work programme after 2 years

[Mr.P]

duplicate...

Edited December 19, 2013 by Mr.P

[Mr.P]

Emma - With that Christmas thing kicking off next week, most places will be shutting down. Getting a resolution to your problem may not happen until the New Year.

 

I was going to send you a PM with a small offer of help...

[honeybee13]

Hello Emma, I'm sorry you're going through this.

 

Here's a link to the forum stikky about food banks.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?404755-Find-your-Nearest-FOODBANK

 

HB

[Beatrice Bee]

Hi,

There is a food bank near where I live and googled them to see how to get food if it ever happens.

Their website says that you need to get a food voucher from professionals like your GP, social workers or the police. Google "food bank" and the name of the area where you live to see location and opening times. My one says they provide people with food supply that lasts for 3 days. You may want to take your sanction letter and mini statement to your GP. Someone up here said that he got a £50 Tesco voucher from A4E when he got sanctioned and had no money so ask your Work Programme provider, anyone, who is still on the scheme. Good luck.

[Nystagmite]

Yes, apparently the whole world gets a break at Christmas, apart from the unemployed. My jobsearch will consist of the usual 'checked XXXX agency website for admin vacancies' which is all you can really do.

 

Actually, they don't. For at least the last 13 years, my mum has worked over Christmas. Same with most people.

[Emma078]

Thanks for the link honeybee13 I now know where the food bank is

 

Yesterday after I posted on here (coincidence?) I got a phone call from the council. They said after speaking to the job centre and them telling them I wont be getting a hardship payment until the 30th, they can help with food, gas and electric. They said I could have £20 for gas, £20 for electric and £20 for food and for me to come in tomorrow to pick up vouchers for the post office. They also told me if I needed food before I get paid I can get a voucher for the food bank from the ymca or citizens advice, I just need to show them the sanction letter. They said the food bank gives food for 3 days and can be used 3 times in 6 months. I was also told a church near town is doing meals for the homeless over Christmas and I could go there if I wanted to. The woman on the phone sounded really nice and caring

 

Today I went to pick up the vouchers, which are barcode stickers on letters, I took these to the post office and was given the £60 in cash. I'm really glad I got it today, my electric went this morning

[Emma078]

Mr.P thank you for your offer of help, its lovely to know a stranger would be willing to help

[Emma078]

I didn't like the idea of going the council to get the vouchers but the woman in there was really nice, smiling, and said hello. So different from the jobcentre where they make you feel like **** and I don't think I've seen any of them smile

[Mr.P]

Pleased to hear that you have managed to get the basics covered for the next few days. Hopefully, the New Year will bring better news. Fingers crossed.

[hatsanman]

hi everyone and happy new year. my partner/wife has been requested to attend a work focussed interview on 17th jan which is no problem even though they are a waste of time. my wife was sent a letter asking her to attend and i was sent a seperate letter asking me to give or not to give permission to discus my claim with my wife. my question is do i have to say yes and give them permission and if i say no could they do anything about this?. i am not on jsa now but have been put on esa since 17th decmber 2013. thanks in advance for any advise.

[Mr.P]

I think WFIs are conducted by JCP staff, not outside providers such as Seetec or A4e. You don't need to give the DWP permission to discuss your claim with anyone - If they were to talk about your claim with your wife without prior consent, they could find themselves in trouble.

[hatsanman]

I think WFIs are conducted by JCP staff, not outside providers such as Seetec or A4e. You don't need to give the DWP permission to discuss your claim with anyone - If they were to talk about your claim with your wife without prior consent, they could find themselves in trouble.

many thanks for that much apreciated. i really cant see how they could anyway as im still waiting for a payment on my esa claim which i put in on the 17th december but i suppose with xmas i should of expected a wait.

[Emma078]

I am now receiving hardship which is £86 because of my sanction, but I've not had a letter yet confirming this

 

I signed on, on Wednesday but because my advisor wasn't in another appointment was made to see her today. Today's appointment I have been given a jobseeker's direction that I will give DWP permission by 22/01/14 to view my universal jobmatch account. I have not been made to sign it and I've always refused in the past to allow them. The letter says the same crap everything else does: your jobseekers allowance could be stopped for a period of time if you do not comply with this direction. Is this going to be another problem now for me and another sanction if I don't allow them access

[jasta11]

You do NOT have to give access to your UJ account. The guidance is very clear on this - and your advisor will certainly know this. While you can be mandated to create a UJ account and upload a CV, you do not have to give permission to the DWP to access it. Neither can you be forced to produce print outs (though you can produce them if you so wish).

 

There's a thread already on here regarding UJ access which you will find worth a read:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?410211-Is-it-mandatory-to-let-the-advisor-access-your-universal-job-match

 

The DWP's own union - the PCS - has issued memo's to Jobcentre staff telling them they must not try to coerce or threaten customers to give them access. Document is here, from March last year.

