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    • thanks for your kind words ,  its the procedural stuff i worry about   technical stuff that can affect outcomes because of my inexperience   skeleton arguments, to be done cost schedules informing court how long i think it will take etc.    for instance their solicitor has asked for some emails between me and my loan broker - well after disclosure. i havent disclosed these ( they are privileged) and i have written them in the privileged box - only three emails anyway   but should i just provide to him as i actually want to present in court myself , and letting them have them actually discloses  them so they become admissable  or ignore?   also costs- mine arent too high   but what is fast track going to cost me in a situation where i lose.   i know court fees capped at 1650 but what if their solicitor bill is 20k-    i have managed to include all the way through their failings of pre action haste to litigation letters offers to settle subject to costs- i would nt feel so bad if all i was fighting was the court claim amount.
    • Yes you can.....you appear to have a good understanding of the basic credit consumer law.....possibly impress the judge that you went it alone...plenty of Fast Track cases been fought and won by litigants here on CAG.   If you have the evidence...the argument....and the personality to convey .....go for it...think of the fees you will save not paying the barrister.
    • Hi FTMDave They initially requested £140 within 14 days. This has now gone to £182 after the initial debt collection firm took over (now back with CEL   The carpark had two options, pay-by-app and cash, we had n cash hence using the easier app. The app in the playstore has shocking reviews, im not the only one.   I wasnext going to get 'their hand' sent to me fromt he data controller, sending the following:   Dear Sir or Madam   Subject access request ( Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR) )   Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law  relating to myself. - All photos taken - all letters/emails sent and received, including any appeal correspondence earlier - A PDT machine record from 23/11/2019  of payments - A record of online payments made using the Google Playstore APP that day - all data held, all evidence they will rely on, and - a full copy of the PCN, NTK - a list of all PCNs outstanding against me and/or this VRN, and I will remind here that any claim must be for all PCNs, not several separate claims.   If you need any more data from me to confirm my identity please let me know as soon as possible. It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month. If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer, or relevant staff member. If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.   Yours faithfully    
    • You need to read some more and then some.......costs are restricted in Small Claims Track....have a read of the above thread...same scenario...and its getting close to a hearing now....squeaky bum time for them.
    • OK, we can help you.   A couple of questions first.  You blanked out the amount they are claiming.  Can you tell us?  I bet they have added Unicorn Food Tax to their claim.   Also, can you remember if this was pay-by-app-only car park, or if there were other payment methods?
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    • Hi @BankFodder
      Sorry for only updating you now, but after your guidance with submitting the claim it was pretty straight forward and I didn't want to unnecessarily waste your time. Especially with this guide you wrote here, so many thanks for that
      So I issued the claim on day 15 and they requested more time to respond.
      They took until the last day to respond and denied the claim, unsurprisingly saying my contract was with Packlink and not with them.
       
      I opted for mediation, and it played out very similarly to other people's experiences.
       
      In the first call I outlined my case, and I referred to the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 as the reason to why I do in fact have a contract with them. 
       
      In the second call the mediator came back with an offer of the full amount of the phone and postage £146.93, but not the court costs. I said I was not willing to accept this and the mediator came across as a bit irritated that I would not accept this and said I should be flexible. I insisted that the law was on my side and I was willing to take them to court. The mediator went back to Hermes with what I said.
       
      In the third call the mediator said that they would offer the full amount. However, he said that Hermes still thought that I should have taken the case against Packlink instead, and that they would try to recover the court costs themselves from Packlink.
       
      To be fair to them, if Packlink wasn't based in Spain I would've made the claim against them instead. But since they are overseas and the law lets me take action against Hermes directly, it's the best way of trying to recover the money.
       
      So this is a great win. Thank you so much for your help and all of the resources available on this site. It has helped me so much especially as someone who does not know anything about making money claims.
       
      Many thanks, stay safe and have a good Christmas!
       
