My benefits are suspended while I am investigated for benefit fraud - what happens next?

[tomtom256]

How about a case then where someone started to set up a business from scratch whilst claiming JSA, AND having notified the jobcentre each signing on day of the hours worked and NET income earned.

 

This went on for about 13 months until the claimant decided to go for it and he signed off.

 

6 months later during a bad spell of no income he signed on again, but didn't close the business down. This second claim lasted approx. 7 weeks when it was then closed down.

 

Fast forward 3+ years, business is doing well when he hears that his clients are being targeted by the DWP asking questions about their dealings with the claimant over the past 5 years. His clients either refuse to talk to the DWP and/or give away little if any info.

 

After 12 months of hearing of these attempts by the DWP to get people to talk, he is taken out of his bed at 5 am, arrested, taken to the police station and kept there for 10 hours. His home & garage, office and car were 'turned over' completely.

 

He stood accused of failing to notify the DWP of the correct amount of earnings each week/fortnight. They said that his actual earnings exceeded his JSA each and every week.

 

Result, the claimant was told that there were no charges to answer as the DWP had miscalculated his income, they assumed his gross fees were his income, whereas it is the net figure that they should have used.

 

So yes they do 'turn over' people like this for a simple failure to notify.

 

That case you mention if it exists is different to a living together case and still is not the normal way the DWP investigate.

 

Do a FOI regarding arrests and you will see it is something they shy away from, although a trial was had earlier in the year to see if raids helped cases, however as stated it is not common practise unless serious and organised are involved.

 

A local FIS team do not routinely do this.

 

Let me have the details of the case and I will look it up on FRAIMS on Monday morning.

[jadeybags]

How about a case then where someone started to set up a business from scratch whilst claiming JSA, AND having notified the jobcentre each signing on day of the hours worked and NET income earned.

 

This went on for about 13 months until the claimant decided to go for it and he signed off.

 

6 months later during a bad spell of no income he signed on again, but didn't close the business down. This second claim lasted approx. 7 weeks when it was then closed down.

 

Fast forward 3+ years, business is doing well when he hears that his clients are being targeted by the DWP asking questions about their dealings with the claimant over the past 5 years. His clients either refuse to talk to the DWP and/or give away little if any info.

 

After 12 months of hearing of these attempts by the DWP to get people to talk, he is taken out of his bed at 5 am, arrested, taken to the police station and kept there for 10 hours. His home & garage, office and car were 'turned over' completely.

 

He stood accused of failing to notify the DWP of the correct amount of earnings each week/fortnight. They said that his actual earnings exceeded his JSA each and every week.

 

Result, the claimant was told that there were no charges to answer as the DWP had miscalculated his income, they assumed his gross fees were his income, whereas it is the net figure that they should have used.

 

So yes they do 'turn over' people like this for a simple failure to notify.

 

Pretty sure that guy went to prison for it? Or maybe I am mixing this story up with another...

[Ladychubbs]

That's wasn't the answer we where looking for...

 

You not told us if you had a letter from dwp/local council asking you to attend a "Interview under caution" and did not go ended up with you been arrested at a later date.

 

You wont tell anyone what type of benefits you where receiving before payments where suspend !

 

And not told us how long has your boyfriend has been living with you for !

 

 

DWP and Local council has a duty in law to protected tax payers money and do suspended payments pending criminal investigation and prosecution,they must have a lot of evidence then in your case.

 

You clearly have some think to Hide and it will be just a waist of time asking you any more questions and wont be surprised if some fellow CAG member feel the same....

 

I have replied numerous times I was on income support, housing benefit and council tax benefit. I did attend an interview under caution and my boyfriend doesn't live with me. He stays over but he has his own place. I have nothing to hide. If you want to make me feel worse just carry on being rude. Other wise don't bother commenting. Thank you.

Edited July 21, 2013 by Ladychubbs

[Ros1609]

I'm not 100% clear about this because since I split with my ex husband I've not had another partner but I seem to remember that when I started claiming Income Support I was told there were rules about new relationships/partners staying over and it was best to inform the DWP before they found out of their own accord. If your boyfriend has been staying over a lot then maybe they feel there is more to your relationship and he is supporting you in some way?

[tokenfield]

I'm not 100% clear about this because since I split with my ex husband I've not had another partner but I seem to remember that when I started claiming Income Support I was told there were rules about new relationships/partners staying over and it was best to inform the DWP before they found out of their own accord. If your boyfriend has been staying over a lot then maybe they feel there is more to your relationship and he is supporting you in some way?

 

Conversely another case that is current and NOT under enquiry. DWP are aware and have accepted that they are NOT living together.

 

Mum and 3 children live alone being supported by the father via CSA and receiving IS, HB & CTB.

 

Mum & children's father want to make another go of it but neither want a full on relationship.

 

Her ex (the children's' father) has his own property, pays all of the bills - Council Tax, Mortgage etc.