 

http://www.join.pcs.org.uk/en/department_for_work_and_pensions_group/dwp-news.cfm/id/7CB27121-96CB-4363-944EBA40616465A4

 

A lot of people - including myself - have had the Jobcentre 'try it on' and try to pressure us into giving access, as the Jobcentre seems to want us to store all of our Jobsearch on the UJ site. Most of us don't want to do this and continue to produce paper-based Jobsearch evidence, which is perfectly acceptable under guidance rules. Only last week I had the advisor asking why I hadn't given access to UJ and I told them 'because I don't have to, so drop it or I'll report you'..she promptly dropped the subject..

 

Has your advisor issued this Jobseekers Direction verbally? Ask him/her to give you a written direction saying you must give access, signed and dated by them. This will provide ammunition when you make a complaint - I'm betting they won't want to give you the direction in writing and incriminate themselves.

 

They're banking on customers not knowing the guidance - and sadly, a lot don't.

Edited January 13, 2014 by jasta11

[Emma078]

Thanks for that - they are always trying it on.

It has been printed out in a letter and given to me with my next interview date and time which is not with my advisor, its someone else i'm to see?

She hasn't signed it either, but i think she was writing it on the computer that she had given me this lettter

[jasta11]

I've checked up on the DWP site and a few other sites and can find no evidence of any changes to the guidance saying that we now have to grant access.

 

I'd be interested in what she's actually written on her computer - she'd have to be careful or else it would incriminate her for not following guidelines. I'd definitely ask her to sign that JS Direction..afer all, if it's legal what has she to fear?

 

I'd print out the official guidance from links in the other thread - especially Chapter 3 of the Universal Jobmatch Toolkit, which mentions several times that advisors can't make you give access - and show it to her when you next go in, telling her you'll take it up with her District Manager, her Union (who will definitely want to know about staff not following guidelines), and the Data Protection Act people. Hopefully she'll get the message.

 

Also remind her that, under the same guidance - Chapter 3, Paragraph 49 - she's supposed to put a note on your claim that you haven't given access permission. This is to prevent advisors constantly asking you about it all the time - which they often do and it can get pretty annoying. I'm convinced they're being told by their managers to pressure people into giving access.

[Mr.P]

Today's appointment I have been given a jobseeker's direction that I will give DWP permission by 22/01/14 to view my universal jobmatch account.

 

Emma078 - Pleased to see that you managed to survive the Christmas shutdown, even if it was a hard time for you. On to the JSD.

 

You need to make a photocopy of the JSD and send it to a Decision Maker (I suspect you already have the address for them). Insist that they review the direction taking in to account Decision makers’ guide, Volume 6, Chapter 34, paragraph 34912 (on pages 199 & 200)

Issuing a JSD to mandate JSA claimants to create a profile and public CV in Universal Jobmatch

 

34912:

Only when it has been explained to a claimant the benefits of creating a UJ Account and public CV in UJ and they refuse, can a claimant be mandated to create a profile and public CV. A JSD to create a profile and public CV can only be made if a DWP IAD service is reasonably available to the claimant should they need to use one.

 

Note: A JSD cannot be issued to mandate a claimant to give JCP access to their UJ account, this is a voluntary action by the claimant.

 

Reading some of the other paragraphs of the DM guidance, I found this on page 67:

 

34247 Bullying and harassment can be defined as any unwanted behaviour that makes someone feel intimidated, degraded, humiliated or offended. This may happen in the workplace between two individuals or involve groups of people and may be obvious or subtle. It may be persistent or an isolated incident that can occur in written communications, by phone or through email or text, as well as face-to-face. The method of bullying or harassment are manifold, and could include for example

1. spreading malicious rumours, or insulting someone

2. exclusion or victimisation

3. unfair treatment

4. deliberately undermining a competent worker by constant criticism.

 

This is under the heading of "Just Cause" and would appear to fit the bill in challenging the sanction that has been imposed upon you. I'd suggest asking for another mandatory reconsideration and that they take in to account the statement from your friend that originally accompanied you to the shop where you were subjected to abuse.

 

Good luck.

[Chester6]

is it true they may just resend you on the wp after the pwp nonsense?

[jasta11]

is it true they may just resend you on the wp after the pwp nonsense?

 

I sincerely hope not!!!! It didn't work first time round and it certainly won't work again.

 

Thought I'd post this latest - Jan 13th - FOI response as it's a classic case of the clever wordplay used by the DWP, as well as double-standards (which they're equally skilled at!)

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/191645/response/470258/attach/3/FoI%2022%20reply.pdf

 

Basically it's saying that, because the DWP display notices informing customers of the use of CCTV this means that merely by walking into the building you are giving implied consent for them to record you. Naturally though, if we wanted to record them it's a whole different ball game.

