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National Service Bill

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Ok, do it. Now we have six million service personnel, what are they all going to do? we will have the shiniest tanks, ships and warplanes in the whole world.

 

That is all they can be, cleaners as we have no aircraft nor ships for them to serve on.

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Perhaps if time was taken to read the Bill then some of the remarks made would not have been made. The Bill states that service is for 1 year, not the periods of time that would "give up a good part of their youth" there is no mention in the Bill of "Military Service" the nearest the Bill comes to mention anything like Military Service is in Section 2 Part 5 that states an option to "work connected with the National Health Service, the emergency services or the Armed Forces".

A lot of arguements against are based on people's idea's of 1950's National Service, which is why a few have stated about "have those suggesting it ever done or would want to do National Service" There is no comparison !!

There are also cries of "a waste of money" is it not also a "waste of money" and indeed of the potential of those youths to pay them Benefits to do nothing ?

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So forced enlistment for 1 year purely to bodge the numbers of the workforce and also removing the freedom on young people under penalty of imprisonment or fines.

 

And you dont see anything wrong with that?


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rds60h is desperately trying to justify the so called "BILL" which looks like it has been pasted together by someone in junior school as it has not been thought through and implications plus circumstances taken into consideration. It is a piece of paper that someone has headed "Bill" in an effort to make it look official. It won't even be presented to the house of commons as it will be laughed out the house!

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These days the UK cannot afford a disaffected conscripted military, type of ill thought out proposal has been cropping up since compulsory national service was scrapped.

 

The military cannot/must not be used or be seen to be used as some kind of punishment/retraining establishment for petty offenders and trouble makers or a as an easy option for the Government to lower the unemployment figures.

 

Although the Military has an enviable reputation for corrective training returning the vast majority of service people sent to the MCTC in Colchester to a full active career with their unit, this cannot be done on a 'national' scale.


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Although the Military has an enviable reputation for corrective training returning the vast majority of service people sent to the MCTC in Colchester to a full active career with their unit, this cannot be done on a 'national' scale.

 

Not enough galvanised dustbins to polish :)

Edited by Conniff

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More "Military" remarks being made by those who have obviously not read the Bill (and it is a Bill because it has been presented to Parliament and it has had its first reading).

There also seems to be a trail of thought of "disgusting enforced labour" firstly as the Bill states there will be learning and coaching as well as work. Secondly, does it follow that those who are opposed to this "disgusting forced labour" are happy for those youngsters on benefits to sit about and fester and lose all self respect and accept life on the dole as the norm ? I don't think that is true, but what is their suggestion to improve that situation....................surely some action must be better than inaction.

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The 'military remarks' are from experience, todays military cannot be used for a 'social experiment' getting young adults off JSA or whatever.


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More "Military" remarks being made by those who have obviously not read the Bill (and it is a Bill because it has been presented to Parliament and it has had its first reading).

There also seems to be a trail of thought of "disgusting enforced labour" firstly as the Bill states there will be learning and coaching as well as work. Secondly, does it follow that those who are opposed to this "disgusting forced labour" are happy for those youngsters on benefits to sit about and fester and lose all self respect and accept life on the dole as the norm ? I don't think that is true, but what is their suggestion to improve that situation....................surely some action must be better than inaction.

 

You seem to like contradicting yourself and ignoring everyone elses discussions and arguments against it.

 

National Service was removed for a reason. The conservatives want to bring it back simply to fudge the employment statistics and to lower the juvenile incarceration numbers. It really is as simple as that.

 

As already said, the military cannot support a national service scheme. The personell doesnt exist, nor does the money. Think about it, you have millions of people of NS age who would be forced to sign up. Ho is going to pay them? Train them? Where would they live? What would they do?


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

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Come on rds60h, this is joke right?

 

Everyone between 18 and 26.

 

Lets have a look at this Stupid, not thought through bill:

 

First off where are they going to be housed?

