This is shocking behaviour from these supposed debt collectors who should know better than to act in this manner with there behaviour towards you. Please have a read of the attached OFT PDF in fact print a copy off and keep it with you.

 

If they turn up again as you have not proof who they are I would do the following:

 

1. Call the Police - (inform them you already have a crime ref no.)

2. If you have a mobile phone with camera or a camera Photograph the individuals and there vehicle (try to get the registration).

3. Keep a written log of every incident whether its fact to face, phone call, text or contacting employer.

 

You really need to find out which company they are representing to make an official complaint to that company and also to the OFT of these employees actions.

 

something else to consider is to do an internet search of the mobile number they text you from to see what comes up if anything.

 

Also this Incident Log may be useful for you its in PDF:

Edited October 12, 2013 by stu007

[Ukman2007]

Thank you all, very useful information thus far, feel much happier if they do turn up again, I'm sure they will.

[dx100uk]

we have ways and means

 

what is the number you are getting these texts and threats from

 

dx

[brassnecked]

PM the number to site team

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

This starts off as a 'landlord/tenant' dispute and ends up with a visit to a magistrates court??

[kirkbyinfurnesslad]

This starts off as a 'landlord/tenant' dispute and ends up with a visit to a magistrates court??

 

maybe confused with the county court

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

The Warrant issued by the court should be provided by this 'bailiff' C if that is what he is) at the time of his 1st visit.

 

If this is a County Court Bailiff you can make a formal complaint to the court that issued his bailiff certification.

It will be looked at by a judge.

[mikeymack2002]

Simple contract law states that if you did not sign the document then you are not responsible. If your then partner signed YOUR name as well as his then this is wrong, if the landlord knew and was a witness to the signature and it was not you that signed the agreement he could be guilty of making a false instrument,

 

I would personally go back to the court and as for a set aside under these grounds, but only if you can prove it was not you that signed this document, if this is true then your landlord and partner at the time committed an offence that can be investigated. If you manage to get the set aside I would ask for the police to get involved straight away it's basically fraud and much more. Also the fact you were not given the opportunity to defend yourself in court due to hospitalization on that day too.

 

 

 

• The only mitigating reason for him to sign on your behalf is that as a business agreement in writing, you gave him permission to do so in the first place if not hen I would challenge the courts decision on this matter and ask to be heard in front of a judge again. The fact this signed contract made in it inside a court could be used in a criminal case for perverting the course of justice.
  

I know it may be a big ask have you got a copy of the agreement that you can post up? if so put it up in PDF format and take out all pers and sigs and leave as much detail in as you can.

 

MM

Edited October 13, 2013 by mikeymack2002

[brassnecked]

Fraud plain and simple

[ploddertom]

The other solution to finding who it is that has attended is to ask the LL as you still seem to be on talking terms. If he has obtained a CCJ and is trying to enforce the same via Bailiffs he can only engage the County Court Bailiff or transfer it up into a High Court whereby a HCEO would attend. Appears to me there is something sadly wrong here.

[king12345]

The other solution to finding who it is that has attended is to ask the LL as you still seem to be on talking terms. If he has obtained a CCJ and is trying to enforce the same via Bailiffs he can only engage the County Court Bailiff or transfer it up into a High Court whereby a HCEO would attend. Appears to me there is something sadly wrong here.

It sounds like the lendlord has sold the debt to the local gangster.
Even the worst bailiff would have shown the id card.
I don't think this guy is a legitimate bailiff at all.

[tomtubby]

You have received some good advice on here. Please make sure that you post back tomorrow once you have taken this matter further.

 

 

It was not too easy to read your post so I have re-formatted it. Hopefully this should be better:

 

 

 

To cut a long story short and precise.

 

Me and a former friend were going to set up a business.

 

We found an office which we thought was suitable and made contact with the landlord. The landlord had informed me by phone that if we were to do the lease through the solicitors it would cost and that we would have to pay for his solicitors cost, but to avoid all that, he could download an online lease. As a small business every little helps.

