Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Thank you for that "read me", It's a lot to digest, lots of legal procedure. There was one thing that I was going to mention to you,  but in one of the conversations in that thread it was mentioned that there may be spies on the Forum,  this is something that I've read quite some time ago in a previous thread. What I had in mind was to wait for the thirty days after their reply to my CCA request and then send the unenforceable letter. I was hoping that an absence of signature could be the Silver Bullet but it seems that there are lot of layers to peel on this Onion.  
    • love the extra £1000 charge for confidentialy there BF   Also OP even if they don't offer OOC it doesn't mean your claim isn't good. I had 3 against EVRi that were heard over the last 3 weeks. They sent me emails asking me to discontinue as I wouldn't win. Went infront of a judge and won all 3.    Just remember the law is on your side. The judges will be aware of this.   Where you can its important to try to point out at the hearing the specific part of the contract they breached. I found this was very helpful and the Judge made reference to it when they gave their judgements and it seemed this was pretty important as once you have identified a specific breach the matter turns straight to liability. From there its a case of pointing out the unlawfullness of their insurance and then that should be it.
    • I know dx and thanks again for yours and others help. I was 99.999% certain last payment was over six years ago if not longer.  👍
    • Paragraph 23 – "standard industry practice" – put this in bold type. They are stupid to rely on this and we might as well carry on emphasising how stupid they are. I wonder why they could even have begun to think some kind of compelling argument – "the other boys do it so I do it as well…" Same with paragraph 26   Paragraph 45 – The Defendants have so far been unable to produce any judgements at any level which disagree with the three judgements…  …court, but I would respectfully request…   Just the few amendments above – and I think it's fine. I think you should stick to the format that you are using. This has been used lots of times and has even been applauded by judges for being meticulous and clear. You aren't a professional. Nobody is expecting professional standards and although it's important that you understand exactly what you are doing – you don't really want to come over to the judge that you have done this kind of thing before. As a litigant in person you get a certain licence/leeway from judges and that is helpful to you – especially if you are facing a professional advocate. The way this is laid out is far clearer than the mess that you will get from EVRi. Quite frankly they undermine their own credibility by trying to say that they should win simply because it is "standard industry practice". It wouldn't at all surprise me if EVRi make you a last moment offer of the entire value of your claim partly to avoid judgement and also partly to avoid the embarrassment of having this kind of rubbish exposed in court. If they do happen to do that, then you should make sure that they pay everything. If they suddenly make you an out-of-court offer and this means that they are worried that they are going to lose and so you must make sure that you get every penny – interest, costs – everything you claimed. Finally, if they do make you an out-of-court offer they will try to sign you up to a confidentiality agreement. The answer to that is absolutely – No. It's not part of the claim and if they want to settle then they settle the claim as it stands and don't try add anything on. If they want confidentiality then that will cost an extra £1000. If they don't like it then they can go do the other thing. Once you have made the amendments suggested above – it should be the final version. court,. I don't think we are going to make any more changes. Your next job good to make sure that you are completely familiar with it all. That you understand the arguments. Have you made a court familiarisation visit?
    • just type no need to keep hitting quote... as has already been said, they use their own criteria. if a person is not stated as linked to you on your file then no cant hurt you. not all creditors use every CRA provider, there are only 3 main credit file providers mind, the rest are just 3rd party data sharers. if you already have revolving credit on your file there is no need to apply for anything just 'because' you need to show you can handle money. if you have bank account(s) and a mortgage which you are servicing (paying) then nothing more can improve your score, despite what these 'scam' sites claiml  its all a CON!!  
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

uk Protectyourbubble .Com - ** RESOLVED **


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 4009 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

A Clame made to @protectyrbubble for a stolen phone has been rejected!

 

Have a Police Crime Number, but they are not accepting the claim.

 

Has anyone else had trouble with this Mobile Phone Insurance Company.

 

As it is, it might have to be the small claims court, any other Idea..

Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be a bit helpful if you gave us some details.

 

I don't think that anyone in the world could give you help or an answer on what you have set out in your post.

 

...unless you are asking us a riddle of some kind.

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is my daughters claim that I am dealing with on her behalf.

 

Brief background:

 

She was in a Club last Friday evening. She went to the Ladies (which is a very small room) and she and her friend were the only two in there, apart from the Lavoratory Attendendant. She came out of the cubicle & put her phone down next to the sink, washed her hands, literally turned to her left to dry her hands. When she turned back, the phone had gone. Her friend was still in the cubicle which only left the Attendant. She went and reported it to the Security people and they went into the toilet with her and asked the attendant if she had taken the phone. She said no, so my daughter asked if the Security men would search her. They asked her if they could and she said no. They told my daughter there was nothing else they could do. My daughter used her friends telephone to phone her boyfriend and asked him to track her phone (she has the Find My iPhone App). He said it was showing as in the Club. She told the security men that and said she was going to phone the police. The security people then threw her out of the Club, along with her 3 friends. Once out of the Club, she phoned the police and reported the theft. She received a crime reference number. She then contacted o2 and cancelled the contract and emailed Protect Your Bubble of the theft (they are not contactable by telephone over the weekend).

