Harlands!

[mih3y]

Hello guys!

 

Long story short.

 

I've been on holiday and spent too much, so when they tried to take money from my account it failed for obvious reason:-D

 

And i did not know about it. So now i received a letter from Harlands saying i need to pay extra 25£.

I dont mind paying for my gym ( i cancelled my contract anyway this is going to be my last payment)

But i dont want to pay extra charges.and since they have sent the letter to wrong address (i moved) i haven't seen it and i believe that by tomorrow i will have extra charges, cause i haven't paid that 25£

can i just ignore harlands and pay my membership in the gym by cash? will that affect my credit score or any other problems i might have? thx.

[renegadeimp]

Ignore the silly charge they have added. It is unlawful and unenforceable.

[slick132]

Hi Mih3y and welcome to CAG

 

How did you cancel the m/ship - eg by phone call, in person, by letter or email.

 

In any event, make sure you cancel the m/ship agreement properly by giving them a clear month's notice as required or they'll be chasing you for this as well.

 

As Imp says above, Harlands admin fee of £25 is nonsense and is an unenforceable penalty, despite what they'll try to tell you.

 

Write to them just once, telling them you have cancelled on xxdate and your last DD payment will be paid on xxdate, after which you will cancel the DD mandate direct with your bank. also tell them their admin fee will not be paid as it is an unenforceable penalty.

 

Let us know how they respond and we'll offer further help if needed.

 

[mih3y]

Hi Mih3y and welcome to CAG

 

How did you cancel the m/ship - eg by phone call, in person, by letter or email.

 

hello!

 

In person, had to sign a few papers, saying that i want to cancel membership cause i am relocating and now it's to far for me to travel. They only asked for a proof. so i gave them my new land line bill. and they where happy. they did told me that i will have to pay one more time, and i will do that in a week time, since now i got no money but i think in a week time them harlands bastard will send me a few more letters with extra charges.

 

and another reason why i did not know about that failed payment is because i could still access the gym. You need to miss two payments for them to restrict access.

[slick132]

Hi Mih,

 

As long as you pay the final fee, that should be all you owe.

 

However, Harlands will probably see things differently and may say:-

 

a) They have never rec'd confirmation about the cancellation; or you can only cancel through them, not the gym; or it must be sent to them in writing; etc.

 

b) They accept the cancellation but they require payment of £xx in their admin fees or their admin fees will increase.

 

Let them charge all the admin fees they want - they are not enforceable and can be ignored.

 

Pay the final month's fee and let us know what Harlands do next.

 

[mih3y]

Hello!

 

My debt is now 149.98.

And in their last letter to me it says - Under you rmembership agreement you have promised to pay this debt, if you continue to refuse to honour that commitment we will have no option but to take further steps to collect the outstanding balance.

[slick132]

Hi Mih3y,

 

Did you make the last DD payment as discussed above ?

 

If so, you owe them nothing more.

 

I would write to Harlands saying :-

 

I cancelled my gym membership and have no idea why you are now demanding large amounts from me. Accordingly, this matter is in clear dispute.

 

Please provide me with a breakdown of how you arrive at the sum demanded of £149.98.

 

If you continue to make demands while the matter is in dispute, I will make a formal complaint to The OFT.

 

[mih3y]

It's been a while.

 

Hi guys.

 

Long time ago I did say to Harlands that I have paid my last bill, so i do not know what they are charging me for. And the calls stoped. BUT

 

 

 

Now a year after i've got a call from Zinc group saying that i need to pay £851 because i terminated my contract.

 

The amount is so big because first Harlands tried to contact me and now Zinc.

 

I've never spoke to them(zinc) before.

 

 

I do not mind paying something,since i believe it was my fault (because I've cancelled DD), but not £851!! that way to much.

 

Is there a way how i can negotiate and lower this amount?

 

On the phone i said i do not mind to pay in instalments. They said they will give me 50% discount if ill pay it now. or i have to pay 850 if i pay in instalments.

 

What is the best thing to do?

