Legal issue - Refuse to accept PayPal's new terms, but won't let me close

[hereigo]

Hello,

Well I really dislike Paypal, awful customer service, random money holds,

closing accounts for no reason, confiscating money for 180 days, and I could go on.

 

They seem above the law, but this really annoys me, I am essentially being told I have no right to ever leave pay-pal, So I will forever be bound to their agreements, however they are changed.

 

They have sent me their updated terms, which basically add even more powers to Paypal, including sharing information with everyone on the planet. so it says if you do not agree with these terms, close your account..

 

So I go to do this, and I am told due to my limitation (which was for no valid reason, but that is another story) I cannot close my account until I have fully restored my account access... but paypal make it clear they will never restore my account.

This can't be legal? Surely consumers should always have the right to close an account, and to refuse to accept new terms. there are also no ebay sales or any transactions that could be reversed or pose any risk in that sense.

 

This must be illegal and abuse of a loophole on so many levels? ... instead of closing an account they put it into indefinate limited access. what can be done?

To add insult to injury, they won't even let me ask on the official forum,

since they have limited the account. Talk about suppressing peoples freedom. Really hope these cowboys are held to account,

 

So annoyed with what they get away with, CAG should not use them to accept donations on principle of what they do to people (look it up online literally millions have been conned) there should also be a webwallet section. Thanks

 

https://cms.paypal.com/uk/cgi-bin/?&cmd=_render-content&content_ID=ua/upcoming_policies_full

[ericsbrother]

have you been money laundering? If so they cannot release your funds. Ask CIFAS if you have any flags on your name, address or accounts and explain the problem. If they are involved they should be able to correct any errors. If still nothing then look up their UK registered address and write to them citing breach of contract and give them time to release you funds to your bank account without penalty. If they dont oblige then report them to the FSA.

[hereigo]

Hi, money laundering? no,There are no flags on my name. don't quite see how that fits in with anything?. Thanks for the reply though.

 

To be clear, I don't have any funds in pay-pal, and there was no reason for my limitation,no pending or recent transactions, no charge-backs, no complaints, just the standard copy and paste email, if they done it due to the fact I have deposited to a casino before,therefore they decided I am a "risk", or , I have no clue.

 

I would suggest anyone that finds that surprising investigate paypal online. Sadly many think those who are limited must of done something wrong, I thought that myself until it happened, it's then that you uncover the truth of how they operate.

 

Anyway, that is another issue, I do not wish to be a PayPal member, To be honest I don't care about the new terms, What I do care about is I have the right not to agree to these terms, and as stated in the email about their updated legal agreements, If I do not agree to the terms, I must close my account.

 

So my issue here is, it seems they are abusing the law by putting accounts into permanent limitation mode, removing the ability to close your account, and therefore your ability to not accept any agreements they come out with, and be assumed to accept them by the fact you have not closed your account...however it is not possible to close your account... this cannot be legal?. they could come out with an agreement saying anything they like, then claim it was agreed to because I did not close my account.

 

Thanks for the info though, from what I understand PayPal moved to Luxembourg to avoid being under fsa rules, I am not sure on that. Again, there are no recent transactions, and no funds on hold, or any other reason for keeping the account open, and paypal do not even claim there is an issue here.

 

We really need to establish how PayPal don't have to follow any rules? if this was a bank there would be hundreds of people bringing up legal issues and letters to send, is it just that they really are above the law?.It is the consumer action group, reclaim the right and all that, seems to not apply to PayPal.

 

I appreciate anyone that can bring back my faith in being able to have some rights as a consumer with giant corporations like this.

 

Thanks

[scotgal68]

Those emails about account limitations and holding onto funds? Are you sure they're not phishing emails. I get them frequently with an attachment to update my account - but it's not Paypal that has sent them. They look official but are from fraudsters

[howardb]

I totally sympathise, I have first hand experience of the monstrous behaviour of both Paypal and eBay when I was running an eBay business. In end I closed it because I realised that I could never rely on eBay or Paypal not to act unreasonably. What you have to realise is that neither company chooses to provide proper customer service because of the sheer number of users which would weigh down their margins. Instead they rely almost completely on computer algorithms to identify risk, and they amputate that risk just as automatically. The problem with this approach is there is no human reasoning in the loop, and their algorithms are frequently wrong.

 

Examples of this are:

a) Holding on to money because you are selling goods with a statistically higher chance of fraud/counterfeiting.

b) Permanently freezing accounts because you are logging in using an IP address that has been linked to someone elses bad account (Thats a nightmare to get removed).

c) Freezing seller accounts because you are withdrawing your money 'too often'!!!

 

The list goes on, it's all extremely inaccurate, unfair, unreasonable and VERY VERY difficult to correct, all of which led me to conclusion that basing a business model on eBay/Paypal was a mistake. I've walked away, but like you have several 'accounts' with ebay/paypal that I neither want or can close.

 

I should add that technically the accounts are meaningless, because I formed a limited company for them, which I have subsequently dissolved. eBay/Paypal will still try and treat them as personal accounts, but there is no basis in the T&C's or law for that, so you can safely ignore them if you have done the same.

 

I've posted on this issue in the past: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?349102-Are-eBay-Paypal-acting-within-the-law&p=3824527#post3824527

 

Edited March 15, 2013 by howardb

[hereigo]

Thanks for the replies, no they are not phishing emails.

 

Sounds familiar Howardb,

 

Yes it must of been one of those automated systems, my friend also got his account limited as he logged in while at my house, so linked the accounts, Completely disgusting. Also they fail to allow anyone who is limited to go on the paypal help forum to ask questions under the limitations section! very clever way of stopping anyone speaking out about their treatment.

 

In relation to agreements, there must be a legal issue here, they clearly have to send the email telling members they are updating

their terms, and they can close their account if they do not agree. so considering this, how can they get away with limiting accounts

forever rather than closing, therefore taking the ability to disagree with their terms?.

 

sounds like they are abusing the rules here, I will have to do some more investigation and find the relevant laws here,

I did think someone on cag would know which laws are relevant here, but seems when it comes to paypal no one is quite sure.

 

They do have a lot of personal information, and as their agreements contain an ever increasing number of people they can send my bank and other details to - I must have the right to not remain a member forever.

 

Thanks

[raydetinu]

I have had great help from paypal when being scammed etc. into paying what looked like good deals and they have held of paying the seller until goods recieved or not. all done on the phone and have refunded the money in a few days.