 

She telephoned Protect Your Bubble on Monday (21 Jan) and explained the circumstances of her claim. They told her it was not a theft as she didn't see the person take the phone. She tried to argue the case that it's not always possible to actually see someone steal something, but they wouldn't have it. She then said if they didn't view it as theft, then she was reporting it as a lost phone. They said it wasn't a loss because it didn't fall out of her handbag or she didn't accidentally put it down somewhere!

 

I then took over on her behalf and spoke to them. I asked them if they didn't consider it a theft or a loss, then what was their explanation as to what it was? Did they believe it just disappeared into thin air or did the fairies take it? They said they understood what I was saying but it didn't fall within their terms and conditions (which are forever changing anyway).

 

I quoted their T&C to them as follows:

 

Loss means that the gadget has been accidentally left by you in a location and you are permanently deprived of its use.

 

Theft means the unlawful taking of your gadet against your will by another party, with the intention of permanently depriving you of it.

 

Either of those terms apply to this case. Their terms (with regard to loss) also say the gadget should not be unattended. Their definition of unattended is 'no more than an arms length from you'. Her phone was never unattended as it was never more than an arms length away from her.

 

I am now awaiting a letter from them declining the claim and I will then follow their Complaints Procedure.

 

This company really are a shambles. They twist words and definitions to suit themselves. They take advantage of young people who are attracted to their Insurance because it is cheap.

 

Sorry to go on - I'm actually fuming!

Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be a bit helpful if you gave us some details.

 

I don't think that anyone in the world could give you help or an answer on what you have set out in your post.

 

...unless you are asking us a riddle of some kind.

 

The thread was started on my behalf by a friend. I have now explained the circumstances :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

The way these companies operate is to decline claims when they are first reported. They then reconsider the claim, when they receive a complaint. So read the policy wording carefully and make a complaint in writing, sending by recorded delivery. The complaints address will be shown in the policy documents.

 

This is a theft and not a loss claim. Make sure it is made clear that the phone was only put down for a few seconds and any non attention in regard to the phone was only a few seconds. You really have to explain exactly what happened precisely otherwise they will try to decline a theft claim on the basis of not taking care to prevent it.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Link to post
Share on other sites

The way these companies operate is to decline claims when they are first reported. They then reconsider the claim, when they receive a complaint. So read the policy wording carefully and make a complaint in writing, sending by recorded delivery. The complaints address will be shown in the policy documents.

 

This is a theft and not a loss claim. Make sure it is made clear that the phone was only put down for a few seconds and any non attention in regard to the phone was only a few seconds. You really have to explain exactly what happened precisely otherwise they will try to decline a theft claim on the basis of not taking care to prevent it.

 

Ok. I did explain exactly what happened on the telephone to them and pointed out it was literally seconds that she turned away.

 

I will do as you say and see how I get on. Many thanks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You need to ask them to send you a letter detailing exactly why they are declining the claim, once you have this you can make an "Official Complant".

 

They cannot say it was a lost as their own policy says this "Loss means that the gadget has been accidentally left by you in a location and you are permanently deprived of its use" she did not leave the room before noticing it had gone.

 

They seem to have reworded their policy and it works in your favour as it does not preclude your claim.

 

Their definition of theft is thus "Theft - the unlawful taking of your gadget against your will by another party, with the intention of permanently depriving you of it." which is what has happened.

 

They are likely to decline under either or both of the following

 

"where the gadget has been left unattended when it is away from your home or, if the gadget is owned by a business, your secured business premises

4. of any gadget where reasonable precautions have not been taken."

 

Their definition of "Unattended" is thus "Unattended - not within your sight at all times and out of your arms-length reach" not the use of the word "AND" so assuming she genuinely had just turned around and it was within arms length reach she should win the case upon either making an "Official Complaint" or after this then appealing to the Ombudsman. The Ombudsman tends to look at whats fair rather than exactly what the policy says and there's a high chance he will rule in your favour providing the situation is exactly as you described. If she does comply to the phone being "Unattended" your chances are considerably less.

 

When you send an "Official Complaint" (Send by recorded) keep it short and concise and highlight their definition of "Unattended" and confirm that the phone was within "Arms-length reach" and they should see sense.