       
        • Thanks
    • Hermes and mediation hints. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428981-hermes-and-mediation-hints/&do=findComment&comment=5080003
      • 1 reply
    • Natwest Bank Transfer Fraud Call HMRC Please help. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/428951-natwest-bank-transfer-fraud-call-hmrc-please-help/&do=findComment&comment=5079786
      • 31 replies
    • Hermes lost parcel.. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/422615-hermes-lost-parcel/
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hi i'm new here and i wondered if anyone could help me understand what more i can do to win my esa appeal...?

i was sent a form last year to attend an atos" medical"...and because my condition is ocd, depression, trauma, and other issues... i forgot about this letter...later it was arranged i attend a so called medical..i had a support worker but when i made my way to the "medical" my support workker was not at the waiting area..and i was called in promptly...during this interview with a so called nurse... i was asked questions not relevant to mental ill health..she askked me nothing much that i could expand on... only how i spent my days? did i drink? at that time i did drink maybe 8 can strong lager per week...now i dont drink at all... i told her i slept a lot...but she worded it in a way to say i was so lazy spent my time in bed...it made me very angry as she is unjustly labelling me a scrounger!anyway to cut this shorter...she also asked if i had a dog... which i do have, a small spaniel..(my only company) i live alone here with no friends..or family...anyway... after this fiasco...i mobiled rather texted my support worker to find where she was... and she was just on her way.. and i said i had left the building...needless to say when i got the report about this "medical" it was not in my favour...that woman twisted every single answer to her loaded questions... she implied because i took a bus there (only 10 mins away) by bus... that i was ok... not a threat to the work place...and that i had a dog.. which i could let out to the toilet by myself... so i'm fit... but my problems are mental...and she didnt even mention my drinking... it was totaly fabricated to suit her own ends... currently i am appealing... i sent a long letter and doc sent a note and i have med certificates to cover me for 6 months... but i know will be renewed upon request..i also got a therapist to write... since this (august 2012)thats date of when i appealed...i'm still waiting but on reduced e.s.a...i have since been put into secondary care... after seeing a mental health team..with my support worker...should i be saying this to the dwp? im still awaiting this team of mental health people getting in contact... i saw them about a month ago... and they said it would take time to set up... tht i would get a care coordinator as well...is there anything more i cn do to help myself with evidence for this appeal? i had hoped it would be "looked at again" but it doesnt look like this will happen... if they force me to workk... i will be penniless i just cannot cope with that pressure right now and envisage walking out if placed somewhere...is there a time limit on how long i should wait for this appeal to be heard? any help appreciated.ty.paul.

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Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

I'll move your thread to the benefits forum, where the guys should be able to help you. There will be a short term redirect from this forum for you to follow.

 

My best, HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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has your condition worsened since you got the letter saying you did not pass the medical? the only reason i ask is as your going to appeal and have to go to a tribunal if the decision is not made in your favour once you have a reconsideration then the tribunal panel can only go off how you was during your medical and not how your were after it if that makes seance ?

 

if you condition has got worse since your medical they will not look at this during your tribunal hearing its based on how you was before and during your medical/

 

tribunals take take anywhere from a year to 18 months my sister has severe mental illnesses she waited 18 months for her first one then 12 months for her second one so they can take there time.

 

reconsideration can also take there time at the moment it can be weeks before you get a reconsideration there have been many changes to ESA lately thats why.

 

im glad your have moved over to secondary care though my sister is currently in this when you get your CPN and a care plan which will list all the things that your struggle with and the amount of help needed and the level of support they will offer you help and care you need from the mental health team this is always a good thing to have.

 

you can chase them up if you wish too though your GP but there is a waiting list to most secondary mental health teams my sister waited 12 months for her but that's not to say it will be that long for you it all depends on how long there list is and where you are on it to be honest.

 

gather ass much evidence as you can ( diagnosis treatment medication ) but #most of all how your illnesses effect you on a daily basis eg how you feel. what you struggle with what you can and cant do ect ect due to your illnesses the more detailed information you can give them the better it will be for you.