 

So maybe we should all print - in MICROSCOPIC font and in an obscure corner on our Jobsearch sheets - the phrase 'Interview recording in place', then they would also be giving implied consent for us to record.

 

On second thoughts..let's just record them covertly as we usually do

[Tj rodgers]

is it true they may just resend you on the wp after the pwp nonsense?

No they arnt sending anybody back to work program because of the New Scheme coming into play which is similar to the mandatary works scheme (MWS) For Everybody who has been claiming jsa for 3 years or more basically it is still being drawn up but MWS was either a period Of 6 Weeks Mandatary Voluntary Work Full time (30 hours a week) or 12 Weeks Part Time Mandatary Work Placement (3 Days per week plus 1 day for Job Search - Depending on your needs and placements depending on what is available in your area so it could be doing various roles from charity shop work to litter picking or bag packing at tesco- the new scheme comes into play 1st April 2014 and will replace Post Work Program Support any claiment due to finish pwps before then will have it extended to April 2014

[Mr.P]

Basically it's saying that, because the DWP display notices informing customers of the use of CCTV this means that merely by walking into the building you are giving implied consent for them to record you. Naturally though, if we wanted to record them it's a whole different ball game.

 

Ah, but the DWP clearly states that this policy applies to film and video recording. It does not mention audio recordings or even imply that it is not allowed. So carry on recording conversations.

 

You could hand them a letter withdrawing consent, implied or otherwise, for CCTV to be used to record your activities whilst on the premises - Don't expect it to have any effect though...

[sillygirl1]

Luckily for me I've managed to find my 'unique selling point' which is getting me work, so I don't have to deal with the inane Mandatory schemes.

 

Again the Government seem to be missing the point - real jobs which pay enough to get people off benefits completely are really scarce.

 

These schemes are basically there (IMHO and in others I've spoken to) to offer 'sweetners' to graduates to get them 'fast tracked' into management roles.

 

Good story from a friend who got shoved onto one of these schemes - first morning they were asked 'how do you greet the manager?' Friend said 'Good morning ME.' as he has nearly always been a manager. He was told at lunchtime not to bother coming back as he was 'over qualified' for the roles they were learning about! He got them to put it in writing to him just in case he got a sanction.

 

These schemes were dreamed up because the 'popular press' was portraying the unemployed as lazy or working on the side... so round them up and give them 'employable' skills instead of them milking the system both ends (but of course the government don't do that - do they - MPs with second and third consultancy jobs).

[Chester6]

But often the people already have the ability to do the job but no chances due to the demonisation of the unemployed thanks to the right-wingers scare stories and manipulations

[Beatrice Bee]

Hi,

Can not believe that they are mandating Ema to give access to her account just to extend her sanction with yet another sanction. It is just too nasty but they are trying it on.

 

I am getting ready to show them the print out of their own guidance, just the relevant sections, which say they can not mandate claimants to allow access to UJM account.

 

Today I saw a FOI reply [Aug 2013] which shows that the DWP is working on changing the current policy about their access to accounts and they uphold their right not to give info under a FOI request about the proposed changes because the policy is under discussion so it is not in the public interest to disclose it.

 

These days my new advisor refuses to sign my job search so what hope would I have asking her to sign a Jobseekers Direction she prints out for me. Will they back off if you show them the print out of the relevant points from the Universal Jobmatch Toolkit, Chapter 3, if you say you are going to speak to the manager and write to your MP to complain if they insist on issuing a Jobseekers Direction?

 

Someone up here says JCP managers really do not like having to explain themselves to MPs.

 

One thing to be careful about: Jobseekers Act 1995 states we have to follow directions provided by the Secretary of State [Jobseekers Direction] so really need up to date knowledge about policies whether they can instruct us to allow them access or not.

 

Remember that with Universal Credit the whole thing is going to be through the internet: the claim itself, number of advisers will be cut so we will have to provide evidence online? Very likely.

 

Hope the whole system crashes before they launch it nationwide. They written off £40 million because the IT system trial did not work: need new system for UC launch.

 

Click on the .jpg screenshots below for info / to print out for your advisor and hopefully avoid DMA referral upon denying access.

 

It does say that they can ask us to show print outs of our account so careful about that one..

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]48650[/ATTACH]

[Mr.P]

I am getting ready to show them the print out of their own guidance, just the relevant sections, which say they can not mandate claimants to allow access to UJM account.

 

I'd also suggest printing out the section from the Decision Maker's guidance I linked to (and quoted) in post #997 - If the adviser knows beforehand that a DM will reject a doubt raised, it would just be a spiteful act on their part to issue a JSD to gain access to a UJM account.