He spends every night with her in her house and goes to his home in the morning. He works from home in his own house.

 

Other than the payments he makes to the CSA there is no financial connection whatsoever with her. His name is not featured on any bill, invoice, bank account etc showing her address.

 

In other words 95% of the relationship is purely a sexual one.

 

The DWP have investigated but cannot find any evidence that would support the fact that they are actually living together.

[tokenfield]

That case you mention if it exists is different to a living together case and still is not the normal way the DWP investigate.

 

Do a FOI regarding arrests and you will see it is something they shy away from, although a trial was had earlier in the year to see if raids helped cases, however as stated it is not common practise unless serious and organised are involved.

 

A local FIS team do not routinely do this.

 

Let me have the details of the case and I will look it up on FRAIMS on Monday morning.

 

 

I would agree that it is slightly different. But I can assure you that that case actually exists.

I replied because of what you said earlier:

 

That is nothing like a normal DWP investigation unless the serious and organised team are invovled. It certainly is not normal for a living together investigation.

 

Working and claiming benefit isn't the crime of the century either.

 

My personal involvement in this case was that it went to the tribunal who agreed that the DWP should be looking at the NET income, not the gross turnover and that there was no overpayment involved.

 

Obviously it is fairly obvious why the police were brought in - the DWP were coming up against a brick wall every time they thought that could get their evidence from one of his clients. The evidence they wanted and needed was clearly only going to be found in his home or office hence the police action and a search warrant.

However he did frustrate that attempt in that he lived in a large village and he was being kept up to date with what the DWP were doing and who they were approaching. He removed, weeks earlier, all of his records and files, downloaded and copied all of his data off his computer, boxing it up including the computer and moving it all to his solicitors office. What they did find was of no real use despite hours of searching the various properties.

 

As the case progressed, he appealed against the overpayment decision and using the evidence he held that the DWP had not seen, won the case.

 

Obviously I will not disclose any personal information on here other than to say that the DWP investigating officer was a guy called Neil Webb based in the North West.

[Ladychubbs]

I'm not 100% clear about this because since I split with my ex husband I've not had another partner but I seem to remember that when I started claiming Income Support I was told there were rules about new relationships/partners staying over and it was best to inform the DWP before they found out of their own accord. If your boyfriend has been staying over a lot then maybe they feel there is more to your relationship and he is supporting you in some way?

I had already told them in a interview earlier in the year.

Thank you.

[45002]

I have replied numerous times I was on income support, housing benefit and council tax benefit. I did attend an interview under caution and my boyfriend doesn't live with me. He stays over but he has his own place. I have nothing to hide.If you want to make me feel worse just carry on being rude. Other wise don't bother commenting. Thank you.

 

I had already told them in a interview earlier in the year.

Thank you.

 

But only just told everyone what benefits you where getting !

Edited July 21, 2013 by 45002

[Ladychubbs]

Conversely another case that is current and NOT under enquiry. DWP are aware and have accepted that they are NOT living together.

 

Mum and 3 children live alone being supported by the father via CSA and receiving IS, HB & CTB.

 

Mum & children's father want to make another go of it but neither want a full on relationship.

 

Her ex (the children's' father) has his own property, pays all of the bills - Council Tax, Mortgage etc.

He spends every night with her in her house and goes to his home in the morning. He works from home in his own house.

 

Other than the payments he makes to the CSA there is no financial connection whatsoever with her. His name is not featured on any bill, invoice, bank account etc showing her address.

 

In other words 95% of the relationship is purely a sexual one.

 

The DWP have investigated but cannot find any evidence that would support the fact that they are actually living together.

That really helps. There is no evidence all all of my boyfriend paying anything here all my bills go out of my bank account. He doesn't give me a penny. When I am at his he pays.

I feel a little relief. Thank you very much.

[45002]

That really helps. There is no evidence all all of my boyfriend paying anything here all my bills go out of my bank account. He doesn't give me a penny. When I am at his he pays.

I feel a little relief. Thank you very much.

 

So how long is it now since All your benefits where 1st suspend ?

[firstclassx]

Copy or text of warrant, detailing reason(s) for raid please.

 

You can't be helped unless this sort of detail is forthcoming.

 

Have you been bailed, charged etc? If so, what offence(s)?

[Ladychubbs]

So how long is it now since All your benefits where 1st suspend ?

 

I last got income support and my rent paid on the 23rd May.

Thank you.

[kk3852]

Copy or text of warrant, detailing reason(s) for raid please.

 

There may not be a warrant- the property may have been searched under a Section 18 warrant where as long as a person in under arrest for an indictable offence the property under their control may be searched without a magistrates warrant. Once a person is under arrest, other linked properties may be searched on the authority of an inspector.

 

For tomtom - it is clear that you work as an investigator, however your experience appears to be at sector level. Other area teams, and not FIS(O), also undertake many arrests. To say that you will look at a case on Fraims is extremely foolish.