 

also do not go alone get someone to go with you if you feel you can answer there questions let the person with you explain in more details for you if you have CPN ask them to go with you on the day they will be better as talking and explaining if you have been refereed to secondary care due to the same illnesses send in your care plan it all goes to help you on the day

 

hope this helps anything else just ask

Edited by time4change2
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gather ass much evidence as you can ( diagnosis treatment medication ) but #most of all how your illnesses effect you on a daily basis eg how you feel. what you struggle with what you can and cant do ect ect due to your illnesses the more detailed information you can give them the better it will be for you.

 

If this was me, I'd go through the descriptors which apply, explain why and get my GP / mental health team to write a letter backing this up and if needs be, explain in more detail. (I personally struggle to explain myself clearly through writing)

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  • 4 weeks later...

thank you all for your invaluable help with this... yesterday i received notification that i have been refused any change in the review of their decision.. along with their reasons and copies of my sick notes.. and letter of appeal... i had informed them that i wanted that letter used as part of my appeal, should the initial review be unsuccessful..

so i think its now moving to tribunal phase..i am due to have a care coordinator visit me soon..in the meantime i had been receiving some help with practical issues from a guy from community floating support..he has phoned this care coordinator..and asked when she would be coming? i think he told me it would be in a couple of weeks..he has now finished with me and so i wait...

i note that the dwp.. builds their case only an 11 minute interview with this so called nurse.."qualified" nurse..i have made my own notes on the side and put "qualified" but in mental health? they have basicaly tried to strip me of all money i may have and dignity to boot... i take exception to this... yesterday i got blotto and tearful.. was very depressed and retired to bed with a splitting head.. this does me no good what so ever..my house is in squalor, i can not get my head together... i struggle to tidy it before this women comes..last week the guy from floating support took me to the cab and she phoned the dwp to find out where my case is..(she thought i had been awarded my claim) because my money had gone up a bit..but i wanted her to make sure.... and lo and behold i receive this decision within days..in meantime also, i received a long letter from a psychiatrist detailing my illness.. various illness' really, and i was rather loathe to send it as it is extremely personal and so,, i phoned to ask if they would cut it down a bit... is this wrong? i mean should i send all that personal info.. to a person at dwp? i had thought that i would present it at tribunal stage.. but in the light of this.. i am given to wondering what i should do..can anyone tell me if this tribunal is free? i thought i read online yesterday that the first one had to be paid for.. if this is the case im done for.. as i think they(the government) have sewed that up nicely too.. in withdrawing legal aid from people in these situations...this depresses me even more.. its a real nightmare... they simply want to undermine me as a person.. i will be penniless.. i read the descriptors and some of it is about law, they are using the law too and i know nothing about the law..they still maintain that i was able to get on public transport... and only in the last year or two i can do that, before i just couldnt... it was only a 10 minute journey... and my stonham worker(at that time) said that she would meet me to go into the so called medical with me... but i was taken in very early and my stonham worker wasnt there until i came out... what could i possably do? they also condemn me for having a dog... my only company.. i have no friends or family..and for using the internet.. especialy to order my groceries...they have no idea of my life at all..its misery..the psychiatrist says in her letter that i described my life(in september) as" a life of hell"...the dwp are advising tribunal to pass me backk to them if im unsuccessful.. but i am writing to them (the tribunal) for a "break" from their hounding .. as i already went through a break in my money a year ago in april..i dont think they have anyones best interests at heart here..except themselves.. this does my mental health no good at all.. infact i decided now not to go out much, i feel i'm being watched..they even said that i have been unemployed for 5 years, when in fact its over 20 years... another ploy i feel certain.. to dismiss my past mental health probs... anyone relate to this? any advice appreciated... oh, another thing... if i get to a tribunal who can speakk for me? i had a case years ago... it got through all the stages and i won, but i never attended the tribunal.. i had a person from the law society helping me... because it got to a point of law.

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Hello there.

 

It's a bit hard to read what you're saying/asking without paragraphs.

 

My understanding is that the tribunal is free, if that's changed maybe someone will comment.

