Unenforceable agreements under the Consumer Credit Act

[Stub001]

(Quite long I know but please stick with it...could open up a new area for claims...)

 

Hi all. Great site...helped girlfriend claim back £830 from Lloyds TSB and just issued another claim against them today for £490...thanks for all the help/templates/advice. Got an unusual (I think) query this time...

 

Was checking the national debt line site back in April and came across their letters template link (National Debtline England & Wales | Debt Advice). 2/3rds down the list there is a CCA letter that you can use to request a copy of a credit agreement from your creditors under the CCA (Sections 77-79)...what is interesting about this is that it states that "creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act." This is relevant for my girlfriend as she thought she had come to the end of the term of the loan only to be told that 4 instalments were still outstanding. She has been switched from one loan product to another during the loan term and by Lloyds own admittance is on an "old-style" loan. She sent the CCA letter in April and has heard nothing since...no agreement, no chasers for the money, nothing. Lloyds have however starting to charge interest on the outstanding balance without any notification. Three questions:

 

1) Is the national debtline letter correct?

2) If so, does unenforceable mean that my girlfriend can write to Lloyds to get them to scrub off the outstanding amount?

3) Is Lloyds practice of charging interest in this manner legal (particularly given that they are unable to provide a copy of the credit agreement)?

 

Any views/advice/experiences would be most welcome.

 

Thanks.

 

Stuart

[Rooster-UK]

Hi Stub.

 

Please start your own thread in the DEBT and BAILIFFS forum and copy and paste this post there.

You will get help and advice that is more specific to your needs.

 

 

Click on this link for DEBT AND BAILIFFS forum.

 

Good luck with your claim.

[horsemad1]

Hello,

 

I have been reading with interest the threads for 'unenforceable credit agreements'. I took out a loan with Northern Rock in 2005 and after a while tried cancelling the payment protection insurance, to cut a long story short they cancelled the insurance and processed a new loan in 2007 with a different account no. I signed no credit agreement, I just have a letter telling me that I had a new loan for the new amount. Am I right in thinking that this debt may now be unenforceable as there is no credit agreement?

 

Also, if I send a letter asking for a copy of the credit agreement and they dont supply it, what should I do next? Any advice on how to proceed with this would be gratefully apreciated.

[WonderingHino]

Hi guyz,

 

I was just windering if anyone could help, i ve read alot of threads talking about unenforceable credit card agreements and loan agreements, and how to challenge them.

 

Does anyone know or can anyone give me any pointers as to if the same can be done with a mortgage agreement and how to go about this please.

[robert_harper_2000]

I'm pretty sure a mortgage isn't covered by the CCRA as it is above the threshold of 25k or sth -

[WonderingHino]

i read in the ccca2006 act that the threshold has been lifted hence causing lenders a bit of a worry....any ideas please

[andrew1]

Hi guyz,

 

I was just windering if anyone could help, i ve read alot of threads talking about unenforceable credit card agreements and loan agreements, and how to challenge them.

 

Does anyone know or can anyone give me any pointers as to if the same can be done with a mortgage agreement and how to go about this please.

 

Mortgage agreements are not regulated under the Consumer Credit Act, they are deemed exempt under s.16 of the CCA The Office of Fair Trading: Exempt agreements

 

I take it your mortgage is pre 2007?

 

One issue you might be worth looking into though is if you have had any top-up loans from your mortgage company throughout the period. IF you have then you might like to read up on Francis Bennions views (He drafted the 1974 Act) on Top-up loans and the effect they had as independent loans rather than just being merged into the original mortgage...takes some reading and analysis, but with a little tenacity and enthusiasm you might find some interesting pointers there.

[dolphinbaby]

hi eveyone,

i sent off my 1st letter requesting the credit agreement from hsbc with the £1 postal order. this was returned to me yesterday with an acknowlegdement of my request. The say i need to sign the letter to coresspond with their docs. ( they have none) but i need to find the template letter which states my right not to sign?

Help anyone?

[andrew1]

hi eveyone,

i sent off my 1st letter requesting the credit agreement from hsbc with the £1 postal order. this was returned to me yesterday with an acknowlegdement of my request. The say i need to sign the letter to coresspond with their docs. ( they have none) but i need to find the template letter which states my right not to sign?

Help anyone?

 

 

Beware about signing anything with your usual signature dolphinbaby, I'm not suggesting for one minute that anyone would be so low as to recreate a document which super-imposed your signature on it, but there are many thousands of people who watched Blue Peter - stick to using a signature if you have to use one which can't be recreated. Actually, as they have asked for a signature to correspond with one they already have write back and ask for a copy of that signature because you use numerous signatures - if they don't send it - they ain't got it - not a signature or the agreement No agreement - no debt!

