trying for full and final settlement - no credit agreement

[lucygreen]

Hi,

 

I am in the process of trying to get B/C to accept a full and final settlement on my credit card.

 

I haven't used this card for at least 2 years

- ever since they gave me the option of either agreeing to a ridiculously high interest rate or keeping the (still very high) rate and closing the account.

I have continued to make payments but do have quite a few late payments on my credit file for them, none over 2 months though.

 

I spoke to collections two days ago and asked if they would consider a F&F settlement as I am recently divorced

and will not be able to continue to keep up the hefty monthly payments - my debt is £2000.

 

I offered, probably unwisely, 50%.

 

I was told no, my account 'isn't eligible' .

 

I've escalated the case to complaints dept who have today called me and said they would accept a settlement but it will go on my credit file as 'partial settlement.'

 

They did immediately refund the last six months of interest and charges

- totalling £350 and agreed to put the account 'on a 30 day hold' .'

 

The chap I spoke to assured me they wouldn't try to get any more monies if I agreed to this form of settlement, but I don't trust them AT ALL!

 

Plus I really don't want this to wreck my credit file if at all possible.

 

There are loads of late payment/over-limit charges which I did try to get refunded

using a company that ended up telling me they were no longer able to get charges back from B/C..

.I think they would add up to at least half the outstanding amount.

 

Plus, B/c have not been able to find my credit agreement and I have a letter from them admitting that they realise they cannot enforce the debt.

 

Sooo... I am pushing for 50% of the remaining balance to be taken as full settlement,

with a promise from them to mark it on my file as fully paid with no outstanding amount owed

and just wonder how much ammunition I have given this admission from them?

 

Sorry for rambling on,

 

Any advice very gratefully received and many thanks in advance.

[ims21]

Why not reclaim all of those charges and the associated interest first (the ones that were given up on) and then base a full and final on the balance after deducting those from the total?

[lucygreen]

Thanks for the reply ims21,

I do have most of my old statements, so I could give it a go.

 

I did tell the chap on the phone that I would do this if they didn't agree.

 

Do you think it will help my case that they can't provide me with my original credit agreement?

 

Also, in accepting the £350 they took off in interest and charges, have I jeopardized my case for getting the rest refunded?

 

They have refunded a few over the years but certainly nothing like all of them.

[ims21]

If they haven't got the agreement then they should not be able to enforce at court.

 

Having said that, they could perhaps come up with a reconstituted copy and they may be able to succeed with that.

 

I don't think the a partial refund precludes you from reclaiming the historic charges and associated interest. If it were me I would fill out this spreadsheet so that you can see what the amount is that could come back to you to reduce the amount owing.

 

CISheet v101.xls

 

For the rate of interest, use 24.9% at the moment and see what the sheet comes up with as a total.

 

Save the sheet first and work from that saved copy rather than direct from the link.

[slick132]

Hi Lucy and welcome to CAG

 

Please see the PM (private message) I've just sent you.

 

Please confirm approx when you opened this a/c.

 

If you haven't already done so, I suggest you send BC a CCA request - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/content.php?414-CCA-request-letter It could prove to be a very wisely-invested £1.00.

 

Use the spreadsheet asap and let us know the approx figures for penalty charges and for compound interest.

 

If you are going to reject the offer of £350, this should be done in writing but don't do this until you've decided how to deal with all aspects of your case.

 

Also, stay OFF the phone from now on, so you have a good paper trail.

 

The 30 day hold on your a/c will be useful and give you enough time to work out how to proceed.

 

[lucygreen]

thanks for the replies.

 

As far as the CCA is concerned, B/C sent me a letter last year

- presumably when my CCA was requested by the company who tried to get my charges back

- which states that they don't have it and that they realise that without it the agreement is unenforceable.

 

So I think I can safely assume that is the case

- in fact it was confirmed to me on the phone by the complaints team member I spoke to.

 

Alarmingly, or should I say amazingly, they also enclosed a copy of someone else's agreement,

complete with their name and address! I'm using this as ammunition too, as it is surely a breach of customer confidentiality??

 

I think these are probably the only reasons they are willing to even talk to me about full and final settlement.

 

I will add up my charges, not including those they have refunded yesterday.

 

I opened the account in 2000.