 

If you go to tribunal, it's best to attend so they can see you and assess you. Most of us have attended and spoken for ourselves. I took my OH, but he wasn't allowed to speak.

 

If it's mental health issue, have you spoken to people like MIND or DIAL? They seem to help sometimes now Welfare Rights are so stretched.

 

My best, HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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:cuchiandme:

 

Some comments on my understanding of your situation from what you have written:

 

Following an Atos assessment a Jobcentreplus decision maker found you were fit for work. You appealed the decision. Jobcentreplus have refused to revise their decision and sent your appeal to the Tribunals Service. The bundle of paper work that you received is your copy of the evidence, that Jobcentreplus intend to present to the tribunal panel, to support their argument that you are fit for work. If employment and support allowance is your only income Jobcentreplus will continue to pay you assessment rate until your tribunal hearing.

 

The next official letter you receive will be an enquiry form from the Tribunals Service to ask whether you want to attend the hearing. Tick that you do. You can change your mind later if you decide you do not want to, or find a representative to attend for you. However, most successful employment and support appeals are won on oral evidence from the claimant. Tribunal hearings about benefit claims are free and costs cannot be awarded against the claimant. If you write to the Tribunals Service for a 'break', your appeal will be 'struck out' (cancelled) and your assessment rate payments will stop.

 

With regard to the letter from your psychiatrist, I would accept it as written because you are going to need every bit of evidence you can get. Your care co-ordinator may be able to suggest someone who can help you prepare your case for the tribual hearing.

 

Sincerely, Margaret. :panda:

Edited by **Margaret**
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hi margaret,

thanks ...yes i think i will send that letter directly to dwp... perhaps i can avoid a tribunal..which is terrifying me... i read here somewhere where someone requested the tribunal at home.. i might go for that if it comes to it... with this coordinator when i meet her.

you see the care plan initiated for me about a month ago is only now about to be implemented..

the letter is dealing with a meeting at my home that i had with the psychiatrist at beginning september...and my appeal began at the end of august... so she is treating with the period up until september which covers how i was at the time i was appealing ,if you see what i mean so i think it is valuable. She does say that she met me in early september and can only give her opinion up until then... and hopes that someone else can take over from that period.. so im just waiting to see this coordinator, meantime i think i will get my gp to write a letter also.

the psychiatrist mentioned that when she met me i had recently cut my arm... and that was because i had had the news of my esa being turned down...she doesnt say that part... but that was the reason..she said that i had suicide thoughts and that my life would be at risk etc..

on the other hand atos mentions in the report that i cut my arm and that they feel" it's regrettable that he felt the need to do this but it does not show that regulation 29 is satisfied as it does not indicate a substantial risk" . can anyone explain this regulation 29?

 

can you see here clearly there are two different ways of looking at my problems? atos simply sweep them under the carpet so to speak... their case hinges on the fact that i'm not agressive and present no problem in a work place... but i am coming from the point of view of , what will the workplace do to me?

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Regulation 29 is

29.—(1) A claimant who does not have limited capability for work as determined in accordance with the limited capability for work assessment is to be treated as having limited capability for work if paragraph (2) applies to the claimant.

(2) This paragraph applies if—

(a)the claimant is suffering from a life threatening disease in relation to which—

(i)there is medical evidence that the disease is uncontrollable, or uncontrolled, by a recognised therapeutic procedure; and

(ii)in the case of a disease that is uncontrolled, there is a reasonable cause for it not to be controlled by a recognised therapeutic procedure; or

(b)the claimant suffers from some specific disease or bodily or mental disablement and, by reasons of such disease or disablement, there would be a substantial risk to the mental or physical health of any person if the claimant were found not to have limited capability for work.

From here

 

So, it's either that you have a life threatening disease which can't be controlled by a recongised therapy or there's a risk to you or someone else if you were to return to work.

