Interest on charging orders resulting from CCA 1974 Help ?

[cdmonkey]

This has been covered on another of my posts but the post got moved and not had many replies.

 

Recently had a response from Mortimer Clark saying yes we are allowed to add interest to the charging order they obtained via a ccj on a credit card debt to Marbles that was HFC

 

Attached is the letter which contains plenty of quoted cases but i have no idea if relevant and was pretty certain ths adding of interest was not allowed in this instance

 

Thanks

[citizenB]

They can only charge interest on the judgment debt if it was mentioned in the Judgment. Do you have a copy of the order that you would have received from the court at the time ?

[cdmonkey]

Yes i will dig it out tonight, just be clear we are talking about the CCJ not the charging order ?

 

Thanks

[citizenB]

Yep, the charging order.

 

I will also ask andyorch to look in on you. He will know for sure, but it would be good if you could dig out the Court Order.

[citizenB]

Some information for you.

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1991/1184/article/2/made

 

The link above says

 

 

3) Interest shall not be payable under this Order where the relevant judgment—

 

(a)is given in proceedings to recover money due under an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974(1);

 

 

http://www.bdl.org.uk/images/18_EW_NDL_Interest%20on%20a%20CCJ.pdf

 

But best wait until you have found the Order and andyorch pops in.

[citizenB]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?371753-Statutory-interest-applied-to-judgement-debt

[cdmonkey]

Looks like i have missing paperwork here

I have the application for charging order on land or property and the Interim charging order but that all

[citizenB]

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?295770-Charging-Orders-amp-Interest

 

 

Interest

 

 

If a creditor has taken the debt to the County Court, they cannot usually add extra interest once a charging order has been made. Interest cannot be added if:

• The debt is for an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act. This includes most ordinary credit agreements, including bank overdrafts; or
  
• The debt is less than £5000 in total even if it is not covered by the Consumer Credit Act
  

Regards

 

 

 

Andy

 

 

 

 

Hi dadof

 

 

Interest

 

 

If the creditor has taken the debt to the county court, they may be able to add extra interest once a charging order is made. Interest cannot be added if:

 

• the debt is for an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act. This includes most ordinary credit agreements, including bank overdrafts; or
  
• the debt is less than £5,000 in total, even if it is not covered by the Consumer Credit Act.
  

Information If the debt is more than £5,000 and not covered by the Consumer Credit Act, then interest is set by the court and runs at a standard rate.

 

 

 

Fact sheet We have a fact sheet on

 

 

‘Interest charges on a consumer credit judgment’

 

 

 

http://www.moneyadvicetrust.org/search.asp?searchterms=charging+order

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Contractual Interest

 

 

 

 

Many creditors are trying to argue that Charging Orders carry contractual interest after judgment even if the judgment itself doesn’t. There are plenty of arguments against this.

• Charging orders and their effect are determined by the Charging Order Act 1979
  

Section 1 COA says that a Charging Order is made ‘for the purposes of enforcing that judgment or order’ and that the charge is for ‘securing the payment of any money due or to become due under a judgment or order’. Although enforcement of a Charging Order is not execution of a judgment, s1 means that the order and the judgment must be coextensive. Therefore no money can be recovered in excess of what is due or to become due under the judgment.

• Section 3(4) opens with the words ‘Subject to the provisions of this ACT…’ and so unless the interest is due under the judgment or order under the Interest on County Court Judgements Order, it cannot be included in the Charging Order
  
• The amount of interest depends on the amount of interest due on the judgment.
  
• Some CCA regulated agreement judgements do not have an interest post-judgment clause.
  
• Even if there is an interest post-judgement clause on a CCA regulated agreement the lender still cannot enforce these rights by levying contractual interest – unless that rate forms part of the judgment, the lender would have to bring separated action for the interest. (Supreme Court Practice 1999 Ed. Para 42/1/24 and Re European Central Railway 1877 4 Ch.D.33
  
• The claimant may try to use s3(4) COA to claim that an equitable charge attracts interest on the principle sum. However, the rate of interest payable under an equitable charge depends on its terms. In the case of a CO, the judgment debt would be in essence the principle sum. The rate payable on this sum is prescribed by statute or set out in the judgment. S3(4) wouldn’t justify applying a different rate.
  

[cdmonkey]

This is the interim charging order but i think terms are same for final charging order,

The worrying bit is "with any further interest becoming due and the costs of the application"

 

I have attached the redacted CO

 

Thanks

[citizenB]

Many thanks for popping that up. I am sure andyorch will look in as soon as he can

[citizenB]

What was the amount of the Judgment Debt.. above or below £5,000

 

Charging Orders are not connected to any financial amount nor can they add interest....its the judgment that governs all payments.

 

If you look at the last quote that I posted up in post # 8. I think that gives you sufficient ammunition to argue back.

 

Have you been making payments off the original judgment ? It is a shame you don't have a copy of that.

[cdmonkey]

The CCJ was for £12k

 

Payments have been made but stopped when i discovered the interest added was outstripping payments, and i tried to resolve why.

 

no i dont have the a copy of the CCJ

[Seminole]

Contact the court. They may tell you over the phone and they should be able to send you a copy of the judgment.

[cdmonkey]

Hi tried this already

The original County court has closed and all cases transferred to a new one.

They have said all records are destroyed after 3 years if no activity so they cannot give me a copy

[Seminole]

That's astonishing.

 

Others may be able to confirm this but I think you can insist that the claimant provides you with a stamped copy of the judgment. This is certainly the case if the judgment is more than six years old and no effort at enforcement has been made. Obviously this isn't the case here but it may be worth asking the claimant or their solicitor for a copy. You will be able to check that it is genuine by ensuring that it is stamped by the court.

[cdmonkey]

Think i may have found the judgement

 

 

 

I have redacted and attached

 

 

 

Thanks

[AndyOrch]

" and interest to date of judgment "

 

and " if Judgment is 5K or more or is in respect of a debt which attracts contractual or statuary interest for late payment.the Claimant

may be entitled to further interest " Subject to terms and conditions of the agreement

 

Regards

 

Andy

[cdmonkey]

Sorry for being bit slow so does this mean they are allowed to charge interest on a charging order or not ?

 

thanks

[AndyOrch]

You mean allowed to charge interest on a County Court Judgment...a Charging Order has no significant financial value its just a means to secure the judgment.

 

 

The judgment states to date of judgment IE 13th Oct 2007. But if the T&Cs of the agreement state they can apply either contractual or statuary interest for late payment after judgment then yes they can.So check your T&Cs now.

[cdmonkey]

Ok thanks for clarifying