[Ladychubbs]

Copy or text of warrant, detailing reason(s) for raid please.

 

You can't be helped unless this sort of detail is forthcoming.

 

Have you been bailed, charged etc? If so, what offence(s)?

 

I was bailed til the 21st June which I attended with my solicitor, I was told then that a decision has still not been reached. I haven't been charged. My warrant is really difficult to read as the person didn't press on hard enough with their pen I've tried to copy it but you can't see anything. It says the reason for the search was to gain evidence of benefit fraud, paperwork, bank statements and other documentation.

I'm new to this kind of site so I am quite slow.

The reason for my arrest was for suspicion of benefit fraud.

Thank you.

Also they didn't take my bank statements as they show I pay all my own bills.

I have been discharged for summons! Whatever that means.

Edited July 21, 2013 by Ladychubbs

[Ladychubbs]

There may not be a warrant- the property may have been searched under a Section 18 warrant where as long as a person in under arrest for an indictable offence the property under their control may be searched without a magistrates warrant. Once a person is under arrest, other linked properties may be searched on the authority of an inspector.

 

For tomtom - it is clear that you work as an investigator, however your experience appears to be at sector level. Other area teams, and not FIS(O), also undertake many arrests. To say that you will look at a case on Fraims is extremely foolish.

 

Hi and Thank you, they did have a warrant from a magistrates court.

[kk3852]

I was bailed til the 21st March which I attended with my solicitor,

 

Were you released from bail in March? Or did they give you another date to go back.. if they released you from bail the next thing that you should will likely to be a decision from the decision maker to say if they think you have been overpaid benefit or not. This can take some time unfortunately but you could always ring the investigator to find out if and when the paperwork was sent off for a decision

[Ladychubbs]

Were you released from bail in March? Or did they give you another date to go back.. if they released you from bail the next thing that you should will likely to be a decision from the decision maker to say if they think you have been overpaid benefit or not. This can take some time unfortunately but you could always ring the investigator to find out if and when the paperwork was sent off for a decision

 

Hi sorry I was bailed to reappear on 21 June not March. I can't believe I put that but I am slightly puddled at the mo. I haven't been given another date to go back. I haven't had anything from the decision maker yet. I will ring the investigating officer tomorrow.

Thank you.

[snailz]

Hi sorry I was bailed to reappear on 21 June not March. I can't believe I put that but I am slightly puddled at the mo. I haven't been given another date to go back. I haven't had anything from the decision maker yet. I will ring the investigating officer tomorrow.

Thank you.

 

Any updates on this? X

[Ladychubbs]

I have now been told I Owe £66.000. Overpayment and I'm still getting no money. I've had a repossession order on my home! Am appealing but that isn't paying my rent! This is so wrong.

[honeybee13]

I have now been told I Owe £66.000. Overpayment and I'm still getting no money. I've had a repossession order on my home! Am appealing but that isn't paying my rent! This is so wrong.

 

Hello there.

 

I'm not being facetious, but would you mind confirming how much they think the overpayment is please? I read it as £66 because of the full stop, but maybe you mean £66k.

 

My best, HB

[jadeybags]

Hello there.

 

I'm not being facetious, but would you mind confirming how much they think the overpayment is please? I read it as £66 because of the full stop, but maybe you mean £66k.

 

My best, HB

 

I took it as 66k Honeybee. Awful situation to be in Ladychubbs

[seanamarts]

Surely you can appeal this.

 

When your BF came to stay, did you inform them on the nights he stayed?

 

 

Unfortunately to the benefits agency having someone to stay is classed as a change of circumstance and they must be informed of this asap. Any adult whether it being your BF, parents, carers, older children or even friend down for a holiday that stays with you, you have to inform them of this. Its ridiculous I know, but I suppose they see it as, its their money and they want to know what it is being spent on etc and if anyone has contributed towards any of the bills, including food.

[Ladychubbs]

Hello there.

 

I'm not being facetious, but would you mind confirming how much they think the overpayment is please? I read it as £66 because of the full stop, but maybe you mean £66k.

 

My best, HB

 

Hi HB

Yes it is almost seventy thousand pounds. They say it is five years overpayment of Income supprt Housing benefit and council tax! I have been seeing my BF for four years and he doesn't even live here. I stayed it his for four nights last week. Yes I am appealing. They have stopped all my benefits I haven't payed any rent for nearly three months.

 

Thank you.

[seanamarts]

Do you know what evidence they have on you that makes them think that you are living together.

[Ladychubbs]

I took it as 66k Honeybee. Awful situation to be in Ladychubbs

 

Yes it's really getting me down. I've got two sons aged 21 and 17. My oldest has a disability so we already had it tough. My youngest is at college and I'm having to rely on my parents to give him bus fare. I should be looking after them not them looking after us.

 

Thank you.