 

Thank you guys! Sorry for my Ingleso

[renegadeimp]

Tell zinc that there is no debt, or simply ignore them. They cant do anything.

[mih3y]

Hi! Thanks for your reply. I Guess my credit score is bad anyway, so ill just ignore them.

 

Zinc said to me that because there was no confirmation from my Gym,that my contract was terminated.

 

i asked to provide a breakdown of the £850. answer was something like "charges here charges there".

[slick132]

Hi Mih,

 

Did you send the letter in post #7 above ? Was there any reply from Harlands.

 

If you start trying to negotiate, Zinc will see this as weakness and take advantage.

 

Did you call Zinc - if so, do not do this again as it'll get you nowhere !!

 

Reply to Zinc saying :-

 

I wrote to Harlands setting out my position clearly in September 2013.

 

If they wanted to pursue this matter, they should not have waited 9 months to do so.

 

I will not be paying anything further to Harlands, CRS or Zinc and, if you contact me again, I will make formal complaints to Trading Standards.

 

[mih3y]

Hi!

 

I called Harlands long time ago,and said everything you suggested,and they stopped sending me letters.

 

But now suddenly its Zinc that is after me, and they want a lot more money.

 

 

sending and email to Zinc is fine? Or it should be a written letter ?

 

 

They called me, and i picked up. Apparently they called me before, but i do not call back to unknown numbers , so i had no idea who was calling.

 

 

Thank you so much!

[slick132]

Hi Mih,

 

Good, keep everything in writing only, so you have a record of all that's said. If Harlands, CRS or Zinc call you, tell the " In writing only !! ", then hang up.

 

An email to Zinc will be fine and let us know how they respond.

 

[muldy]

Hi mih3y

 

I have had some success with a recent set aside application in connection with Harlands/CRS.

 

I may be able to help.

 

If you can provide me with any letters (redacted of course of any personal data)

 

I will have a look and see if I can help?I the meantime,

 

I would not communicate with Zinc.

 

Harlands use intimidation as a form of debt recovery and reckon that if they make it sound good enough, then yo will pay up.

Its intimidation tactics.

 

You may like to know that Harlands have since had to sign an undertaking not to use, or seek to reply upon terms that are unfair or unreasonable.

 

Have you had any letters from Harlands which suggest that they have had the debt assigned to anyone else?

 

If not - then Zinc are only acting as agents working on behalf of Harlands to recover the alleged debt owed

 

.If this is the case then Harlands still own the debt - not Zinc.

 

If you would like to post up the redacted docs or email them to me.

 

I will have a look.

 

Muldy

[muldy]

Hi Mih3yAnother thought...can you also tell me when the contract was taken out originally?This is quite important as to how we deal with any reponse to Harlands.ThanksMuldy

[mih3y]

Hi, where can i find your email address ? ) Thank you

[muldy]

Hi mih3ymy email address is: removed.

 

Send me what you have so far...but please block out any personal details b4 sending - I also need to know when the contract was taken out - when you cancelled your m/ship and how this was done. Thanks. Muldy

Edited June 20, 2014 by slick132

[slick132]

Hi Muldy,

 

No emails please on posts.

 

We prefer to keep everything on the open forum as far as possible unless there are specific reasons to keep something off.

 

Remember, we've been dealing with gym cases here for the last 8 years and we've had a whole lot of experience with Harlands in particular.

 

Send the email in post #11 and let us know how they respond.

 

[citizenB]

OP could redact documents and post on thread ?

[slick132]

Thanks CitB but probably not necessary at this stage.

 

[muldy]

Hi Mike

 

I have now had chance to have a read thro of the emails that you received.

 

I would reply (preferably in writing and sent by recorded delivery (if Slick etc concur with this as well) so that the buggers cant say that they never received your letter- and emails can go walkies too) - with something like this:

 

>

I refer to three emails from you the most recent one in March 2014 indicating that you were in the process of passing the matter onto Complete Credit Consultancy.

 

Please note that I do not recognise the alleged debt.