Who is going to be their instructors?

 

There is 7.5 million people in the UK between the ages of 18 and 26, so lets do some costings shall we.

 

Lets say 7 million.

 

(They are to be paid the national 'adult' minimum wage £6.31)

 

 

£6.31 * 7 million = £44,170,000 per hour * 40 hours = £1,766,800,000 per week + all the ancilliary staff and equipment that goes with it so it's safe to double that.

 

Where is the government going to get that sort of money?

 

There is nothing about the military in those figures.

 

Now we come to the court costs of those that refuse and so 'commit an offence' and then there all these new 'criminals' on the street not able to get work as no employer wants to employ a criminal.

 

Now comes the jokes

 

 

(1) Participants in national service shall be paid the national adult minimum wage

during their year of service with accommodation and travel funded by the

Secretary of State.

 

(2) Regulations shall provide that a person who has successfully completed their

year of national service shall be presented with a national service certificate

which shall entitle them to a lifetime income tax rate personal allowance 10 per

cent above the personal allowance that would otherwise apply.

Edited by Conniff

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Fully agreed there conniff. it is definitely ill thought out and is very obviously a ploy to fudge the employment numbers. The sad thing is, that people, like rds60h are in full support of this bill. it's as if they are such a devout conservative supporter, they think they will commit a mortal sin if they disagree with anything the party throws out.

 

Then theres the part where he states it will get the troublemakers off the streets. First, there are laws in ths country and a justice system to sort that out. Plus you really think throwing a troublemaker into the military and handing him access to all manner of equipment will make him good? If anything it will feed his attitude.

 

This country and its residents is NOTHING like it was back in the 60's and previous. The government and the elders of society really need to sit up and realise that.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Fully agreed there conniff. it is definitely ill thought out and is very obviously a ploy to fudge the employment numbers. The sad thing is, that people, like rds60h are in full support of this bill. it's as if they are such a devout conservative supporter, they think they will commit a mortal sin if they disagree with anything the party throws out.

 

Then theres the part where he states it will get the troublemakers off the streets. First, there are laws in ths country and a justice system to sort that out. Plus you really think throwing a troublemaker into the military and handing him access to all manner of equipment will make him good? If anything it will feed his attitude.

 

This country and its residents is NOTHING like it was back in the 60's and previous. The government and the elders of society really need to sit up and realise that.

If the Executive wish to implement any law, they will do it.... the Executive, controlling the Payroll Vote within the House of Commons and House of Lords, and will do whatever they are told. A recent example was the Retrospective Legislation dealing with aftermath of the Cait Reilly Judgement. If someone on the Payroll Vote does not do as they are told, such as a PPS, then they will soon be replaced.

 

Unfortunately, the coercive power of patronage, enabling MP's to become part of the Payroll Vote, where they may be promised an accelerator on the Greasy Pole, introduces a considerable motivator - and the General Government and Elders in Society may be powerless to influence the decisions made.

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It will get repealed once they realise youngsters today are not going to give up their freedom, simply so the likes of cameron and clegg can look good in europe.

 

Politicians need to realise, that the days of blind obedience are over.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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What no one is taking into consideration is the cost to implement it and monitor it never mind the running costs. Youngsters will duck and dive to avoid NS which means that you will need MPs to scour the land for them. What is to stop them working elsewhere in the EU between ages 16 - 26? The MP who thought this up must be the laughing stock of commons as most people think quite correctly that he is an idiot! Some lame brain even started an e-petition for this and has been posting invites on loads of forums. I split my sides laughing when I read their begging post!

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Fully agreed there conniff. it is definitely ill thought out and is very obviously a ploy to fudge the employment numbers. The sad thing is, that people, like rds60h are in full support of this bill. it's as if they are such a devout conservative supporter, they think they will commit a mortal sin if they disagree with anything the party throws out.

