Statutory Demand - hand delivered after the 18 day limit.

[cheesysocks]

Dear all.

 

My wife has just told me about this, so it's possibly a damage reduction situation now. I don't know. She took out a loan, which I didn't know about, in 2002. (we were not married then). On Monday the 19th of August 2013 at 6 pm, there is a door knock and she receives a package. I was busy and thought nothing of it. Today she tells me about it.

 

BW Legal have sent her a bunch of confusing terminology which translates into give us £7000+ within 18 days from the date of this letter or we will bankrupt you. The letter was dated the 1st of August. Recieved the day AFTER the 18 day period and just before a bank holiday weekend. What a co-incidence.

 

As I write this I have no idea what she has done about this debt in the past. She tells me she once wrote making an offer, can't remember when this was, but it was never acknowledged. This may or may not have been over 6 years ago.

 

She has written back to them in the last couple of days. "I've sorted it!" is all she will say. I have no idea how. She seems not to have a copy of a letter.

 

Firstly, how does the letter being delivered late stand? There is no printed date stamp, no evidence of it's delivery date. She did write the date on the envelope when she read it though.

 

What next? I need more info from wife. Until then any pointers would be gratefully received.

 

Mike.

Edited August 25, 2013 by cheesysocks
removed medical reference

[intend]

first don't panic. More details required, experts will be along to help. OC will be needed and date of last payment, check if PPI on loan and if any charges can be reclaimed.

[renegadeimp]

Somethings not quite right. Im not one to judge but it seems your wife is hiding something.

 

Is this a loan/overdraft/mortgage etc? each has their own set of rules to follow.

[cheesysocks]

first don't panic. More details required, experts will be along to help. OC will be needed and date of last payment, check if PPI on loan and if any charges can be reclaimed.

 

Thanks for the reply but...

• what is "OC"?
  
• check if PPI on loan? You mean insurance I assume?
  
• Check with who if what charges can be reclaimed? The PPi?
  

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

This sounds like a Statutory Demand for Payment, the first step on the bankruptcy ladder.

 

Which company sent this 'package'?

 

A credit file check is essential asap.

 

Has there been any correspondence from debt collection agencies do you know?

 

This is potentially serious if this is what it appears to be then action was required to set aside the statutory demand, if not done then a BR petition will follow.

 

You need to get answers from your wife now.

[Wooks001]

OC = Original Creditor, who was the loan with.

PPI has been mis-sold loads of times, so there is a chance it can be claimed back.

Same with any life insurance sold with the loan.

 

So the guys on here can help you need to give as much info as possible e.g.

 

Date loan taken out

Who with

How long for

Date last payment made

Charges added by DCA's

 

Try and get the wife to talk about it and see if she has any paperwork.

These **** bags often don't have a leg to stand on, they just buy debts for pence and try it on to see if they can claim loads.

Chances are she has had threatening texts, calls, emails etc and is being bullied into paying.

 

You probably need to get a copy of the original agreement (£1) and a SAR (£10) which will give you all the information they hold on the loan.

[citizenB]

Yes, this does indeed sound like a statutory demand and it is not unusual for BW Legal to deliver these well after the date on the Letter.

 

Your word will be good enough for the date of service and if your wife is intending to set this aside, then she will be signing an affidavit to say when the Stat Demand came into her possession.

 

Wooks as asked some questions if could answer them, then perhaps we can help your wife perhaps get this set aside.

 

If you do a search on CAG for Stat Demand, in the Legal Success forums then you will see pretty much what you need to do.

 

There are plenty of people on CAG who will be able to advise, if your wife wants our help.. just ask.

[The Mould]

Ask your wife if any valid statutory default notice pursuantto s.87(1) ever been served on her.

Ask your wife if any ppi on this account/debt?

Tell your wife that she needs to be open and honest with youas regards this claimed debt under the statutory demand.

Has your wife ever made a CCA Request pursuant to s.77/78 ofthe Consumer Credit Act 1974 (as amended) to this creditor?

Come back and confirm all of the above, thank you in advancefor your response and please understand that we can only provide ouradvice/opinion on this matter as regards your/your wife’s full response to thesame.

Kind regards

The Mould

[cheesysocks]

Evening again.

 

Thanks for all your replies. I really appreciate you all bothering to help.

 

I've been out at work (yes, on a Sunday afternoon) and just come back in. Wife has told me a bit more. It was a loan from the Bank of Scotland. Not a mortgage, just a standard unsecured loan. At the moment I have no idea if there was PPI. I doubt we'll find the original docs. Contacting HBOS will give this answer.

 

No idea about the statutory default notice pursuant to s.87(1).

 

She has never asked anyone for a CCA request.

 

Reading more into the letter it says...

 

BWLegal Debt Recovery Solicitors, are the company the letter is from.

Their client it Lowell Portfolio 1 Ltd.

Original creditor HBOS PLC.

£7,217.10p

 

The letter says all correspondence to them. What about writing to courts etc? I assume they're trying to scare you off of contacting others?

