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Hi,

Wanted some advice around being caught with a train ticket that had a false (future) date penciled over the original expiry of the ticket.

 

The person has been called into a police station for voluntary questioning about this. I suspect the police will want to know the facts, then decide whether there is sufficient evidence to potentially prosecute for fraud and have a court issue a summons. This interview with the police will take place over the next couple of weeks.

What are their options?

To admit liability to the police?

 

To hire a costly solicitor and maybe draft a letter to the train company to settle out of court if possible? (I know court is just a future possibility but I'd say highly likely).

 

How "fraudulent" will this be seen by the court? No previous convictions, can provide evidence of immediately prior to this incident of paying for monthly tickets for perhaps the last 5+ years via bank statement evidence.

 

What is the best course of action if this does go to court? Have them represent themselves, admit liability, show evidence this was truly a one-off and hope to get away with a fine + court costs?

Edited by type-r
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I take it this is BTP?

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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It might be, not 100% sure. I can let you know later. I do know the letter was just a plain letter, no headings, just a plain typed letter, which seemed a bit odd.

 

Will have to find out more info and get back to you.

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urm..

 

first time I've seen [unless I've missed it]

 

that BTP are requesting an interview.

 

urm......

 

hope the regulars pop in.

 

at a loss what to suggest.

 

though your thoughts IMHO are correct.

 

was it BTp that actually caught him them?/

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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No it was a ticket inspector. They said they would investigate and would let the person know. This is the first bit of correspondence since.

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Have they been told what charge(s) they may face?

 

I'd suggest a solicitor. An initial (free ?) consultation with a solicitor might be worth while before attending for interview : they might be able to advise on e.g. Legal aid eligibility, if it is worth attending with a solicitor, and if it worth "forcing their hand" regarding the charges they may face.

 

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/law_e/law_legal_system_e/law_taking_legal_action_e/help_with_legal_costs.htm#legal_aid_for_criminal_cases

 

They might be eligible for "advice and assistance" before the police station (/ interview) and during, if they qualify for legal aid.

 

If they don't qualify for legal aid, they are still entitled to free advice from a duty solicitor : but only at the police station.

Edited by BazzaS
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urm..

 

first time I've seen [unless I've missed it]

 

that BTP are requesting an interview.

 

urm......

 

hope the regulars pop in.

 

at a loss what to suggest.

 

though your thoughts IMHO are correct.

 

was it BTp that actually caught him them?/

 

dx

 

 

Either BTP or the TOC Revenue Protection staff are permitted to request the person reported attend a further interview under P.A.C.E conditions if it is considered that further investigation is required.

 

It will be up to the OP to decide whether they wish to comply with the request, but it would seem from the OPs post so far, the TOC or BTP will have already gathered sufficient evidence for a prosecution based on one fare avoided for the journey made when the alteration was detected.

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No letter from the TOC yet. Just a letter from the BTP requesting an interview at mutual convenience. Presumably the TOC has passed on information to police - who after the interview, will then decide to prosecute and decide the charge? Will the TOC then send a letter informing charge?

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No letter from the TOC yet. Just a letter from the BTP requesting an interview at mutual convenience. Presumably the TOC has passed on information to police - who after the interview, will then decide to prosecute and decide the charge? Will the TOC then send a letter informing charge?

 

If BTP, or police, are dealing with the case, the TOC won't be the prosecuting authority, it will be the CPS.

 

A TOC usually passes cases to the police which are complex, serious or otherwise worthy of police eyes.

 

On a personal level, cases that are passed to the BTP usually require a (CPS appointed) barrister, as they (should) end up in Crown Court. Perhaps your season ticket is worth a lot of money, or you've done it before (and been identified, but not caught etc).

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I would think carefully before attending this, especially if they do not have a copy of the ticket. It is voluntary and no obligation to attend. There is little point incriminating yourself before taking legal advice.

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Ok thanks for the replies.

 

The person does not have a copy of the ticket anymore as the inspector took it from their possession at the time of the incident. I am not sure as to the type of ticket it was - it would have either been a weekly or monthly, and therefore between £150 - £600 (estimated).

 

The person who was caught does have previous bank statements clearly showing that they had regularly purchased monthly and weekly tickets in the past. This can be shown as far back as 3 years.

 

This is a first time the person has ever been in any sort of trouble before (no priors etc). Would it be worthwhile still attending the voluntary interview with the police officer, to demonstrate this was a one-off offence given that a police-appointed solicitor will be in attendance? Any chance of them not taking it to court based off this interview from past experience? The person is going to admit they falsely dated the ticket to the police.

 

Cheers.

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I'd recommend attending and holding your hands up, more likely to end up with just a police simple caution if apologetic enough, and the ticket cost isn't too expensive.

 

If you don't turn up, next step will probably be a summons. At least if you turn up, even if you go "no comment", you can see what evidence/opinion they will have.

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