 

Then theres the part where he states it will get the troublemakers off the streets. First, there are laws in ths country and a justice system to sort that out. Plus you really think throwing a troublemaker into the military and handing him access to all manner of equipment will make him good? If anything it will feed his attitude.

 

This country and its residents is NOTHING like it was back in the 60's and previous. The government and the elders of society really need to sit up and realise that.

 

Just to burst your idiotic illusions, I am not a Tory nor have I ever voted Tory in my Life !!

I have in the past been a Union activist and I vehemently opposed almost everything Maggie Thatcher stood for and firmly blame the Iron Lady for many of the ills of todays society.

By your remarks, as I already stated about others, you have not fully read the Bill so how can you blindly agree with someone who disagrees if you do not have knowledge of the facts of a subject.

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Come on rds60h, this is joke right?

 

Everyone between 18 and 26.

 

Lets have a look at this Stupid, not thought through bill:

 

First off where are they going to be housed?

Who is going to be their instructors?

 

There is 7.5 million people in the UK between the ages of 18 and 26, so lets do some costings shall we.

 

Lets say 7 million.

 

(They are to be paid the national 'adult' minimum wage £6.31)

 

 

£6.31 * 7 million = £44,170,000 per hour * 40 hours = £1,766,800,000 per week + all the ancilliary staff and equipment that goes with it so it's safe to double that.

 

Where is the government going to get that sort of money?

 

There is nothing about the military in those figures.

 

Now we come to the court costs of those that refuse and so 'commit an offence' and then there all these new 'criminals' on the street not able to get work as no employer wants to employ a criminal.

 

Now comes the jokes

 

 

(1) Participants in national service shall be paid the national adult minimum wage

during their year of service with accommodation and travel funded by the

Secretary of State.

 

(2) Regulations shall provide that a person who has successfully completed their

year of national service shall be presented with a national service certificate

which shall entitle them to a lifetime income tax rate personal allowance 10 per

cent above the personal allowance that would otherwise apply.

 

Where is the government going to get that sort of money?

 

What about the same place they managed to get the £995 Billion..........YES £995 Billion !! to support the Banks and which the continue to fund ?

Or how about reducing the £11.3 Billion we annually give in Aid...........much of which is to countries that do not require Aid and is actually used to grease palms for foreign trade.

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This may be of use providing the armed forces are exempted from involvement!


Any Letters I Draft are N0T approved by CAG and no personal liability is accepted.

Please Consider making a donation to keep this site running!

Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit: Animo et Fide:

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Where is the government going to get that sort of money?

 

What about the same place they managed to get the £995 Billion..........YES £995 Billion !! to support the Banks and which the continue to fund ?

Or how about reducing the £11.3 Billion we annually give in Aid...........much of which is to countries that do not require Aid and is actually used to grease palms for foreign trade.

 

We can forget the billions to the Banks, that was just a temporary bailout and they took shares as collateral and will be selling those shares at a time where they will make a profit on them.

 

Overseas aid I fully agree with you. Africa hasn't changed in the past million years despite billions and billions being pumped into them by us, more that the rest of the world put together, and as for India, that is the worse of a real bad lot. We are giving them millions and they are sending spaceships to mars. Giving aid to a country that is probably richer than we are really is something we should demand our Government stops.

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This government just does what the bush administration dif. You don't have the money? Simple answer - Create it out of thin air. Then blame other governments for causing the country to fall into debt. Repeat it often enough and people will begin to believe it.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Africa hasn't changed in the past million years despite billions and billions being pumped into them by us

 

Thats due to Africa's government and out government being in bed with them due to arms trade etc etc. Remove specific african governments and you can turn the country around in a decade or so. Keep the current officials in power, and we get more money from them from arm sales, and their country goes to hell.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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@ eclecticzebra

 

This thread is 2 years old and you wouldn't be able to sign the petition if you wanted to as it is Archived and the Deadline was 16th Sept 2014

 

Why are you posting in old threads?


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