Dignity at work

[djgordyp]

Hi all. Firstly I would like to send my condolences to the colleagues and friends of Martin Kay.

 

I am after a little help with regard to dignity and respect at work. On Thursday I made a bit of a mistake and my supervisor confronted me about it a short time later. But rather than take me to one side and have a quiet word. He proceeded to talk about it in a raised voice. Beside me was one workmate working at the same machine I was. About 20-30 yards away was another work colleague. This colleague heard the commotion and came and stood beside us to hear what was going on. At lunchtime this guy was telling other people want went on. I know this because he was standing beside me when spreading the news. As a result I got some 'stick' about the incident. I think it was bad enough that the supervisor confronted me in this way

 

This isn't the first time I had problems with one of the supervisors. But that time I made a complaint but that ended up being to my detriment i.e. despite there being CCTV he followed me to the clock machine to watch me clocking out. Another day he called me to the office to justify why I clocked out at a certain time one day (the first time I had to do this in 13 years).

 

As you can tell, relationships with the supervisors are starting to break down. And that can only have a negative affect on my employment with the company.

 

I feel it would again 'not be in my best interest' to complain but can't allow this sort of thing to go on. I am already on tablets for depression and have had a couple of periods of absence in the last 12 months as a result. For which I have had 2 verbal warnings.

 

Thanks in advance for any help you can give

[Emmzzi]

Correcting you in front of other people is bad form but not illegal. I expect a complaint to get you nowhere.

 

Options

a) medical time off if not coping

b) ask him for a private chat about improving relationships

c) new job

d) ignore

e) is your depression bed enough to be considered a disability? Will it go on for 12 months?

[Lilythepink]

I have a DAW/bullying complaint in at the moment, I was off work for a year, but am appealing their decision not to investigate matters which I have witnesses and paperwork to proof the grievances. I am going for my second appeal this week to the head of HR, but I really don't expect anything to happen. I have since got back to work, but it has damaged all my confidence, and as I have moved offices, I don't even know anyone. I will watch this thread with interest, I too am on anti depressants and was sucicidal at the time. These things should not happen, and they damage you as a human being.

[stu007]

Hi

 

please have a loonk at this ACAS Link: www.acas.org.uk/

 

These PDFs may be of help:

[djgordyp]

Thanks for the prompt reply Emmzzi. As you could tell from my post I too know it will do me no good making a complaint. I still feel at a disadvantage from the last time I complained about a supervisor in 2010.

 

I'm not sure if the depression is bad enough to be considered a disability. I have been on tablets for over three years now. There are many times I felt like just turning round and coming home again. I have just started an OU course to try and better myself but that's going to take years to complete.

 

It's a shame they can get away with treating people like this because they know people wouldn't dare complain.

[djgordyp]

Yes Lilythepink. These sort of things destroy your confidence. At an appraisal meeting in 2010. The supervisor I had cause to complain about then, made me out to be the worst worker in the factory. And if other people don't have confidence in you then how are you supposed to have confidence in yourself.

 

@stu007 I have had a look at the DAW bill. Had I known about it in 2010 I think I would have took further action against the supervisor I was having problems with then. I will come back and read those other items when I get the chance.

[Lilythepink]

Equality commission, told me if the depression/anxiety lasts at least 12 months, it is a disability, and your employer is not treating you as a person with a disability. Shouldn't be treating you this way any way.

[Emmzzi]

I would agree that the depression *may* be a disability although only an ET/ court will decide that for sure.

 

Reaonable adjustments may be the manager going on a course to learn how to handle people with mental health issues, and some changes in how you are addressed.

 

I think you need an Occ health referal more than a grievance. I'd ask for one....

[djgordyp]

Is that more than just seeing the nurse when she visits. I do see the nurse from time to time. Although even though she says she will see me in 4 weeks. It could be several months unless I request to see her myself.

[Emmzzi]

You would like a full referal to take your doctor notes into account and make formal recomendation as to whether this should be treated as a disability and what reasonable adjustments should be made.

[Lilythepink]

I have been treated ok by my present line manager, and have had several meetings, about anything that upsets me, and anything that would make me feel uncomfortable, they are very aware that I have lost my confidence, and are willing to help me try to get it back... Work is hard enough without bullying and harrassment. My appeal is up this week, and i dont really know what I want to happen, except that I want to tell my story, and be believed.

[djgordyp]

Unfoortunately I don't have the same faith in my employer. In the incident in 2010. The HR manager said she would arrange a meeting between me herself and the supervisor in question at that time. A couple of days later the supervisor came and just said 'could I have your assistance for a few minutes please' and promptly led me in the direction of the office. This gave several people the impression I had done something wrong and was being disciplined.

 

In the meeting The HR manager had an A4 notepad in front of her. The supervisor told me to sit down (which I knew right away gave him the upper hand psychologically). The meeting started ok with him apologising if he had caused me any distress. But within a matter of a couple of minutes the whole thing was turned on it's head and it was all about me and the task I was doing at the time. I was doing the job the way he showed me but the meeting concluded with him saying that if he caught me not doing the job properly then I would be disciplined. I thought that was the end of the matter and had sorted things out. But that's when the things like following me to the clock machine, constantly checking to see if I was where I was supposed to be (intimidation in other words) etc. started. I went a couple of days later to HR to ask for a copy of the notes. She said she didn't make any though she was writing all the time we were in the meeting (she's not doing her job properly then). I mentioned the intimidation to the HR manager but she just said the supervisors have a right to check up on employees. One other thing. How can it be right in an appraisal meeting for a supervisor to bring up alleged mistakes that are supposed to have been made well over 10 years ago.