Thanks again

[slick132]

Hi Lucy,

 

I have no idea why the Claims Company said they couldn't get charges back from BC. We have helped folk reclaim thousands from BC in charges and compound interest so it'll be good to hear from you what figures you get from the spreadsheet.

 

Can you just confirm that, when the Claims Company said they couldn't get charges back, that none were refunded at that time. What we need to know is that you didn't accept any amount in full and final settlement of all charges up to that date.

 

Although they made a serious Data Protection breach by sending you another person's credit agreement, that will probably not affect any decisions about accepting a F&F settlement about your a/c. The reason they'll discuss a F&F settlement is far more likely to be because they don't have a valid credit agreement.

 

Can you also confirm if there was any PPI on the a/c which may be reclaimable due to mis-selling.

 

[lucygreen]

Thanks again slick132.

 

B/c did refund £80 into my card account in the period that the claims co was trying to get the charges back,

but they didn't notify me, nor did I agree to this being full and final settlement.

 

The claims co continued after this to try to get the rest of the charges back

- can't remember off hand how much it came to but it was in the hundreds.

 

They never really told me why they couldn't do it, just that the company had taken an executive decision not to make claims against b/c, or my other card, Capital One...gah!

 

I guess it might be a problem deciphering which charges they paid back?

Should I just take that amount off the total when I add the charges up?

 

One more q:

 

is it too late to reclaim the charges from back in 2000-2006 ie the bigger ones?

 

Should I just stick to the last 6 years?

 

I don't have any PPI

 

thanks so much

[slick132]

Hi Lucy and thanks for the further info.

 

There is a chance that, when BC refunded the £80, the Claims Co accepted it as a F&F settlement of ALL penalty charges up to that date. You would have enabled the Claims Co to represent you and act on your behalf.

 

I think, at this stage, you could proceed on the basis that you CAN claim back the proper amounts.

 

If BC feel otherwise, let them tell you. You would lose your court fee if you get as far as filing a court claim and there's a risk of the banks' fees in defending although that should be minimal as Barclays should make it clear early on if they contest the claim on the basis of a previous F&F settlement re penalty charges.

 

If you can find details of what amounts were refunded, that would be useful, either in letters or on your BC statements (if refunds were made to the a/c). If you DO go ahead and try to reclaim properly, any amounts refunded can be taken into a/c easily.

 

If you are taking court action, you may as well reclaim all charges that you have data for, so back to 2000 if any were charged back then.

 

So you can see what's involved, read through this - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?368541-trancyb-vs-Barclaycard

 

Also, read other BC **WON with Compound Interest** threads here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?97-Barclays-BCard-and-Woolwich-successes

 

Once we know the potential reclaim figures, we can suggest you best move.

 

[lucygreen]

Hi again, well I've added up the charges from November 08 - November 12 - as they have refunded the last 6 months. Before 2007 the card was with Morgan Stanley/Goldfish so I'd need to request statements from them, but B/C say they have no access to them, even though they clearly took over my card from them (I didn't choose to change card co, they just did it...) Anyway, these charges, plus compound interest comes to £1,157.40. Charges alone come to £636. Blimey!And this on a card that I've not used in at least two years!

 

I cant find any paperwork relating to the refunded charges last year, but I know for sure I didn't agree to them being in F&F settlement, whether the claims co did is another matter, but I doubt it as they were still working on the case after this refund and when they told me they weren't going to take it further they did suggest I could do it myself... As you say, I'm sure b/c will soon tell me otherwise

[slick132]

Hi Lucy,

 

Just to clarify, you can include all the charges they made and simply deduct the amount refunded from the spready total.

 

What a shame you don't have the older statements. You may well find difficulty in getting them as BC may say they don't have them or, even if they did, they'll say they're older than 6 years and have been destroyed.

 

It's the older charges that produce the higher compound interest figures !

 

It would certainly be worth hunting for them if you think there's even a small chance you still have them.

 

Have you sent BC a SAR. As well as starting the ball rolling to get missing statements, it should also disclose in what circumstances any refund was agreed to by the Claims Company.

 

[Desperate Daniella]

Hi Lucy,

 

As this was originally a Goldfish account they almost certainly won't have the original agreement. I've never seen one produced in almost five years on CAG.

 

You are in a very strong position.

 

What happened with Capital One?

 

DD