 

Do not be tempted to bend the truth, it's important she tells the truth.

 

This is the policy wording I viewed the first download of "Click HERE to download our full terms and conditions." in this link uk.protectyourbubble.com/gi-mobile-phone-insurance.html

Link to post
Share on other sites

OK. Thank you for your post.

 

If my daughter says she literally just turned away for a few seconds, then I believe her. I know her well and she would not lie to the Police or to me.

 

The phone was definitely never more than an arms length away from her and although she did turn away for a few seconds, I doubt she'd have expected the phone to be stolen as there was nobody else in the room, apart from the Attendent (who, being an employee of the Club, she wouldn't have considered a threat) and her friend, who was in a cubicle at the time.

 

She also asked if there was CCTV in the toilets, but unfortunately there isn't. I do feel the Police could have been a bit more helpful, but I suppose they have bigger crimes to deal with than a stolen iPhone.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The police are busy dealing with phone hacking...

 

Ask Protectyourbubble for a "Final Decision" in writing, warn them you will be making an official complaint.

 

If they fap around on the phone, remind them it was not lost as per their own definition but was a theft as per their own definition and if you would like their final decision on it being covered as a theft before you go down the route of an "Official Complaint" (It tells you how and where to write to in the policy) and Ombudsman should you still not be satisfied.

Link to post
Share on other sites

If they are declining the claim then they already know they're declining it so a letter should (In my opinion) take no longer than seven days.

 

Feel free to quote this to them.

 

"12. Creating extra paperwork

Requiring a consumer who wishes to claim on an insurance

policy to produce documents which could not reasonably

be considered relevant as to whether the claim was valid, or

failing systematically to respond to pertinent correspondence,

in order to dissuade a consumer from exercising his/her

contractual rights."

 

oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/cpregs/oft979.pdf

 

Unless you get someone with a bit of common sense who can see they're on a losing wicket, there's a good chance they will decline the claim which means you will need to go down the Offical Complaint route, they have eight weeks to respond to that so it could take some time.

 

Bear in mind they will almost certainly replace with a refurbished model of her phone anyway, so if she's desperate for a phone and wants the same phone buying a refurbed one or second hand from somewhere might be worth considering.

 

It's worth getting your daughter (Especially if she has a lot of friends / followers) to post on Protectyourbubble's twitter and facebook as this can often work wonders as big companies have their press departments monitoring them and often get someone with knowledge to look at the claim to try and protect the company reputation. They will probably have read this thread as most big companies with any intelligence have "Google Alert" for their company name which alerts them to any use of their name on the t'internet.

  • Haha 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you.

 

It's already been spread around Twitter and someone from ProtectYourBubble contacted me within minutes of me posting on there. I have been careful what I've said on there - I've only stated facts.

 

The person who responds to Twitter complaints is really just a pacifier.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Official claim rejection letter now received. No reason given - just an 'unfortunately your claim has not been approved on this occasion'.

 

My daughter has a lawyer friend who is compiling a letter of complaint for her to send, so we'll wait and see the outcome of that.

 

I feel this is going to be a rather long, drawn out process.

Link to post
Share on other sites

She needs to ask for a letter explaining why they are declining the claim, they'ye obliged to provide an explanation.

 

If they don't provide it you will not know on what grounds they're declining and thus how to complain etc

Link to post
Share on other sites

OK. She has had a letter saying her claim was rejected as 'the gadget was not within sight at all times and out of arms reach', so therefore it isn't classed as theft.

 

Absolutely ridiculous. By using this definition within their T&C, they would never pay out on a stolen item.

 

She has sent an official complaint written by a lawyer who cites a case very similar brought against Prudential Assurance. In that case, the Court found that 'to impose too high a standard (of T&C) would defeat or make illusory the benefits of an insurance policy'. The Court found in favour of the defendant.

 

I'll keep you posted. She has given them 21 days to respond.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Quick update.

 

She received a reply from PYB today saying they received her complaint on 23 February and will come back with an answer within 4 weeks.

 

How can they say they received it on 23 February when she emailed the Complaints Department on 6 February? I didn't realise emails took nearly 3 weeks to reach the recipient.

Link to post
Share on other sites

They have 8 weeks from the time you send the email ( plus a day or two for them to actually get it). Doesnt matter what they say, theyre the ones wasting time.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Update.

 

PYB eventually emailed to say they had looked into the case, and were overturning the refusal and were now accepting her claim.

 

She has, this week, received a brand new iPhone 4S from them.

 

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions on this thread. Just goes to prove, if you know you're right, fight for it :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Very pleased to hear this has now been resolved - well done for persevering :)

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...