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hi nystagmite,

the last paragraph applies in my case i feel..

my issues are mental..

to be honest i feel that i should have put forward more evidence sooner.. my, well not my usual gp... only mentioned that i continued to receive treatment .. and that was sent to dwp.. now i have just noticed a letter that i can download from black triangle that allows my gp to counter the parts 29/35 i think.. my plan is to send my psychiatrists letter and this gp amended letter..

 

at the end of atos/dwp letter they are saying a return to work within three months is recommended.. i believe that i should get the psychiatrist to disagree with this.

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:cuchiandme:

 

You have nothing to lose by sending a copy (headed up with your national insurance number) of the psychiatrist's letter to your benefit delivery centre with a covering letter. Especially as it relates to your condition at the time of your visit to Atos.

 

Yes, I can see clearly that there are two different ways of looking at your problems but Atos assessors only see what they want to see. If you want to argue reg 29 burden of proof is on the claimant. It is certainly worth discussing the information on the Black Triangle site with your doctor.

 

Very few tribunal hearings are held in the claimants home. The usual reasoning is that if the claimant could get to Atos ......

 

Sincerely, Margaret.

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please tell me where to find honey bee's stickys? im not that long on here but have posted about this issue too... im stressed up to the hilt and i havent even had a date for the tribunal yet.how soon after the decision maker at dwp declines my appeal will tribunal get in touch.? sorry to use this thread .. when it's for someone else...:!:

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:cuchiandme:

 

Link for :honeybee13:'s sticky;

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?251737-Appealing-or-going-to-a-Tribunal-Some-useful-information

 

The Tribunals Service should send you a hearing enquiry form within two to four weeks, but it'll probably be months before you get a date for the hearing.

 

Regards, Margaret.

Edited by **Margaret**
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please tell me where to find honey bee's stickys? im not that long on here but have posted about this issue too... im stressed up to the hilt and i havent even had a date for the tribunal yet.how soon after the decision maker at dwp declines my appeal will tribunal get in touch.? sorry to use this thread .. when it's for someone else...:!:

 

Posts moved to your existing thread. If you have other queries, please post them here rather than gatecrashing someone else's. :) I hope you find the stikky and thank you to Margaret for posting the link.

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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thank you HB. and margaret, so sorry i gatecrashed, i'm very highly strung right now.

further to this i want to ask;

i know that i can appeal on the grounds that if i were found fit for work...it could present a danger to myself..;

well here goes, i have appealed on the grounds that the "medical" findings by atos (small a) were based on a series of misquotes and inacuracies...and furthermore the "exam" was blunt and short and did not represent authenticaly the nature of my illness nor my daily existence(they only gave me 11 minutes)i would say it was a rattling off of quick closed questions already pre-loaded so to speak.. .

Anyway, touching on what i opened here with; can i also say (and back it up with medical proof) that i am a danger to myself if i was found fit for work? i mean to say.. can i make that a major part of my appeal.. or will they base it on what i originaly wrote? hope this makes sense...any answers greatly appreciated..

I'm not wasting any time... i will now gather all my proof...my doc. was a bit miffed on the phone when i asked if he would do me a letter and if i could bring one that i printed from the internet..he said i was "asking a lot".... but it balances on a lot! i could be destitute..

can you believe, that when i had completed atos exam..i asked at reception if i could have my travel money refunded and she asked me "do you need it?"it goes to show they would try to strip us of every last penny... this a company with millions..profiting on misery... something has to give... and soon...

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thank you starry eyes for that link... which i just now read... and i want to try and modify to my needs...these sort of people only listen to this kind of formality.

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i have appealed on the grounds that the "medical" findings by atos (small a) were based on a series of misquotes and inacuracies...and furthermore the "exam" was blunt and short and did not represent authenticaly the nature of my illness nor my daily existence(they only gave me 11 minutes)i would say it was a rattling off of quick closed questions already pre-loaded so to speak.. .

 

Doesn't matter what does or does not go on in the assessment all that matters is do you fit the regulations?

 

I've always believed the assessment and how bad it is was always a ploy to distract you from arguing effectively your case v's the descriptors.

 

If the assessment was bobbins then that = complaint v's ATOS.