 

It then says "With this letter you will have been served with a Statutory Demand...". Then there are scary words for nearly 2/3rds of a page telling us what bankcruptcy might mean to you.

 

Having thrown in the scare, it says it is possible to avoid this by a "realistic settlement offer".

 

Now the biggie. A copy of the letter will be forthcoming, but my wife has written making an offer. I don't yet know the details, she used a standard letter she got from somewhere. Does this negate any 6 year Statute Bar, something a set aside might have come from?

 

Mike.

Edited August 25, 2013 by cheesysocks
Added further info.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

It just had to be Lowell!!

 

What has she done so far?

 

Get credit reference file NOW!!

 

DO NOT look at offers of payment DO NOT contact anyone yet!

 

When was any payment or acknowledgment in writing made on this, this is VERY important!!

[renegadeimp]

Theyve offered a discount too so its guaranteed to be a lemon debt.

[The Mould]

Evening again.

 

Thanks for all your replies. I really appreciate you all bothering to help.

 

I've been out at work (yes, on a Sunday afternoon) and just come back in. Wife has told me a bit more. It was a loan from the Bank of Scotland. Not a mortgage, just a standard unsecured loan. At the moment I have no idea if there was PPI. I doubt we'll find the original docs. Contacting HBOS will give this answer.

 

No idea about the statutory default notice pursuant to s.87(1).

 

She has never asked anyone for a CCA request.

 

Reading more into the letter it says...

 

BWLegal Debt Recovery Solicitors, are the company the letter is from.

Their client it Lowell Portfolio 1 Ltd.

Original creditor HBOS PLC.

£7,217.10p

 

The letter says all correspondence to them. What about writing to courts etc? I assume they're trying to scare you off of contacting others?

 

It then says "With this letter you will have been served with a Statutory Demand...". Then there are scary words for nearly 2/3rds of a page telling us what bankcruptcy might mean to you.

 

Having thrown in the scare, it says it is possible to avoid this by a "realistic settlement offer".

 

Now the biggie. A copy of the letter will be forthcoming, but my wife has written making an offer. I don't yet know the details, she used a standard letter she got from somewhere. Does this negate any 6 year Statute Bar, something a set aside might have come from?

 

Mike.

 

What has your wife offered to settle this debt?

 

Kind regards

 

The Mould

[fkofilee]

It just had to be Lowell!!

 

What has she done so far?

 

Get credit reference file NOW!!

 

DO NOT look at offers of payment DO NOT contact anyone yet!

 

When was any payment or acknowledgement in writing made on this, this is VERY important!!

 

Once Again Lowell trying to pull their weight, The guys here will help you Cheesysocks. I think a complaint to the OFT / Ombudsman is in order regarding what they have given you after all this is over... Information that is given out has to clear and precise to the point of where anyone can read it and understand it...

I know your priorities are in getting this sorted at the moment and i Respect that.

 

Check Noddle EF and Experian for credit info, etc... That way you can see if it is past the 6 year SB period

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Lowell are once again using the BR system as a method of debt collection, before exhausting all others, a breach of OFT Guidance.

 

Get the information asked for in post 10# then we can tackle this head on.

[cheesysocks]

Good evening all.

 

Apologies for length of time to respond, I know you're taking your personal time to help.

 

I have the original agreement, there's a surprise. It is a "Creation Personal Loan" from the Bank of Scotland. To my wife in her maiden name at this address, dated 20th March 2001. It was a £4000 loan, £1227.60 BOS Creditcare Bronze , £2711.60 interest at 17.8% and a total of 7939.20 to repay.

 

I have letters from BOS starting Jan 2002 where she was defaulting. FYI her husband had left her and she was alone and struggling financially. The loan was for living expenses, not fancy clothes etc.

 

Default notice under s87(1) of the CCA 74 issued to her on the 3rd of Feb 2002. At that time it was £301 in arrears.

 

J&J collections started writing to her in March 2002. £50 admin charge added.

 

Blair, Oliver and Scott started contacting in May 2002. They accepted an offer of £1 a month in March and again in August of 2002.

 

We were married early 2005. I have never been involved in her finances, they have always been personal to her. I respected her privacy.

 

She believes the £1 payments were continued until approx. the end of 2008. Early in 2009 she became very ill, was given a 20% chance to live and survived life changing surgery. (Ulcerative Colitis.) Was in hospital for about 12 weeks and it was a full year before the physical scars really closed. During this time I discovered some stuff about her finances but not this.

 

There are no further letters regarding this debt we are aware of.

 

The letter she has sent to BWLegal Says...

 

I have received advice from Consumer Credit Counselling Service to help solve

my debt problem.

 

I am in financial difficulties and cannot meet my payments. I will make a

monthly payment of whatever I can afford until more money is available.

 

I have enclosed my monthly budget and list of creditors. After paying bill I

can pay you X each month and will tell you when my circumstances change.

 

Please consider reducing or stopping interest during the difficulties.