 

I agreed to go down his route with the downloading of the lease and I would have to pay the cost of it.

 

He then arrange to come show us the property on a chosen date and said he had many interest but would like us to sign in the day. On the said day, when we were to meet up with him and have a formal look of the building due to kids, stay at home dad, I could not make that date but my ex business partner would be there, that became a problem to the landlord as he was coming from Cambridge.

 

Eventually he said he would need us both to sign, I apologied and said we would have to do it another day, but he was half way to our city.

 

Moving on, my ex business partner then told me that things went well and we had the premises, I asked him, how so, to which he told me that the landlord had allowed him to sign the contract himself, being he was a major investor in the business, thought nothing of it.

 

After a few months of trading all things going swimmingly well, I started receiving complaints from customers, on how my ex business partner was abusing his position. Spoke to him, he thought nothing wrong if it.

 

It became the final straw when I had complaints from family member whom he didn't know was related to me and good friends.

 

I left the business with what I came into it with minus all my financial investment, removed my name of the directorship and advised all business we had contact with of me no longer being part of the business. Even informed the landlord that I was no longer involved and would have no reason for contact with him.

 

That was that, or at least I thought.

 

A few month later, I found out the business was doing really bad since I left and that he was owing the landlord money and then being contacted by the landlord for money, to which you would imagine being surprise.

 

I ask the landlord why am I being contacted for rent being I'm not involved and he is aware of that, to which he informed me that my ex partner had signed my signature. Told him that was wrong and he said he would sort it out with my ex partner and there was a few back and forth.

 

Thought everything was resolved, and also I was going through a few health issues, needing a aortic valve replacement, spent quite a few weeks in hospital.

 

Moving on. Upon coming out of hospital I got a letter from the court about a judgment being passed against me without my presence. The landlord had gone and taken me to court making me joint and several on a lease which I'd not signed and knowing that I was in hospital and wouldn't be able to challenge.

 

The iron ice thing is he took me to court for the full amount and making all responsible, while my ex business partner wasn't chased for a single penny

and was allowed to still trade from the office.

 

On the challenge, I immediately appealed against it but the judge not once allowed me to plead my case or say much, to which he ask me one question, is that your name on the lease, to which I replied no but it looks very similar. He ask landlord did I sign it which obviously the landlord would say yes and the judge threw my appeal out and I lost again.

 

After a few days of not believing what had happen and knowing I had nowhere that I could go or do, called the landlord and made an arrangement to pay in the new year of 2014, once I've comeback to full health, as since my heart op, I've also had a hip replacement. The landlord agreed to the arrangement and thought nothing of it.

 

Fast forward Tuesday 8/10 at about 13:30, one average man and one big burley/mascular man turn up at my wife address, I'd moved into her house. One asked me if I was such and such, to which I said yes and tried to just come in. I quickly closed the door and walked to them outside.

 

One of the guys said to me they where there to collect this amount of money, as I owe them as they have bought the debt from my former landlord.

 

I asked them can I see ID which they didn't have but had a copy of an email printout with my name and new the landlords name. I told him that I could not pay that and needed more time, to which he responded I'll give you till the 21/10, you better have my money or else there will be trouble, to which the other guy recognised the uniform I was wearing and the company vehicle and said if I have got the money they will take the company vehicle when they return.

 

Being so shocked, scared and threatened I went to the police and report them but there wasn't much they could do, but thought something wasn't right with the guys and gave me a crime reference number and gave me an appointment on Thursday to return and talk to another police, which I did and was directed to CAB and told to call 999 if they return and feel scared.

 

I then contacted the landlord, who informed me that he has assigned my debt for payment to this individual, but that individual on the Tuesday had informed me that he had bought the debt from the landlord.

