2003 Black Horse loan with PPI/fees - Court Claim from Hillesden Securities/Alpins.

[Chased2011]

Hi

 

I have received a county court claim for repayment of a loan I took out in 2003. The loan includes PPI and the claim includes collection fees ?

 

Is it possible to defend the PPI and collection fee part of the claim ?

 

Thanks for any advice

[Old Cogger]

better give full detaild on here so peeps can get an idea of the situation, list the contents of the N1 POC, but do not give personal info, onlywho is issuing and for whom etc.

[Chased2011]

Claimant is Hillesden Securities and the solicitors Alpins.

 

POC

The claimants claim is in respect of a credit facility 66*******,provided by Black Horse Ltd at the defendants request on **2003. The agreement was subsequently defaulted. Failure to meet requests for payment resulted in the account being terminated. On ***2010 all legal and beneficial interest in the monies was assigned to Hillesden Securities Ltd. The defendant was duly notified in writing of the assignment and that a balance of £3***.** was due. The balance of £3***.** remains owing from the defendant.

 

I have sent a CPR 34.1 and they have responded with a copy of the agreement and a statement showing interest collection fees etc.

 

I want to defend it on the basis of the PPI if that is possible

 

Thanks for any advice

[Feebee_71]

When was the last payment made in respect of the account?

When were you served with a default notice on the account - if indeed you were?

[Chased2011]

The last payment was made in December 2007 so it is not SB. They have sent a copy of a default notice dated June 2008. I can not remember if I received it or not to be honest.

[Chased2011]

I have to file a defence or concede by end of play Wednesday so any advice anyone can give in defending the PPI elememt etc would be much appreciated.

 

Thank you.

[citizenB]

What is the date of issue on the claim form, please? Top right hand corner of the claim form.

 

Your timeline is..

 

Date of Issue + 5 days for service + 14 days to acknowledge + 14 days to submit your defence.

 

Yes, you can counterclaim for the PPI and charges - however, you will need to produce a spreadsheet of the amounts you believe are owing to you.

[Chased2011]

Hi Citizen

 

The issue date is 27 Feb 2013. I acknowledged service on the 5th March with an intention to defend in full - sounds as though I have more time now though ?

 

Any advice on counter claim would be much appreciated - pretty sure now I can not defend the rest of the claim.

 

Thank you

[citizenB]

Date of issue - 27 February 2013 + 5 = 4 March 2013 + 14 = 18 March 2013 + 14 = 01 April 2013 (33 days from date of issue)

 

You would structure your defence along the lines of..

 

 

 

The defendant denies the amount claimed for the following reasons:

 

1. It is admitted that the Defendant entered in to an Agreement referred to in the Particulars ofClaim ('the Agreement') with the Claimant.

 

2. It is denied that the Defendant owes any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to:

 

(i) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for.

 

3) The amount claimed includes unlawful penalty charges andthe interest thereon which have been applied to the account by the claimant.

 

4) The aforementioned penalties are unlawful because they do not represent a true pre-estimate of the actual cost incurred by the claimant for each charge applied to the account and are thus unlawful under common law.

 

5) Notwithstanding the above, at the time of entering into the agreement, the Defendant was required to purchase Payment Protection Insurance as a condition of the creditor offering the loan. As this it is not permitted to make the purchase of Payment Protection Insurance a condition of lending, the Defendant will counterclaim for the refund of this.

 

6) The amount shown on the default notice and the claim form includes penalty charges. Since the charges are a penalty, the default notice is invalid as are any related entries or markers on any and all files held bythe Credit Reference Agencies and such entries and/or markers should be removed forthwith and appropriate compensation made available to the defendant.

 

 

Can you please post up a suitably edited copy of the Default notice so we can see if that is valid. Blackhorse DNs usually had defects in them.

[citizenB]

Your counterclaim - Part 20 claim would pretty much be a claim against them for the actual amounts that you believe are owed.

 

However, as I get a bit confused as to whether you are still the defendant or a counter claimant, I will be unable to help you draft that.