 

DO NOT TRUST THEM AN INCH

[gyzmo]

Is this a hijack thread or something?

 

People, please start your own thread. There are 4 different requests on here from different people.

 

The information can also be found in the debt forum.

[Smarterchick]

I wonder if someone could take a look over my agreement for me and tell me if the interest is worked out correctly and whether it is felt this is unenforceable as it stands?

 

Thanks, I just can't work out the interest calculations as per agreement. This is my thread:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mortgages-secured-loans/199658-interest-rate-calculator.html

[gyzmo]

[Smarterchick]

 

 

Is that meant for me Gyzmo?

[freakyleaky]

Please start your own threads in the appropriate forums as pointed out by Gyzmo.

[Smarterchick]

Please start your own threads in the appropriate forums as pointed out by Gyzmo.

 

This thread is headed "Unenforceable agreements under the Consumer Credit Act" - that's what I posted about along with a question over interest on the agreement and I put a link to my thread as requested ..so I'm a little confused freakyleaky sir

[Battler]

Hi everyone ,

new to this so please bare with me if this has been asked before.

I sent off recorded delivery template letters to a few Credit cards that I started well before April 2007,asking for the agreements etc and enclosing a pound postal order with each.

None replied within the 12 working days. i have since sent a further template letter stating that the debt is not recognised and asking for acknowledgement.

 

Marbles have replied now saying they are unable to provide historic terms however have provided current terms and conditions.

 

Another says they are having difficulty providing archived info.

 

MBNA are still chasing via e mail and have still yet to acknowledge or reply to the recorded delivery template letters.

 

What action should I take if they continue to ignore the requests?

 

Any help great fully appreciated.

[freakyleaky]

This thread is headed "Unenforceable agreements under the Consumer Credit Act" - that's what I posted about along with a question over interest on the agreement and I put a link to my thread as requested ..so I'm a little confused freakyleaky sir

Do you not see the benefit of starting your own thread?

Do you not see the disadvantage of hijacking another thread?

Do you not see the confusion that arises when people are answering questions by multiple users on the same thread? (This is not directed to Battler by the way. I will move your post to your own thread shortly)

If everyone on the forums used other threads to post their questions on we would have much fewer threads but mass confusion.

Please start your own thread as previously asked.

Also have a read of the site rules regarding posting.

 

And ther really is no need to call me sir.

[Battler]

Dear all,

sorry for being a pillock , however only just started on this site and do not know where to start a thread. was just reading the site , and saw the entry which related to what i wanted to know.

I will soon get the hang of it though!!!

[freakyleaky]

Hi Battler. No worries it is easy to get lost.

 

You maybe best starting your own thread in General Debt Issues

 

just shout if you have trouble navigating the site.

[Smarterchick]

Hey, I apologise too..got confused with the thread title and thought it was a general thread, should have read it all...apologies...I did start my own thread though before hand and linked it, so I'll leave the description of being a 'Pillock' for the time being.. good luck stubs, thanks FL..

[gyzmo]

Is that meant for me Gyzmo?

 

Not specifically! I just found it funny that you posted on here a couple of minutes after my previous post! Sorry, my warped sense of humour.

 

I've said before that there are a large number of posts in the welcome thread asking about CCAs. I think more efective sign posting is required.

[freakyleaky]

 

I've said before that there are a large number of posts in the welcome thread asking about CCAs. I think more efective sign posting is required.

What would you suggest Gyzmo? I understand why people make a bee line for a thread entitled with a similar problem to their own but what can we do? The whole team are open to suggestions as it can be a nightmare some days having to move posts and create new threads for newbies who are still unsure of the forums.

[gyzmo]

I mention this because I put a post in the general forum about this very issue a few months ago, which seems to have gone largely unnoticed - here's the link:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-consumer-issues/189326-ccas-warning.html#post2040814

 

There are obviously guides to this and that, but it seems that people are either not bothering to look or do not know how to find them or are having having difficulty in doing so.

 

All I am saying is that there are a lot of people asking about this issue. There is also a lot of information on this subject already in existence.

 

Maybe a question box should open when people sign in or log in. It could ask why thet are posting, with various options such as "I want to know about CCAs" or "I bought goods online that are faulty". The user can then select the option and be taken to the most appropriate part of the forum where they can probably find what they want to know.

 

Just trying to make things easier for everyone - that's all.

[freakyleaky]

I totally agree with all the points you have mentioned there.

I will move your thread to the Questions and suggestions and flag it up for admin to have a look see what they can come up with.

 

I was not critisising you for mentioning this at all. I genuinely am interested in ways of sorting this problem.

 

Thank you.

[gyzmo]

No criticism seen. There's a questions and suggestions thread?