 

This debt is in dispute and while it is, under current debt recovery legislation you may not continue with ANY debt recovery procedures, whether that be by email, letter, door-step collection or otherwise. Further correspondence in any format would then be considered harassment, and would then be contrary to the Malicious Communications Act 1988.

 

I notified the gym in good faith in order to cancel my membership as I could no longer attend the gym as I was moving more than 15 miles away from it, therefore making it impractical to continue with my membership.

 

The gym asked me proof of this and completed the relevant forms to comply with this request.

 

I have copies of these documents as proof of this.

 

I wrote to Harlands setting out my position clearly in September 2013. If they wanted to pursue this matter, they should not have waited 9 months to do so.

 

I understand that CRS is the company who you are acting on behalf of. If this is the case than Zinc are only acting as debt recovery "agents" to recover the alleged debt and therefore do not own it.

 

Legally you cannot enforce a debt unless you own it. The debt would have to be assigned,

 

Please provide documentary proof that you have had the debt assigned. If you cannot then please do not write to me further regarding the alleged debt.

 

I will not be paying any monies to Zinc and if you contact me again, I will make formal complaints to Trading Standards and the Financial Conduct Authority.

 

Point of note - I am aware that with effect from 10 September 2013 Harlands (CRS is the debt recovery arm and trading name of Harlands and reside in the same building) have had to sign an undertaking with the OFT to avoid enforcement proceedings.

 

That undertaking states that:

 

The Company (Harlands) will not, (whether by its officers, employees, or agents or otherwise) continue or repeat that conduct which is described in paragraphs 1 to 5 below.

 

Namely:

 

1. Using, relying upon or seeking to enforce any of the following or similar unfair terms which, contrary to the UTCCRs:

 

a. ties in a member for a minimum membership period of longer than 12 months.

 

b. ties in a member for a minimum membership period without entitling members to terminate the contract should they supply reasonable documentary evidence of:

 

i. having, for reasons beyond that member’s reasonable control, lost their job; or

 

ii. having moved house to a location which is more than 15 miles from the nearest gym operated by the same operator; or…

 

v. any other change in their personal circumstances, beyond their control, to such an extent that it is no longer reasonable for a member to use their club’s facilities or to remain a member.

 

Only Paragraph 1 is relevant here in this matter.

 

Please note reference to section 1 and 1(b)(ii)

 

Therefore, from this point forward I will not enter into further correspondence with Zinc regarding this matter - unless you can provide documentary proof that you have had the alleged debt assigned - and will ONLY discuss this matter further direct with CRS.

 

Please reply within 7 days upon receipt of this letter that this matter is being returned back to CRS.

 

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

>

 

Have a go with this and see how you get on.

 

- Slick can you have a read thro and see what you think?

 

Andy

Edited June 24, 2014 by muldy
no returns or spacing

[citizenB]

muldy, can you please edit your post to include some paragraphs ?

 

If you click on the "double A" at the right hand side of the post and use the "Go advanced" button as well, you should have no problems. Entering carriage return twice, is another away of formatting a post correctly.

[slick132]

Hi Mih,

 

With respect to Muldy, this is way too long and will just encourage Harlands to make a lengthy reply picking holes in each and every point you make.

 

I still say you should send a minimal reply as per my suggestion in post #13. If you want to add one further paragraph to it, you could say :-

 

I wrote to Harlands setting out my position clearly in September 2013.

 

If they wanted to pursue this matter, they should not have waited 9 months to do so.

 

I will not be paying anything further to Harlands, CRS or Zinc and, if you contact me again, I will make formal complaints to Trading Standards.

 

I am fully aware of the undertakings given by Harlands/CRS to the OFT in 2013 which enabled The OFT to close it's investigations into Harlands' membership agreements, and Harlands' modus operandi. If Zinc contact me again, you will be included in any complaint made to Trading Standards.

 

[muldy]

Hi Slick...

 

Comments noted...and no im not offended! lol That takes a lot to do that!

 

I was just trying to cover every angle so that Zinc havent got anything to come back with. Once they see that they cant argue with it - they will return it back to CRS.

 

That was the idea anyway...

 

Muldy