 

I will ask andyorch if he can pop in and advise.

[Chased2011]

Many thanks - I will post up the default notice shortly.

 

Should I submit the defence you have suggested asap ?

 

Thank you again

[citizenB]

Many thanks - I will post up the default notice shortly.

 

Should I submit the defence you have suggested asap ?

 

Thank you again

 

If the defence is suitable for your circumstances, then yes, you can use that one. If you feel you need to add/subtract anything, then you should do that. I have only drafted the defence based on what information you have provided. It might be best that you do nothing until you pop up the default notice so we can see if there are any errors in it.

[Chased2011]

Hopefully the default notice is now attached.

[Chased2011]

This is the second sheet from the Default Notice in the previous post

[citizenB]

Is the £amount on the Default Notice and the £amount on the Claim the same figure ?

 

That looks to be an awful lot of arrears, or is that the whole balance that was outstanding on the loan?

[Chased2011]

The default is for nearly all of the amount. I lost my job 4 months after opening and then went into. DMP but they refused to cut interest - was paying £25 - £30 every month but they kept adding interest of double that so went the CCA route and this is the first time its been supplied when I made the CPR request. i have letters going back to 2006 asking for it. The claim is for more as they kept adding interest.

[citizenB]

They can only ask for genuine arrears on a Default notice so if there were charges and ppi included (which there appears to be) the Default Notice is invalid.

[citizenB]

It appears to me that the Defence I drafted in post #9 will be suitable.

[Chased2011]

Thank you for your help. I will submit the defence and let you know what happens from there.

[citizenB]

andyorch has provided an example of a Part 20/Counter claim for you to have a look at.

 

 

THE FOLLOWING IS AN EXAMPLE ONLY AND NOT TO BE SIMPLY COPIED - each CC is unique and should be produced to suit the individual circumstances.

 

 

This is a typical/basic CC PT20

 

CASE NUMBER xxxxxxxxx PART 20 COUNTERCLAIM

 

 

The Defendant/Part 20 claimant claims sums paid to the claimant/part 20 defendant and HFC Bank Limited in relation to penalty charges Incorporated within the sum demanded by the Claimant which are sums claimed for their administration fees, late payment charges and like provisions.

 

 

The Defendant/Part 20 claimant claims sums paid to HFC Bank Limited for loan agreement xxxxxx in relation to mis-sold PPI within the sum demanded by the Claimant. The defendant did not want PPI But the salesperson insisted the loan would be declined without it.

 

 

Loan agreement xxxxxx was a refinance of an older loan agreement xxxxxxxx of which the defendant was mis-sold PPI Also. The defendant was told told that his application would be refused if he did not also buy a PPI policy. The defendant failed to obtain details for this agreement by way of Subject access request to HFC Bank Limited as they quote that it is over six years old and no longer held on their systems. The defendant cannot determine a figure for the mis-sold PPI on loan agreement xxxxxxx so would like to ask the court to make decision on how much can be reclaimed.

 

 

Loan agreement xxxxxx was a refinance of loan agreement xxxxxxx but no early settlement rebate was calculated and deducted so the defendant was charged too much for the refinancing.

 

The defendant paid the full sum remaining of loan agreement xxxxx with no PPI rebate also, totalling £XXXXXXX.

 

 

And the defendant/Part 20 Claimant claims;

 

(a) the sum of £XXXXX for unfair charges plus compound interest of 31.80%APR, totalling £XXXX.XX

 

 

(b) PPI reclaim for agreement xxxxxx totalling £XXX.XX.

 

 

© PPI reclaim for agreement xxxxxx, the sum to the Courts Discretion.

 

 

© Interest pursuant to section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum or up until judgement.

 

 

(d) Costs in the Case (Fast Track)

 

 

Statement of Truth

 

 

I, the Defendant/PT 20 Claimant believe that the facts stated in this Defence and Counter claim are true.

 

CPR for further guidance http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part20

 

 

Dated the xxx day of xxxxx, 2013.