 

By the Friday I get a few calls by the office informing me that one of the guys was calling my work place and being very rude and wanting me to call them urgently,

even discussing my situation with work.

 

That Friday I felt like someone was following me everywhere, even to my kids school, noticed a particular car colour and part of the license.

 

Later during that day I went to the magistrate court and ask them about the case, and had informed them of what happened and they looked onto the system and told them what had happen and of me offering and arranging a payment settlement with the landlord for the new year, to which they said I could fill in an application for suspension of warrant and/or variation of an order and would have to pay £40 and inform guys if they turn up again that it's with the court.

 

Today Saturday about to take the kids to the activities and getting them in the car, I heard my name being shouted across the street and then the average built man, and this time another big burley man coming towards me, with not the best of intentions, my kids and wife which I later found out in the car was scared and not happy with their presence around me and them.

 

I showed him the form which he wanted to take off me, which I didn't let him and wanted my number and said I would call the police. Yet again he had no ID or documents. They then left and a few minutes I had a threatening call from him, saying I will get trouble.

 

I then send him a text asking him if he could send me the name of the company he represents or the company registration number or if self employed a copy of the transaction of him buying the debt, so I could check details with HMRC and any relevant bodies. As I'm sure he wouldn't be happy if I was to turn up on his door demanding a sum of money with no ID.

 

To which he tried calling me and I didn't pickup and sent a text saying from now on, I want to correspond via test or email or if it has to be by calls I am going to record it. To which he responded, "if you don't answer my calls I will just turn up at your house".

 

He is still adamant that he bought the debt from the landlord, landlord is adamant he just assigned it to him. The last text I receive in the pass minutes is "Call the police, you owe me me money and stop trying to rip people off you con man you ****ing me off"

 

Thanks for reading and appreciate any advice and help....

[mikeymack2002]

He is still adamant that he bought the debt from the landlord, landlord is adamant he just assigned it to him. The last text I receive in the pass minutes is "Call the police, you owe me me money and stop trying to rip people off you con man you ****ing me off"

 

Thanks for reading and appreciate any advice and help....

 

If this part is correct did the landlord send you the letter of assignment regarding the ownership of the alleged debt? something really is not right in this case, too many inconsistences, I personally as advised earlier would go to the court and ask for a set aside, there is something really wrong here, I just can't put my finger on it yet, ok lets break it down in stages

 

1. Did you sign the contract? Did the landlord witness YOUR signature?

2. Did the landlord know you was in hospital when the case came to court?

3. This part is disturbing Quote "That Friday I felt like someone was following me everywhere, even to my kids school, noticed a particular car colour and part of the license. "

4. have you received the notice of sale/assignment?

5. Can you prove you was in hospital at the time of the case?

6 My final observation is have you still got the text on your phone from your "bailiff" if so again return to the court.

 

No Judge worth his salt would ever allow a LIP not to defend themselves. no bailiff that wants to keep his job would risk speaking to a debtor like yours did. or refuse to show the correct ID and warrant, so again I ask what is missing from this story, can you please fill in the gaps or run the risk of getting the wrong advice! or you could just go and retain a fee paying solicitor? Sorry for being blunt OP but......

 

MM

Edited October 13, 2013 by mikeymack2002

[HCEOs]

I'd say this is in the wrong section of the forum as these are clearly 'debt collectors' and probably unlicensed.

 

In the first instance they and the creditor should be reported to the Police.

[brassnecked]

I'd say this is in the wrong section of the forum as these are clearly 'debt collectors' and probably unlicensed.

 

In the first instance they and the creditor should be reported to the Police.

 

Yes definitely involve police, and likely da boyz are shady debt collectors of a Kray or Dinsdale Pirhana persuasion.

[tomtubby]

Given the apparent seriousness of your complaint please do not be tempted to post the name of the debt collection company on the forum.

 

It may well be that one of the moderators could send a private message to you for further details and that way; they could decide whether your post should be in the debt collection section as suggested by HCEO.