[Emmzzi]

Some things you say *could* be taken as bullying or *could* be normal to someone with a different state of mind. Reality? Paranoia? Probably a bit of both?

 

I would advise that occ health assessment. Do you feel able to do that?

[djgordyp]

I think the nurse should be in this thursday so I will ask to see her and ask about it

[san_d]

 

I feel it would again 'not be in my best interest' to complain but can't allow this sort of thing to go on. I am already on tablets for depression and have had a couple of periods of absence in the last 12 months as a result. For which I have had 2 verbal warnings.

 

Don't be bullied into thinking that it's not in your interest to complain. If life has become difficult or intolerable then you should complain. A good company should see a complaint as a way to improve itself, not as a nuisance.

 

However I wouldn't mention your depression. If your supervisor thinks you're "weak" he/she will feel encouraged in persecuting you. My opinion.

[Emmzzi]

Don't be bullied into thinking that it's not in your interest to complain. If life has become difficult or intolerable then you should complain. A good company should see a complaint as a way to improve itself, not as a nuisance.

 

However I wouldn't mention your depression. If your supervisor thinks you're "weak" he/she will feel encouraged in persecuting you. My opinion.

 

I'm not seeing many indicators that this is a "good" company?

[djgordyp]

You're not wrong there Emmzzi . We get a production bonus!!! on top of our hourly rate (£1 less than NMW). When doing monthly appraisals (which are never face to face despite promises that that would happen at least once every 3 months) supervisors can raise or lower your bonus on things such as reliability attitude etc. But one thing I do know is that you cannot be cut to such an extent that you fall below NMW. And me and another colleague had to bring this up with the wages department around September-October last year. The clerk only went back six weeks (some weeks were just about ok in that period but that would have been due to the production output. I mislaid all my payslips when moving home earlier last year. But still believe there where many other times when I fell below NMW. Sometimes I am still tempted to give HMRC a call. Emmzzi they know very well they can just lift the phone and call the recruitment agency and get any number of workers (mostly migrant) so don't give a hoot.

[Lilythepink]

Why would you not mention your depression? It is treated much differently now, than it used to be, as it is a disability. My depression/anxiety was dreadful, and my management contributed to this, always picking on tiny things. checking where I was. And after moving, they are still at it, they put me down as having uncertified sick leave with an upset stomach for a year. It was certified as workplace stress, and recognised by my Occupational Health. You can get outside help, ACAS, and keep notes, that is where I fell down, but managed to gather together a lot of proof, and people were quite good at being witnesses. Don't give up, it will only be worse for you healthwise, please don't get as far as I did, where I was off work for a year.

[djgordyp]

Thanks for that Lilythepink. And good to hear you're getting somewhere. I suppose I have never mentioned it to my supervisor for fear of it affecting any chance I may have of being trained up for other jobs (although that's unlikely to happen anyway). Or being put to even more demeaning or mundane tasks than I am now. I have however mentioned the fact that I am on anti depressants when in the disciplinary hearings I had. And at least one period of sickness last year the certificate was for acute stress. This however doesn't stop you being disciplined for absence.

[djgordyp]

And also, what if he decides to drop my depression into his daily chit chat

[Emmzzi]

I'd say "so what, it's just a chemical imbalance, I'm on medication for it. Bit like being diabetic, just affects me differently."

[Lilythepink]

You can fight back, don't let them win. I was suffering from PTSD, whenever I took ill, and it was the bullying and constant watching of everything I was doing, that I finally cracked. Employment Tribunals take this very seriously, and there are organisations which will support you. Are you in a trade Union, it always helps to get advice, and fight them to the bitter end.....

[Emmzzi]

lily, that approach works for some people; for others they want to move on as soon as possible. OP needs to decide what is best for themselves....

[Lilythepink]

ok, just trying to give some hope to the OP, as I am still struggling

[djgordyp]

Thanks for that Lily. And hope things are going ok for you.

Despite my supervisor saying he would try to sort the error I made before the department manager would see it, I was called to HR to give my version of what happened. Spoke to the nurse on Thursday about OH referral. Gave permission for HR to contact my gp.

 

Emmzzi in relation to you comment that you saw nothing to suggest that this is a good employer. Since the beginning of the year (since we got our pay rise) they have been deducting points from the production bonus of anyone who goes to the toilet.....or leave the line/workstation as they call it. And as these scores are only updated once a month. You are down money for all that time should you only need to use the toilet once. And worse yet. A female colleague has told me that when it comes to their 'time of the month' they are to let a supervisor know. There has been plenty of hearsay about this but I have seen no formal notification. Though apparently a notice had been pinned to the notice board.

 

Also, despite me and another workmate having to go to the wages department about our pay falling below minimum wage. I found out last week that they are still allowing this to happen. To equal NMW our production bonus needs to be over £42. One guy told me last week he is only getting a bonus of about £30. As far as I know there should be measures in place to prevent this happening.