 

I am trying to get an Experian Credit Report but it keeps saying "there is a problem." Will try others but I want to post this. What exactly is it I need to know from this report that will help?

 

Mike.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

So let be clear NO payment or written acknowledgment in 6 clear years on this debt?????

[Wooks001]

The credit report will give you a list of your wife's debts and who currently owns them.

There is a chance that this loan is statue barred or very close to it, it really does depend when the last payment was made. Try and dig out old bank statements etc, anything which will confirm this.

DCA's can get quite agressive when the date is close, cos they lose any legal options and the debtor can just say not paying - statute barred.

 

If you are having problems with experian try noddle, it's not quite as up to date but it is free.

[cheesysocks]

Good morning one and all.

 

Wooks, thanks for the Noddle tip. This morning I got a Noddle report and Wife was pleasantly shocked to see she rated 4/5.

 

Listed under loans are our current mortgage (up to date) and her bank account with Barclays, balance of £0 and solid green for the last 6 years. Nothing else.

 

There are 4 accounts under closed. One old mortgage (settled) and three that look like shoe shops or something, all with £0 balance.

 

Nowhere can I see anything else.

 

Regarding the last payment date, she tells me that she paid by sending a cheque each month. Somewhere in the loft she says she has her old records. Hmmm, I see difficulty in determining this. I have told her to contact her bank urgently to find out. Maybe better by contacting Blair Oliver & Scott.

 

Regarding Brigadiers query about contact, I can find no letters to her since 2002, she claims to have not contacted them, but she HAS WRITTEN in the last few days, as I said in my last post. Getting info is like blood from a stone. If the last cheque payment of £1 was at the end of 2008 then it was last acknowledged about 5 years ago. But this has to be confirmed.

 

I have to go to work so I won't be able to reply here until tonight. I hope she gets her finger out and contacts the bank to confirm.

 

Again, thanks to one and all for any help.

 

Mike.

[cheesysocks]

Lowell are once again using the BR system as a method of debt collection, before exhausting all others, a breach of OFT Guidance.

 

Hi Brigadier. Can you advise me where I might find this guidance? Thanks.

 

Mike.

[cheesysocks]

One last thing before I go to work. PPI was mentioned. Is there any claim on this even though the insurance was paid to the insurer by the loan company, BOS?

 

Mike.

[renegadeimp]

If theres a clear 6 year period with no payment and written acknowledgement of the account, then the debt is statute barred.

 

It makes no difference if she wrote a few days ago, once the debt is statute barred, nothing can un-sb it. Not even a judge.

[cheesysocks]

Me again, the bad penny. Long day at work but glad to be back here!

 

Wife has contacted the bank today to try and find out when the last payment was. It's starting to look awkward, the bank have told her that they can't refer to records that far back and she hasn't got the old cheque book stubs to refer to. Also, she has sent a payment of £10 to them with the letter I referred to earlier. I need to know if there is a 6 year gap and the only people who would know would be Blair Oliver and Scott as they were the receivers of the cheques. Letter to them to be written tonight. Any standard letter I should use?

 

If it's less than 6 years (she thinks she last paid Blair Oliver and Scott near the end of 2008, 5 years ago) and therefore not statute barred what is the next step to prevent them causing full Bankruptcy proceedings? Standing Order for a fixed amount maybe?

 

Thanks again.

 

Mike.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

OFT Guidance on Debt Collection 2003/2006 updated NOV.2012 section 3.7 (n). (physical/psychological harassment)>

'making undue, excessive or otherwise inappropriate use of statutory demands when pursuing arrears or debts'.

e.g. when a debtor has no realisable assets.

[Wooks001]

Personally I'd cancel the cheque, she only paid under duress.

I think you need to send a SAR to ascertain the last date payment was made, let them prove the debt is still collectable.

I think it costs £400 to apply for bancruptcy , so they aren't going to do this unless they think they can collect.

You mentioned earlier that she had written saying that she could only pay a proportional amount to each creditor, but at the same time you say her credit file is clear.

Have I missed something or does she have more old debts to deal with.

[cheesysocks]

Evening Wooks and all.

 

I'm thinking a SAR to Blair Oliver and Scott to get the account of payments made from 2002 to 2008. We still don't know if it's Statute Barred or not. Also a SAR to BWLegal (Lowells) to 1, slow down the proceedings for up to 40 days and hope they haven't the full info. Comments?

 

Cancelling the cheque. Not sure about this. What if it is not Statute Barred, would this make it look bad in front of any courts?

 

Regarding old debts, another letter turned up this morning. Sigh, is there no end? This time it's Bryan Carter on behalf of Lowell Financial Ltd on behalf of Fredrikson International. No mention of original debt, £1541.66. Threats of court and solicitor fees and interest "Should proceedings be issued." Just now I have no idea what it is for or how old the debt is. Another SAR. At £10 each I guess it might be cheaper to pay them!

 

Brigadier, thanks for the OFT guidance. I'll add that to the SAR and see what happens.

 

Mike.