 

You have to highlight how bad it was to discredit it as evidence. That goes without saying but the I should win because reg X states Y and this bit about me evidenced here = Z has to be your main arguments and how you win!

 

For Reg 29 & 35 1st link in this post.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?390155-ESA-Reg-29-35-Arguments-and-New-Appeals-System-Factsheets.

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ty for that info. speedfreek,

i spent last couple of days writing a letter and gathering info. i never usualy use the phone at all.. but my bill is going to be sky high..i received notification in the post yesterday that the tribunal is taking up my case... headed crown services.. made me feel extra nervous... like i shouldnt be getting into this... i'm not a criminal... none-the-less.. i worked away, even wrote a letter to my mp..in london..i thought best rather than email...i have plans to see my doc on monday and am seeing a care coordinator, wednesday....also phoned to check out advocacy services... not sure which one to choose... i was wondering can i take in more than one support person?honestly i would prefer it at home... maybe on a screen.. as i'm bricking it...if i get cut off benefits again ..i just see my life as one long round of begging year in year out...i have learned today, that i can appeal for the maximum time period to elapse before they send for me again (atos) that is...and that that period can be 2 years... this would idealy give me a chance to recover from the hounding i have had since april 2012..therefore i am thinking that i will get the care coordinator to work out my care plan to present to the tribunal... so that they can see that ..i would need to be stress free to achieve my goals ,as it were.they cant expect people to be fit under this system of barbaric inquisition. i have asked my gp if he will write me a letter and also sign a black triangle letter for me.. i did this over the phone... and he replied that i was "asking a lot" but for me... its a lot i stand to lose, not to mention the misery if i dont win.. dont know how i will live or eat...anyways see him on monday and will see what transpires... totaly hacked off likke many others... my heart has been palpatating ... i havent been tidying up or eating properly and i see more of this in store if i dont win...the people should not stand for these tyrants and makke a stand... they wouldnt have stood for it years ago, revoloutions have been built on less.

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further to all this... i was provided with a letter very detailed,, about my conditions and very intimate feelings from a psychiatrist who saw me once for 4 hours....at home...now those details are extremely intimate because they concern the very nature of my sexuality too...i hesitated to send it to dwp... but in the end i rashly decided on impulse that i MUST...because i felt i couldnt have a chance of winning without it...these details ofcourse were never intimated at the atos "medical" its a whole other side of my psychology... but a major one... now i am so scared that ordainary office workers have a lot of knowledge about extremely personal info...its just added to the stress..does anyone think i was wrong to do this? i mean do these people at dwp have no confidential laws? i'm now so worried...

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hello all,

i posted on another thread about my esa problems... but i think people are overlooking questions there now...

so i would appreciate any help here;

 

does anyone know if i can take more than one person with me to the tribunal?

i planned on taking an advocate and possably my care coordinator... only i'm not sure if her opininion would be enough..in respect of noticing legal issues...

in my report from dwp... it cites one or two things under "the law"i need to be sure that the tribunal doesnt overturn in the dwp favour on a point of law.

 

i have been offered by one or two mental health advocates to takke my case, but i'm not sure which one to choose...these appeals are so scary, because you can never be sure that you get it all right..

Also, i sent dwp letters from therapists etc which have not been included in copies of my correspondence in their bundle of papers..can i use that against them? i mean i can present the correspondence addressed to them and say it is not in the dwp papers? please any help greatly appreciated

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I don't know how many people you can take with you, but I understood it as one as a representative or as moral support, either way the questions are directed at you with regard to how your illness/disability affects you. Re the letters to dwp I would send the copies myself directly to the tribunal and draw attention to the fact that the dwp haven't included them.

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Yes, you can take two people with you.

 

I'm really not sure what you're talking about 'things under the law' and your advocate, I'm afraid you'll need to be more specific about your concerns for us to be able to help.

 

You can send any additional info you want to the Tribunal, and should if it's not included in the appeal pack. But not sure what you mean by 'use it against them'.

We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office ~ Aesop

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