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Parked in Loading Bay for 10 Minutes


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Hello

 

I am having problems with a Local Authority PCN that was attached to my car in a Loading Bay in the centre of town almost.

 

We were delivering a large item that needed two people to carry and as such it was continuous loading and yes it did take more than ten minutes, (time stated on the PCN).

 

I have missed the deadline for appealing this through the normal channels as it is now time barred (apparently) from making an appealing to this PCN.

 

I have asked the council for information regards the PCN and the fact that the traffic order allows up to 20 minutes and the Road Traffic Act allows "where's reasonably necessary" as far as time for loading and or unloading. I also asked if my vehicle was in the line of sight for the full ten minutes he has specified, as I am sure it was not and asked for he PCN,so before and After to ascertain his location.

 

I have had a response from the CEO who claims that they don't have access to the information regards the other PCN,s and that's this is not recorded by the equipment?

I find this hard to believe and also there is no GPS only when's PCN is Issued it sends it to the councils computer system.? Huh?

 

I am refusing to pay this I feel they have no grounds to issue this PCN and wondered what any of the old heads have a better grasp or insight into this which would help me make further decisions?

 

Thanks to anyone for any valid input it really is appreciated.

 

ScruffJustice

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Do you have info on the sign by the loading bay?

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

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I have missed the deadline for appealing this through the normal channels as it is now time barred (apparently) from making an appealing to this PCN.

 

When was the PCN issued?

Have you received the Notice to Owner?

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If you are indeed too late to appeal, then there's not much point in trying to take an appeal forward - they won't accept it.

 

If you think the CEO really could locate the PCN he issued before and after, it doesn't help you - they are separate cases.

 

As for refusing to pay - your call, but there are enforcement processes at the council's disposal. It might be foolhardy to take them on in this manner.

 

Out of interest, did you appeal this before now?

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If you are indeed too late to appeal, then there's not much point in trying to take an appeal forward - they won't accept it.

 

If you think the CEO really could locate the PCN he issued before and after, it doesn't help you - they are separate cases.

 

As for refusing to pay - your call, but there are enforcement processes at the council's disposal. It might be foolhardy to take them on in this manner.

 

Out of interest, did you appeal this before now?

 

 

Hi thanks for reading over my problem.

 

This was last year when the PCN was issued was just an issue with receiving the correspondence. Appeal time long gone!

 

I don't understand how they can get away with that when the traffic order says 20 minutes are allowed. I asked for the jnfo on the tickets before and after to ascertain if the PA had kept my vehicle in his sight for the ten minutes he stated on the ticket. I think the findings would invalidate their ticket.

 

Oh well I will wait and see what the appeal to the CEO does first.

 

Thanks for all your input

 

SJ

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Yeah I have an image if the sign

 

NTO has been issued!

 

Last year was the issue of the PCN .

 

Can I find out why they will not supply the ticket stubs AKA the software printout telling me the tickets issuing points .

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Yeah I have an image if the sign it says loading only.

 

NTO has been issued!

 

Last year was the issue of the PCN .

 

Can I find out why they will not supply the ticket stubs AKA the software printout telling me the tickets issuing points .

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When was the NTO issued? You have 28 days to appeal from when the NTO is served.

 

You can find out why they won't supply ticket stubs - just ask them. To be honest, I can't see what help it is to you. Either you are within the appeals route, and can argue the case, or you are not, in which case, there's no point. Likewise the issue of the 20 minutes - it only helps if you are able to appeal and present your arguments to them, but according to your first post, you have missed the deadline. If the NTO was served in the last 28 days, then you can appeal.

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If you were loading in a loading bay take pictures and witness statement from person at other end of sofa and from the person you were delivering it to/for and that is that. If the council reject that submission you can appeal to the adjudicator.

If you failed to get your appeal in to the council in time then there is no point in further postings here and expect to get a CCJ for non-payment. Try asking council to reconsider if they were late in replying to your requests for information and then go to local Govt ombudsman if unhappy but pay up if you have lost the appeal or it is refused again.

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If you were loading in a loading bay take pictures and witness statement from person at other end of sofa and from the person you were delivering it to/for and that is that. If the council reject that submission you can appeal to the adjudicator.

If you failed to get your appeal in to the council in time then there is no point in further postings here and expect to get a CCJ for non-payment. Try asking council to reconsider if they were late in replying to your requests for information and then go to local Govt ombudsman if unhappy but pay up if you have lost the appeal or it is refused again.

 

None of that is viable if he's out of time to appeal. That issue needs to be confirmed before he does anything else.

 

You don't get CCJs for PCNs.

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  • 2 weeks later...
None of that is viable if he's out of time to appeal. That issue needs to be confirmed before he does anything else.

 

You don't get CCJs for PCNs.

 

Hello and thanks for the reply.

 

I am out of time to appeal the PCN, I was already out of time by the time I had sight of the NTO.

 

Thanks for all your help......I think the problem is not the timescales and administration of a PCN it is the councils Mal-administration as they have acted beyond there powers when issuing a PCN that should not have ever been issued as it was within the Guidelines they have stipulated for that Loading Bay and also the Traffic Order for the same. Never mind the fact they cannot supply me evidence that the PA was even following procedure when he or she issued the ticket.

 

Worse Case scenario is they will pass it to the Sheriff officers for collection and I will raise a court action against them for mal- administration.

 

Best Case scenario is they realise this has been challenged and they have been found out procedurally for the issuing of the PCN's almost the same as the private parking companies who get away with this every minute of every day.

 

Stand Up For Your Rights.

 

ScruffJustice

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Can you tell us why you did not receive the NTO before the 28 days had expired? Was there a problem?

 

I strongly advise you don't just refuse to pay. Your description of the worst case scenario is not right. What will happen if you refuse to budge is that bailiffs will come after you and clamp the car. You will be billed much more than you currently owe and if you still refuse to pay, they will tow the car away. Not the outcome you need!

 

So what happened with the NTO? Why didn't you get it sooner?

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I think the problem is not the timescales and administration of a PCN it is the councils Mal-administration as they have acted beyond there powers when issuing a PCN that should not have ever been issued as it was within the Guidelines they have stipulated for that Loading Bay and also the Traffic Order for the same. Never mind the fact they cannot supply me evidence that the PA was even following procedure when he or she issued the ticket.

 

 

They haven't acted beyond their powers unless you can prove the CEO knew you were loading which I suspect is very doubtful. The Traffic order does state a maximum time for loading but it doesn't state a PCN cannot be issued before 20 minutes if the CEO believes you are not loading. Since you state you were away from the vehicle for over 10 minutes I don't see how you can ague you don't think the vehicle was observed correctly as you were not at the vehicle? As the facts stand you left the vehicle for 10 minutes and because of that the CEO suspected no loading was taking place. If you wished to dispute that fact you should have contested properly using the process set out in law.

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